Comments Thread For: Mayweather: Ortiz Could Lead To The Pacquiao Fight

[ronjeyd]

mayweather is using pac to sell his fight.

[MindBat]

all these comments and nobody is gonna mention how arum schedules pacs fights all b4 the one he has ahead is even finished? its been like that for about 3 fights in a row!!!

They had it all planned out for Manny to reign atop the 147lb division when Floyd "retired". Floyd knew Arum would move Manny up to welter while he was gone. As soon as he came back and announced who he wanted next, Bob and company had to scramble to avoid the fight at any cost.

Very few people know whats going on.

[Brother Jay]

Well let's put it this way:

Floyd Mayweather is the #1 fighter right now because he beat the #1 WW and is the #1 draw. Before that, Floyd was #1 for beating the best in every division except 1 because the champion wanted a 60/40 split. Floyd's legacy is one of quality of quantity.

Pacquiao is not #1 because he has fought for 5 vacant titles in attempt to match Floyd's multi division championships. The difference is that Floyd fought WBC champions for his distinctions. Pacquiao avoided any champions for his. Pacquiao was praised for his wins over ring worn Barrera and Morales, but once he stepped up and faced the guy they had both been avoiding for years, Pacquiao, he had to get help by the judges to win matches that he clearly lost. The rematch was even more convincingly for Marquez. Lastly, Pacquiao tried to make his case as P4P#1 by moving up like Floyd did, but the difference in the two feats is that Mayweather never used catchweights or used contracts to stipulate how much weight could be gained after the weigh in.

Mayweather fought whoever was the #1 champion at WW and beat them to make his case for #1. Pacquiao fought boxers ranked FIFTH or worse to match Mayweather's claim. When put like that, without the fluff or opinion, it becomes crystal clear as to why Floyd is #1 because of what he's done and why Manny is hyped as a top boxer because he's "so small" but won some matches against FIFTH ranked WW fighters.

Quality of wins Vs Quantity of wins.

Floyd took off 2008, came back in 2009 and within 2 fights had dwarfed Pacquiao's case for #1 by fighting better opposition. Some might argue that Marquez was too small. Then argue that Manny is too small as well, but by doing that you'll be admitting that Pacquiao has used special treatment tactics to "level the playing field", which effectively negate any legitimate claim to a top spot at WW or P4P.

[Jack Napier]

it should, but it won't
Floyd will never fight Pac
Ortiz and JMM will give both guys good wins and momentum
but Floyd will still refuse to man up
none of this is gonna change

[Manny#1ATG]

mayweather is using pac to sell his fight.

Of course he is! Pacquiao has been using Mayweather to sell fights for the last 2 years! Pac should probably throw Mayweather an extra 500k USD for the amount Top Rank has used his name in the last few fights!

[Brother Jay]

SIDE NOTE:

I'm sure that because many of you are fight fans, most of you will be familiar with MMA and the Gracies.

Well for those of you who don't know, the Gracie family innovated jujitsu in Brazil after learning it from a Japanese immigrant. They refined its use in no- holds-barred[NHB] matches called Vale Tudo. They were dominant for decades and Vale Tudo is the predecessor of MMA and the UFC.

Anyway, Rickson Gracie is the best fighter of all of the Gracie brothers and cousins. He is undefeated in Vale Tudo matches and is widely recognized as the best BJJ practitioner in the world. Its important to note for the purposes of this story that the object of BJJ is to bring your opponent down to the ground where you can nullify his strength, and catch him in either a choke or submission. Remember that.

Years ago, Rickson fought a man named Ron Tripp. Now this match was under the rules of Sambo and not Vale Tudo ... meaning that no everything goes. 47 seconds into the match, Tripp throws Rickson down to the floor and Rickson's shoulder touches the ground. No big deal to Rickson because going to the ground while grappling with his opponent what his goal anyway.

As it turns out, under the rules of Sambo, if your shoulders touch the ground, your opponent immediately wins. Rickson didn't know this as he's a BJJ/Vale Tudo guy. Unfortunately for Rickson, ignorance is not a legitimate defense and he was officially awarded his first loss.

Now since then, many detractors of the Gracie family have brought up this loss to point out that Rickson has been beaten. Truth is, Rickson has been beaten, but never in a NHB match against anyone outside of family's dojo. Rickson has remained the most dominant BJJ fighter in the history of Vale Tudo, but one guy, who never would face Rickson again, has touted that win as if he were fighting the best Vale Tudo fighter under Vale Tudo rules.

The point of all this?

Floyd Mayweather has been the best at what he does and remains undefeated. He is widely considered the best boxer, the most accurate by compubox and the biggest draw ever in the sport of boxing.

Manny Pacquiao, under special rules like catchweights, using vacant titles to make a case that he's broken Floyd's record as a multi-division champion, and targeting WWs ONLY once they lost to another WW and subsequently also lost rank and title, uses his accomplishment under those circumstances to make a case for being the best.

One is substance. The other is hype. One continues to fight the best. The other waits for Arum to set him up with banned cheaters and losers.

Rickson is and was the best of his era. No one touched him.

Mayweather is the best of this era. No one can touch him.

Tripp and Pacquiao must hold on to what they perceive to be greatness because they know without the benefit of special rules they would be just another notch on the champion's belt.

Pacquiao could have got his ass kicked back in 2009. Its 2011. Pacquaio was meant to be a congressman because his refusal alone is one hell of a FILIBUSTER!

[badass316]

They had it all planned out for Manny to reign atop the 147lb division when Floyd "retired". Floyd knew Arum would move Manny up to welter while he was gone. As soon as he came back and announced who he wanted next, Bob and company had to scramble to avoid the fight at any cost.

Very few people know whats going on.

Wtf are you talking about? Pacquiao was still fighting MAB at 130 when Floyd "retired." Yet somehow Top Rank was concocting plans for Pacquiao to rule 147 while he hasn't even stepped up to 135? Yeah, that sounds about right

PBF came out of his duck, I mean "retirement," after Pacquiao beat DLH. He perceived to what he most likely thought at the time was another easy payday picking on a much smaller guy. Plans changed though after the Hatton and Cotto fights.

[badass316]

Floyd Mayweather has been the best at what he does and remains undefeated. He is widely considered the best boxer, the most accurate by compubox and the biggest draw ever in the sport of boxing.

He may be the "best" at what he does (boxing), but that doesn't necessarily mean he's the best in the sport. He lost that title after his teary facade in the post Hatton conference and retired. And he hasn't gained it back since. On the contrary, he seems to be losing ground for the number two or three spot to guys like Sergio and Donaire with his "vacation" antics.

Manny Pacquiao, under special rules like catchweights, using vacant titles to make a case that he's broken Floyd's record as a multi-division champion, and targeting WWs ONLY once they lost to another WW and subsequently also lost rank and title, uses his accomplishment under those circumstances to make a case for being the best.

Catch weight's are special rules now? Huh... interesting. And for the record, Pacquiao has exactly one more catch weight fight than Floydie. The only other difference is, he actually honors his.

And since when did the most titles in different divisions ever become Floydie's? Unless boxing started in 1990, Floydie isn't the first 3, 4, or 5 division title holder. Even, if we started in 1990 DLH would have beaten him to the punch.

He only targets WW only after they lose to another WW? How does that even make sense. You mean to tell me that unless he's fighting an undefeated fighter every time out he really isn't fighting real competition? Do you even realize how ****** that sounds? Fighters near the top lose because they fight other great fighters. Common sense would tell you this, but I guess the concept escapes you.

This isn't a video game were a "Jonh Doe" fights his way to the top, while maintaining an undefeated record, and challenges for the title every single time. Miguel Cotto is who he is because he fought Margaritto. I'll always have more respect for a Cotto that has fought and lost to Margaritto than to one whose undefeated yet never bothered looking in his direction.

Pacquiao doesn't call/label himself as the best today. The fans, media, and historians do. Unlike the other guy, he doesn't retire when the road appears to be getting steep, or put the fans to sleep. He gives the people that watch him what they want (action) while at the same time facing bigger, tougher challenges.

One is substance. The other is hype. One continues to fight the best. The other waits for Arum to set him up with banned cheaters and losers.

Rickson is and was the best of his era. No one touched him.

Mayweather is the best of this era. No one can touch him.

Tripp and Pacquiao must hold on to what they perceive to be greatness because they know without the benefit of special rules they would be just another notch on the champion's belt.

Pacquiao could have got his ass kicked back in 2009. Its 2011. Pacquaio was meant to be a congressman because his refusal alone is one hell of a FILIBUSTER!

Once is substance while the other is hype? Yet the hype's resume is far greater than that of the substance's? Weird.

Floydie is the greatest of all-time according to his 20-30 fans. Everyone in the history books gets outboxed to a UD by Floydie. It's a shame it's a thought only shared by a few isn't it?

Keep drawing comparisons between mma guys like "Ron Tripp" and Pacquiao if it makes you sleep better. But at the end of the day, you always have to come back to reality. And in the real world, Floydie isn't the "greatest" of this era or any era.

[v.cassiusali@ya]

is chicken floyd using pacquiao to sell his fight...?

his fans will be disappointed come time to fight because he will never fight pacquiao...and he will never ran out of excuses for that...

believe me, after ortiz chicken floyd will fight anybody but pacquiao...

[The Big Dunn]

He may be the "best" at what he does (boxing), but that doesn't necessarily mean he's the best in the sport. He lost that title after his teary facade in the post Hatton conference and retired. And he hasn't gained it back since. On the contrary, he seems to be losing ground for the number two or three spot to guys like Sergio and Donaire with his "vacation" antics.



Catch weight's are special rules now? Huh... interesting. And for the record, Pacquiao has exactly one more catch weight fight than Floydie. The only other difference is, he actually honors his.

And since when did the most titles in different divisions ever become Floydie's? Unless boxing started in 1990, Floydie isn't the first 3, 4, or 5 division title holder. Even, if we started in 1990 DLH would have beaten him to the punch.

He only targets WW only after they lose to another WW? How does that even make sense. You mean to tell me that unless he's fighting an undefeated fighter every time out he really isn't fighting real competition? Do you even realize how ****** that sounds? Fighters near the top lose because they fight other great fighters. Common sense would tell you this, but I guess the concept escapes you.

This isn't a video game were a "Jonh Doe" fights his way to the top, while maintaining an undefeated record, and challenges for the title every single time. Miguel Cotto is who he is because he fought Margaritto. I'll always have more respect for a Cotto that has fought and lost to Margaritto than to one whose undefeated yet never bothered looking in his direction.

Pacquiao doesn't call/label himself as the best today. The fans, media, and historians do. Unlike the other guy, he doesn't retire when the road appears to be getting steep, or put the fans to sleep. He gives the people that watch him what they want (action) while at the same time facing bigger, tougher challenges.



Once is substance while the other is hype? Yet the hype's resume is far greater than that of the substance's? Weird.

Floydie is the greatest of all-time according to his 20-30 fans. Everyone in the history books gets outboxed to a UD by Floydie. It's a shame it's a thought only shared by a few isn't it?

Keep drawing comparisons between mma guys like "Ron Tripp" and Pacquiao if it makes you sleep better. But at the end of the day, you always have to come back to reality. And in the real world, Floydie isn't the "greatest" of this era or any era.

Your essential point is manny is the best because he is humble. Thats ridiculous. Popularity, unfortunately, is somehow a variable in who is seen as the better fighter. Manny is a very good boxer, but he isn't the best just because media members wnat the good guy to be the best. While that works in fairy tales it rarely does in real life.