Who do you rank higher as an ATG Pernell Whitaker or Bernard Hopkins?

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Sweet Pea....quite comfortably. Skills and resume both better.

[Steak]

And I find it annoying when posters mention a fight a fighter should have won to up a fighters resume.

Like okay he should have won. He didn't, live with it. How many fighters should have won a fight.


If people are going to do everything thing their power to make some one look good, like mentioning wins they didn't win, then i'll mention everything I can for the other fighter.


And Hopkins beat top 10 guys throughout his 160 reign.

thats ****ing horse****. If a guy clearly, CLEARLY deserved the decision in a robbery, Im giving them credit. I dont give a damn what 3 biased blind people have to say.

And yes, Hopkins beat some top 10 guys throughout his title reign. Not 20. In fact, I can list them.

Mercado
Lipsey
Allen
Echols
Echols
Holmes
Trinidad
Joppy
Allen
Eastmen
Ill throw in Glen for fun.

so half of Hopkins' defenses didnt matter. but, its still a very respectable amount of wins, hes one of the best middleweights of all time.

and also lawl at people counting Hopkins NC over Allen as a title defense and giving him credit for it.

[-MAKAVELLI-]

That's true but I've seen a bunch of his fights...maybe if I was picking up boxing at that time I would feel the same way as ya'll...

I think top 10 seems too high for Pernell if we're talking All-Time...Ring Magazine must have him right behind Sugar Ray Leonard, Duran, etc.

i was 13 or 14 during that time...it was way before the internet but i was at the peak of my boxing addiction...i watched everything and bought every magazine...while my cousins were buying comic books, i was buying boxing mags...i was just as in tuned with boxing as i am now and imma tell you, that dudes that Pernell fought weren't nobodies...these were legit contenders, champs and HOFers...throw a stiff here and there to stay busy but for the most part, its all quality...that's why i kinda had to do a double take on your comment about his resume being overrated

[-Kev-]

What was your scorecard for Whitaker-Chavez, Steak?

I thought Whitaker won, but I want to know your scorecard.

[-MAKAVELLI-]

thats ****ing horse****. If a guy clearly, CLEARLY deserved the decision in a robbery, Im giving them credit. I dont give a damn what 3 biased blind people have to say.

And yes, Hopkins beat some top 10 guys throughout his title reign. Not 20. In fact, I can list them.

Mercado
Lipsey
Allen
Echols
Echols
Holmes
Trinidad
Joppy
Allen
Eastmen
Ill throw in Glen for fun.

so half of Hopkins' defenses didnt matter. but, its still a very respectable amount of wins, hes one of the best middleweights of all time.

and also lawl at people counting Hopkins NC over Allen as a title defense and giving him credit for it.

oh the Howard Eastman bout...christ...that was painful to watch

[mushahadeen]

sweat pea greater skillz, b-hop greater accomplishments.

[Steak]

What was your scorecard for Whitaker-Chavez, Steak?

I thought Whitaker won, but I want to know your scorecard.

116-112, maybe 116-113.

[-MAKAVELLI-]

What was your scorecard for Whitaker-Chavez, Steak?

I thought Whitaker won, but I want to know your scorecard.

i worshiped both dudes at the time but i gave JCC no more than 4 rounds in that fight

[RubenSonny]

You need to take accomplishments in to consideration. Pea's resume is not far better, it's better.

Bernard Hopkins was The Ring Champion at 160 and made 20 title defenses.

This is a lie, he was IBF champ and made 20 defenses, he became lineal champ later on and made something like 6 or 7 defenses.

He went up 15 lbs to 175 in his first fight beat The Ring Light Heavyweight champion. He just recently beat The Ring Light Heavyweight champion once again, at 46, oldest man to win a major title in boxing history.

Yeah very good accomplishments, Whitaker resume at lightweight > Hopkins at middleweight and Whitaker resume at welterweight greater than Hopkins at light-heavy.

Hopkins resume is good, Pernell's is a bit better, but I see people mentioning who Pernell should have won against or who he gave hell to but still lost. Well Hopkins-Calzaghe could have gone either way, but it didn't, so i'm not mentioning that. One of the Taylor-Hopkins fights was very close, both actually, but i'm not mentioning that either.

Yeah and Calzaghe and Taylor aren't as good as Chavez and DLH, plus the Chavez fight was clear as day, the Hopkins examples weren't.

You can't call the Chavez fight a win (even though it shudda been)...if that's the case anyone could make an argument in a fight they got robbed...and the DLH fight was close but I don't think Pernell let his hands go enough late to win it but u cud make an argument

McGirt, Haugen, Vasquez are all solid wins but none of those guys are great fighters...

Nelson is a great fighter and a HOFer though...

Peas win over Vasquez is arguably better than any of Hopkins wins not named Tito.

[NinjaMan!]

Hopkins by accomplishments.