Comments Thread For: HBO Pres Unsure Why Mayweather Turned Pacquiao Down

[dan-b]

I have been reading your posts and frankly all of them
just been about you mouthing off about how you feel
and no facts to back them up. I guess this post is the
easy way to get out of actually answering questions
ask by others who actually know what their talking
about.

You see; the problem with people, such as yourself, who spend way too much time on forums and, particularly, on this subject have actually begun to believe you are in some way important and an authority of some kind. You feel people have to justify themselves to you, because you believe you know something the rest of us don't. You reveal your deluded nature in your post above.

I would perhaps afford you, and others, some more credibility if it didn't appear you wanted to lay blame at everyone's door besides Mayweather's. Ultimately, you can think what you like though. It surely dawned on you long ago that people have become so entrenched with this subject that any "debate" ceased to exist long ago. Now we just have hordes of fanboys hurling insults at one another, claiming to know what's "really going on".

The truth, probably lies somewhere in the middle. But, hey, what would you do with your time if you didn't have "your man" to defend, eh?

[GRUSTLER]

Seems irrelevant to say Arum trying to make the fight happen
wasn't strong enough. Did it even occur to you that no matter
how strong Arum wanted the fight happen Floyd was simply not
interested? This is like saying the blind date didn't work because
it's the matchmaker's fault.

Bud, let's just say Floyd wasn't interested and leave it at that.

I agree and always said that it was both of their faults.
It takes two to fight.

[GRUSTLER]

You see; the problem with people, such as yourself, who spend way too much time on forums and, particularly, on this subject have actually begun to believe you are in some way important and an authority of some kind. You feel people have to justify themselves to you, because you believe you know something the rest of us don't. You reveal your deluded nature in your post above.

I would perhaps afford you, and others, some more credibility if it didn't appear you wanted to lay blame at everyone's door besides Mayweather's. Ultimately, you can think what you like though. It surely dawned on you long ago that people have become so entrenched with this subject that any "debate" ceased to exist long ago. Now we just have hordes of fanboys hurling insults at one another, claiming to know what's "really going on".

The truth, probably lies somewhere in the middle. But, hey, what would you do with your time if you didn't have "your man" to defend, eh?

You can say whatever but still doesn't take away the fact that
I backed up what I was saying.

[Ragnar Lothbrok]

You can say whatever but still doesn't take away the fact that
I backed up what I was saying.

look at this captain save a Floyd. All you do is post other people's opinion & present it as facts.

You are so delusional its scary. Deadline was real. You know how?

Is floyd & pac fighting?

Fact of the matter is, floyd fought all 40 of his fights under the same rules, requirements, & testing his sport mandates. All of a sudden, negotiations start for the best fighter he has ever faced & he asked for a steroid test never done before in history of pro boxing against a guy with zero evidence of steroid use.


No athlete should dictate what test his opponents take.


If floyd agreed to fight pacquiao under the same rules, regulations, & tests his
sport mandates just like the rest of his fights, the fight would have happened the first time around.

It was floyd who asked for something extra.

It was floyd who didnt want the fight to happen.

It was floyd who went on another vacation when they tried to make the fight the second time.

It is floyd with the international/universal reputation as a scared cherry picking ducker afraid to lose his undefeated record.


DEAL WITH IT.

[dan-b]

look at this captain save a Floyd. All you do is post other people's opinion & present it as facts.

You are so delusional its scary. Deadline was real. You know how?

Is floyd & pac fighting?

Fact of the matter is, floyd fought all 40 of his fights under the same rules, requirements, & testing his sport mandates. All of a sudden, negotiations start for the best fighter he has ever faced & he asked for a steroid test never done before in history of pro boxing against a guy with zero evidence of steroid use.


No athlete should dictate what test his opponents take.


If floyd agreed to fight pacquiao under the same rules, regulations, & tests his
sport mandates just like the rest of his fights, the fight would have happened the first time around.

It was floyd who asked for something extra.

It was floyd who didnt want the fight to happen.

It was floyd who went on another vacation when they tried to make the fight the second time.

It is floyd with the international/universal reputation as a scared cherry picking ducker afraid to lose his undefeated record.


DEAL WITH IT.

I'm sure some of these fanboys feel they "lose" in some way by conceding some ground. This tells me they are not boxing fans as all boxing fans are losing because this fight isn't happening. Why fruitcakes are spending hours online arguing about this petty nonsense is beyond me.

[GRUSTLER]

look at this captain save a Floyd. All you do is post other people's opinion & present it as facts.

You are so delusional its scary. Deadline was real. You know how?

Is floyd & pac fighting?

Fact of the matter is, floyd fought all 40 of his fights under the same rules, requirements, & testing his sport mandates. All of a sudden, negotiations start for the best fighter he has ever faced & he asked for a steroid test never done before in history of pro boxing against a guy with zero evidence of steroid use.


No athlete should dictate what test his opponents take.


If floyd agreed to fight pacquiao under the same rules, regulations, & tests his
sport mandates just like the rest of his fights, the fight would have happened the first time around.

It was floyd who asked for something extra.

It was floyd who didnt want the fight to happen.

It was floyd who went on another vacation when they tried to make the fight the second time.

It is floyd with the international/universal reputation as a scared cherry picking ducker afraid to lose his undefeated record.


DEAL WITH IT.

You are a moron. Everything I posted came right out of
the mouths of the people who said it. You are just giving
your own opinions and emotional outlook on the situation
instead of backing up your claims. Seems to me like you
are more concerned with what Floyd is doing then I am.
Do you realize that your putting no blame whatsoever on
Manny for the fight not happening? If you wasn't a hater
or a fan boy, you would see everything for what it is worth.
Keep watching channel Zero.

[LeadUppercut]

As I said, I have no problem agreeing Arum is a liar, but I have a lot more problem agreeing that Greenburg is. I still see nothing in the article that explains Greenburg's statement that "To this day, I don't know why he wanted to take some more time off. Only Floyd has that answer. I certainly don't have that answer. But, you know, it was very close. It [meaning a deal] was so, so, close." That doesn't sound like he is referring to a single conversation and an immediate rebuff based on the terms of Arum's offer being appalling.

And not long ago, Greenburg also said quite explicitly ""I had been negotiating with a representative from each side since May 2nd, carefully trying to put the fight together. Hopefully, someday this fight will happen. Sports fans deserve it.""

So if the article is right, Greenburg is an out and out liar.

It also doesn't explain why De La Hoya said a deal was close at one point.

And it also doesn't explain why team Mayweather didn't blow the gaff when it would have had maximum impact, when the whole world was being told that negotiations were taking place.

I am not justifying anything Arum said. I am just saying that while he is a liar, there still seems to be more to the story than meets the eye, and that article does not clear things up at all, given the above.

WHOAH STOP DAVE !!

Greenburg was manipulated, like everyone else.

Read Marley's article again, I actually bolded the parts that answer your questions, you must have missed it, so I will repost.

And, If you really "have no problem agreeing that Arum is a liar".....

AND, you understand that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

Only to later completely deny it.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

How the *** can you not see what happened ?

You are not a fanboy, you are an educated knowledgable poster.....
so add up 2 + 2, and the answer is clear.

Negotiations did start..... GBP/Greenburg/ were fed snippets of bull**** to make it appear that Arum was genuine..... he put together a joke offer that GBP never took seriously, then fed the media bull**** for weeks, including a deadline, that did not exist.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

[LeadUppercut]

Dave, read this article again man - I have bolded the parts that answer your questions - and then make the connection between what you admitted to me about Arum (that he is a lying skunk, and that he has been doing this for 40 years) and the fact that you cannot explain this.....

HERE IS BOB ARUM LYING TO YOU.....
Nobody denies that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP, who forwarded it to Mayweather for approval. Then he placed a two week " deadline " on the table, even going to the trouble of putting a count-down timer on the Top Rank website.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

HERE IS BOB ARUM ADMITTING IT.....
Then, after Bob Arum's conference call, Schaefer immediately released a statement which forced Arum to admit that both him and Ross Greenburg had NEVER spoken with anyone from GBP.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

THE "DEADLINE" WAS BULL****, IT DID NOT EXIST !!

================================================== ==

Defending Bob Arum is quite hard for a number of reasons. He's a famous liar, well-known to veteran fans as a promoter that tends to totally exaggerate negotiations to ensure that he comes out looking holier than thou.

Team Mayweather wasn't even the first to make these claims. It's been coming out of his own camp.

Michael Marley, the day after Arum's infamous "teleconference," came right out and said it. This was days before Leonard Ellerbe spoke.

Marley, a Top Rank/Pacquiao writer, and a close friend of Arum's, was just as perplexed by Arum's deadline. He didn't get it; he couldn't work out what Arum was up to. So he went digging.

He spoke to his Top Rank people, and was shocked with the answer. Again, this was days before Ellerbe spoke.

Negotiation just hadn't been happening. They'd started, briefly, but capitulated almost instantly, according to Marley.

Marley claimed that Arum had only spoken to Greenburg once, months ago. And that conversation was little more than Arum telling him his demands. Demands that Golden Boy just weren't interested in.

That's basically it. No meetings, no talks, no agreements, no contracts, no deals.

Bob Arum, according to Marley, just spent the next five weeks "blowing smoke to the media," to try and confuse the situation and giving the impression that he was breaking his back to make the deal.

When in truth, Mayweather vs. Pacquiao was the last thing Arum wanted for 2010.

Why did the talks fail? According to Marley, contrary to most reports, Pacquiao was unwilling to move an inch on drug testing. And Mayweather was unwilling to move an inch on money.

Pretty predictable.

As another example of the way Arum operates, it also turns out that "Pacquiao accepting 14 days" was just more "smoke" as part of the Arum charade.

The original quote from Pacquiao was 100 percent fake. Arum has admitted as much. The second quote from Pacquiao was real, but for PR purposes. Pacquiao's manager denied it was accurate, when quizzed soon after.

To confirm the charade, only days ago, Arum was asked straight up, what drug terms Pacquiao had agreed to and he was unable to give an answer.

This is a man who had an agreement with Mayweather's people? He couldn't even answer what the supposed drug agreement was?

So what actually happened? According to Marley, Arum made these claims days before anyone from team Mayweather spoke out.

Well, Arum has allegedly been fixing a Pacquiao vs. Margarito bout in the Middle East for months. But he knew full well that he couldn't make the fight without being seen to be trying to make Mayweather vs. Pacquiao first.

Plus, HBO, after pressure from Golden Boy, flat out told him that he'd have to approach Mayweather first, or they would not work on a Margarito fight.

Arum, according to Marley, approached Greenburg with his terms for the fight. Terms, Marley suspects, that were never going to be accepted. Terms, that in regards to drug testing, were even worse than the last fight.

That's basically it. Golden Boy felt Arum was not being serious, and had no intention of negotiating further.

Arum played the media, and proclaimed that he was "waiting for Floyd to accept his offer." Which, I guess, was technically true. The big lie came with Arum's claims that these terms had been negotiated and accepted.

Marley claims that this is just 100 percent false. There were no real talks. No deals. No agreements. No contracts.

In a strange way, neither side is technically lying. Most likely, after taking legal advice, they've worded it all very carefully.

Arum claimed that he was waiting for Mayweather to agree to his offer, and had been dealing with Greenberg. The problem being, his dealings with Greenberg amounted to one conversation in which he sent him an awful offer, knowing full well it wouldn't work. No negotiations, talks, or discussions whatsoever.

Arum's offer. Countdown clock. Lots of BS about "terms being agreed by both sides."

Mayweather's people are technically speaking the truth as well. There were never any negotiations, talks, agreements, deals. Just Arum blowing smoke to the press.

Why did Arum exaggerate his efforts so much? Because he wanted to set up Margarito vs. Pacquiao and couldn't justify it without trying to pin the blame on someone else.

Golden Boy? Well Marley claims that there quite literally was a gag order. It's just the fact that the negotiations ended after about two days. You can tell when the fight fell through. Arum started talking to the media twice a day!

Marley claims that Golden Boy's position with Arum is to just let him talk, and not justify his claims with replies, safe in the knowledge that most of the sport world knows he talks out of his behind.

Arum could well find himself in a tough position, however. Dan Raphael reported that Ellerbe is not only one of the most honest guys in boxing, he's also been speaking to Greenberg regularly for weeks. These daily conversations have reportedly gone on after his claim that basically either Greenberg or Arum is a stone cold liar.

Which suggests to most that Greenberg agrees with his pronouncement.

Again, Marley is a Top Rank guy, and a noted Pacquiao backer. He reported that Arum's claims of "negotiations" and "agreements" were phony, days before any Mayweather person made any comment.

Mayweather's guy's wording is probably a bit controversial, and not 100 percent true, but both Marley and Ellebre are basically singing from the same hymn sheet.

Arum completely and utterly exaggerated all claims of "agreements," "deals," "contracts," and "negotiations."

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THE BOTTOM LINE IS..... EXPLAIN THIS......
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HERE IS BOB ARUM LYING TO YOU.....
Nobody denies that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP, who forwarded it to Mayweather for approval. Then he placed a two week " deadline " on the table, even going to the trouble of putting a count-down timer on the Top Rank website.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

HERE IS BOB ARUM ADMITTING IT.....
Then, after Bob Arum's conference call, Schaefer immediately released a statement which forced Arum to admit that both him and Ross Greenburg had NEVER spoken with anyone from GBP.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

[GRUSTLER]

I'm sure some of these fanboys feel they "lose" in some way by conceding some ground. This tells me they are not boxing fans as all boxing fans are losing because this fight isn't happening. Why fruitcakes are spending hours online arguing about this petty nonsense is beyond me.

Because guys like YOU, are trying to discredit, rewrite history, debate
and ignore facts without having anything to back it up. I would think
EVERYONE would want this fight to happen. You are talking about who
is a boxing fan and who is not but on this thread if you look back at
your posts, it was you who started beefing about Floyd by placing
the blame souly on him. Both Pac and Floyd share blame for this fight
not happening and that's the real scoop.

[LeadUppercut]

^Is this clown still trying to argue that there were no negotiations? Seriously?

And Greenburg is a liar because he has so much to gain by alienating his cash cow, right?

Stop it already. Everyone had a good laugh at Ellerbe's expense and then we all moved on once Ross set the record straight.

Let it go, it's over.

Stop trying to re-write history fan-boy, you are a joke......

" Arum could well find himself in a tough position, however. Dan Raphael reported that Ellerbe is not only one of the most honest guys in boxing, he's also been speaking to Greenberg regularly for weeks. These daily conversations have reportedly gone on after his claim that basically either Greenberg or Arum is a stone cold liar.

Which suggests to most that Greenberg agrees with his pronouncement. "