Comments Thread For: HBO Pres Unsure Why Mayweather Turned Pacquiao Down

[Dave Rado]

[B]Defending Bob Arum is quite hard for a number of reasons. He's a famous liar, well-known to veteran fans as a promoter that tends to totally exaggerate negotiations to ensure that he comes out looking holier than thou .... long article ending with ...

HERE IS BOB ARUM LYING TO YOU.....
Nobody denies that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP, who forwarded it to Mayweather for approval. Then he placed a two week " deadline " on the table, even going to the trouble of putting a count-down timer on the Top Rank website.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

HERE IS BOB ARUM ADMITTING IT.....
Then, after Bob Arum's conference call, Schaefer immediately released a statement which forced Arum to admit that both him and Ross Greenburg had NEVER spoken with anyone from GBP.....
http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

I have no problem accepting that Arum is a liar, but I have much more difficulty accepting that Greenburg is a liar. What's in it for him to say the following if it's a complete fabrication, which is what you're claiming it is?

"According to Greenburg, the fight was close to being made during both rounds of negotiations. The second time around, Mayweather turned the fight down without reason. To date, Greenburg was never provided with an explanation from Mayweather or his handlers.

"To this day, I don't know why he wanted to take some more time off. Only Floyd has that answer. I certainly don't have that answer. But, you know, it was very close. It was so, so, close. I think that it was so close that I don't think that it's going to take much to make the fight the third time around.""

Also, De La Hoya said in the middle of the "negotiations" that he thought a deal was close, and has never properly explained that statement.

And finally, why on earth didn't someone from team Mayweather blow the gaffe while the "negotiations" were getting so much national and international publicity? Why on earth did they wait until after the "deadline" had passed before saying a word? At the least that is very odd behaviour.

[danny711]

I have no problem accepting that Arum is a liar, but I have much more difficulty accepting that Greenburg is a liar. What's in it for him to say the following if it's a complete fabrication, which is what you're claiming it is?

"According to Greenburg, the fight was close to being made during both rounds of negotiations. The second time around, Mayweather turned the fight down without reason. To date, Greenburg was never provided with an explanation from Mayweather or his handlers.

"To this day, I don't know why he wanted to take some more time off. Only Floyd has that answer. I certainly don't have that answer. But, you know, it was very close. It was so, so, close. I think that it was so close that I don't think that it's going to take much to make the fight the third time around.""

Also, De La Hoya said in the middle of the "negotiations" that he thought a deal was close, and has never properly explained that statement.

And finally, why on earth didn't someone from team Mayweather blow the gaffe while the "negotiations" were getting so much national and international publicity? Why on earth did they wait until after the "deadline" had passed before saying a word? At the least that is very odd behaviour.

Hey Rado. This argument was presented hundreds of posts ago. Walk away man. Just walk away.

[LeadUppercut]

I have no problem accepting that Arum is a liar, but I have much more difficulty accepting that Greenburg is a liar. What's in it for him to say the following if it's a complete fabrication, which is what you're claiming it is?

"According to Greenburg, the fight was close to being made during both rounds of negotiations. The second time around, Mayweather turned the fight down without reason. To date, Greenburg was never provided with an explanation from Mayweather or his handlers.

"To this day, I don't know why he wanted to take some more time off. Only Floyd has that answer. I certainly don't have that answer. But, you know, it was very close. It was so, so, close. I think that it was so close that I don't think that it's going to take much to make the fight the third time around.""

Also, De La Hoya said in the middle of the "negotiations" that he thought a deal was close, and has never properly explained that statement.

And finally, why on earth didn't someone from team Mayweather blow the gaffe while the "negotiations" were getting so much national and international publicity? Why on earth did they wait until after the "deadline" had passed before saying a word? At the least that is very odd behaviour.

It's well explained in the article Dave, read it again.....

Defending Bob Arum is quite hard for a number of reasons. He's a famous liar, well-known to veteran fans as a promoter that tends to totally exaggerate negotiations to ensure that he comes out looking holier than thou.

Team Mayweather wasn't even the first to make these claims. It's been coming out of his own camp.

Michael Marley, the day after Arum's infamous "teleconference," came right out and said it. This was days before Leonard Ellerbe spoke.

Marley, a Top Rank/Pacquiao writer, and a close friend of Arum's, was just as perplexed by Arum's deadline. He didn't get it; he couldn't work out what Arum was up to. So he went digging.

He spoke to his Top Rank people, and was shocked with the answer. Again, this was days before Ellerbe spoke.

Negotiation just hadn't been happening. They'd started, briefly, but capitulated almost instantly, according to Marley.

Marley claimed that Arum had only spoken to Greenburg once, months ago. And that conversation was little more than Arum telling him his demands. Demands that Golden Boy just weren't interested in.

That's basically it. No meetings, no talks, no agreements, no contracts, no deals.

Bob Arum, according to Marley, just spent the next five weeks "blowing smoke to the media," to try and confuse the situation and giving the impression that he was breaking his back to make the deal.

When in truth, Mayweather vs. Pacquiao was the last thing Arum wanted for 2010.

Why did the talks fail? According to Marley, contrary to most reports, Pacquiao was unwilling to move an inch on drug testing. And Mayweather was unwilling to move an inch on money.

Pretty predictable.

As another example of the way Arum operates, it also turns out that "Pacquiao accepting 14 days" was just more "smoke" as part of the Arum charade.

The original quote from Pacquiao was 100 percent fake. Arum has admitted as much. The second quote from Pacquiao was real, but for PR purposes. Pacquiao's manager denied it was accurate, when quizzed soon after.

To confirm the charade, only days ago, Arum was asked straight up, what drug terms Pacquiao had agreed to and he was unable to give an answer.

This is a man who had an agreement with Mayweather's people? He couldn't even answer what the supposed drug agreement was?

So what actually happened? According to Marley, Arum made these claims days before anyone from team Mayweather spoke out.

Well, Arum has allegedly been fixing a Pacquiao vs. Margarito bout in the Middle East for months. But he knew full well that he couldn't make the fight without being seen to be trying to make Mayweather vs. Pacquiao first.

Plus, HBO, after pressure from Golden Boy, flat out told him that he'd have to approach Mayweather first, or they would not work on a Margarito fight.

Arum, according to Marley, approached Greenburg with his terms for the fight. Terms, Marley suspects, that were never going to be accepted. Terms, that in regards to drug testing, were even worse than the last fight.

That's basically it. Golden Boy felt Arum was not being serious, and had no intention of negotiating further.

Arum played the media, and proclaimed that he was "waiting for Floyd to accept his offer." Which, I guess, was technically true. The big lie came with Arum's claims that these terms had been negotiated and accepted.

Marley claims that this is just 100 percent false. There were no real talks. No deals. No agreements. No contracts.

In a strange way, neither side is technically lying. Most likely, after taking legal advice, they've worded it all very carefully.

Arum claimed that he was waiting for Mayweather to agree to his offer, and had been dealing with Greenberg. The problem being, his dealings with Greenberg amounted to one conversation in which he sent him an awful offer, knowing full well it wouldn't work. No negotiations, talks, or discussions whatsoever.

Arum's offer. Countdown clock. Lots of BS about "terms being agreed by both sides."

Mayweather's people are technically speaking the truth as well. There were never any negotiations, talks, agreements, deals. Just Arum blowing smoke to the press.

Why did Arum exaggerate his efforts so much? Because he wanted to set up Margarito vs. Pacquiao and couldn't justify it without trying to pin the blame on someone else.

Golden Boy? Well Marley claims that there quite literally was a gag order. It's just the fact that the negotiations ended after about two days. You can tell when the fight fell through. Arum started talking to the media twice a day!

Marley claims that Golden Boy's position with Arum is to just let him talk, and not justify his claims with replies, safe in the knowledge that most of the sport world knows he talks out of his behind.

Arum could well find himself in a tough position, however. Dan Raphael reported that Ellerbe is not only one of the most honest guys in boxing, he's also been speaking to Greenberg regularly for weeks. These daily conversations have reportedly gone on after his claim that basically either Greenberg or Arum is a stone cold liar.

Which suggests to most that Greenberg agrees with his pronouncement.

Again, Marley is a Top Rank guy, and a noted Pacquiao backer. He reported that Arum's claims of "negotiations" and "agreements" were phony, days before any Mayweather person made any comment.

Mayweather's guy's wording is probably a bit controversial, and not 100 percent true, but both Marley and Ellebre are basically singing from the same hymn sheet.

Arum completely and utterly exaggerated all claims of "agreements," "deals," "contracts," and "negotiations."

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Fan-boy's, address the facts, and explain this......

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HERE IS BOB ARUM LYING TO YOU.....
Nobody denies that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP, who forwarded it to Mayweather for approval. Then he placed a two week " deadline " on the table, even going to the trouble of putting a count-down timer on the Top Rank website.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

HERE IS BOB ARUM ADMITTING IT.....
Then, after Bob Arum's conference call, Schaefer immediately released a statement which forced Arum to admit that both him and Ross Greenburg had NEVER spoken with anyone from GBP.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

[LeadUppercut]

Dave, explain this.....

HERE IS BOB ARUM LYING TO YOU.....
Nobody denies that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP, who forwarded it to Mayweather for approval. Then he placed a two week " deadline " on the table, even going to the trouble of putting a count-down timer on the Top Rank website.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

HERE IS BOB ARUM ADMITTING IT.....
Then, after Bob Arum's conference call, Schaefer immediately released a statement which forced Arum to admit that both him and Ross Greenburg had NEVER spoken with anyone from GBP.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

[ThePrince]

^Is this clown still trying to argue that there were no negotiations? Seriously?

And Greenburg is a liar because he has so much to gain by alienating his cash cow, right?

Stop it already. Everyone had a good laugh at Ellerbe's expense and then we all moved on once Ross set the record straight.

Let it go, it's over.

[Dave Rado]

Dave, explain this.....

HERE IS BOB ARUM LYING TO YOU.....
Nobody denies that Arum publicly stated on numerous occasions that he personally negotiated a deal with GBP, who forwarded it to Mayweather for approval. Then he placed a two week " deadline " on the table, even going to the trouble of putting a count-down timer on the Top Rank website.....

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29293

HERE IS BOB ARUM ADMITTING IT.....
Then, after Bob Arum's conference call, Schaefer immediately released a statement which forced Arum to admit that both him and Ross Greenburg had NEVER spoken with anyone from GBP.....
http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=29324

As I said, I have no problem agreeing Arum is a liar, but I have a lot more problem agreeing that Greenburg is. I still see nothing in the article that explains Greenburg's statement that "To this day, I don't know why he wanted to take some more time off. Only Floyd has that answer. I certainly don't have that answer. But, you know, it was very close. It [meaning a deal] was so, so, close." That doesn't sound like he is referring to a single conversation and an immediate rebuff based on the terms of Arum's offer being appalling.

And not long ago, Greenburg also said quite explicitly ""I had been negotiating with a representative from each side since May 2nd, carefully trying to put the fight together. Hopefully, someday this fight will happen. Sports fans deserve it.""

So if the article is right, Greenburg is an out and out liar.


It also doesn't explain why De La Hoya said a deal was close at one point.

And it also doesn't explain why team Mayweather didn't blow the gaff when it would have had maximum impact, when the whole world was being told that negotiations were taking place.

I am not justifying anything Arum said. I am just saying that while he is a liar, there still seems to be more to the story than meets the eye, and that article does not clear things up at all, given the above.

[AFighter4U]

I think most of us are in agreement that Arum is indeed a liar and anything he says should be taken with a grain of salt.

But the point here is that just because Arum lied about several things regarding the negotiations, it doesn't mean that it never really happened.

Dave's points are all good and relevant and i agree with him as well. There are just too many indications that the negotiations did indeed take place.

Primarily is the su****ious behavior of Floyd's camp. While Arum was blabbing about the negotiations all over media, Floyd and his camp were mysteriously silent. They were silent for a good two weeks or so before they opened up and said there never were ANY negotiations.

Why didn't floyd or ANYONE in his camp point that out on the first few days of Arums announcing of his talks? Heck, they were quiet UNTIL THE DEADLINE ARUM SET PASSED.

Why did they have to wait until the end of the deadline to say that there never was any negotiations? Was everyone at Floyd's camp full of A-side meth and thus incoherent and all those drugs only wore off AFTER the deadline Bob set?

Greenberg represents HBO. If indeed there was NEVER ANY SECOND NEGOTIATIONS, then that simply means HE WAS LYING.

IF he was lying, do you think HBO would stand for that? Do you think Greenberg would still have his job if he was blatantly lying? I don't think so.

While Bob can afford to lie since he's his own boss, Greenberg doesn't have that luxury.

[GRUSTLER]

You clearly haven't been reading my posts. You're a Floyd fanboy anyway.

I have been reading your posts and frankly all of them
just been about you mouthing off about how you feel
and no facts to back them up. I guess this post is the
easy way to get out of actually answering questions
ask by others who actually know what their talking
about.

[GRUSTLER]

As I said, I have no problem agreeing Arum is a liar, but I have a lot more problem agreeing that Greenburg is. I still see nothing in the article that explains Greenburg's statement that "To this day, I don't know why he wanted to take some more time off. Only Floyd has that answer. I certainly don't have that answer. But, you know, it was very close. It [meaning a deal] was so, so, close." That doesn't sound like he is referring to a single conversation and an immediate rebuff based on the terms of Arum's offer being appalling.

And not long ago, Greenburg also said quite explicitly ""I had been negotiating with a representative from each side since May 2nd, carefully trying to put the fight together. Hopefully, someday this fight will happen. Sports fans deserve it.""

So if the article is right, Greenburg is an out and out liar.


It also doesn't explain why De La Hoya said a deal was close at one point.

And it also doesn't explain why team Mayweather didn't blow the gaff when it would have had maximum impact, when the whole world was being told that negotiations were taking place.

I am not justifying anything Arum said. I am just saying that while he is a liar, there still seems to be more to the story than meets the eye, and that article does not clear things up at all, given the above.

This whole thing started from people on here saying Floyd
duck Manny and didn't want to make the fight and Leaduppercut
was just trying to point out that it is not true and how Arum
faked everything. Greenburg confirmed there was talks but
nothing strong enough to show that Arum actually wanted to
make this fight a reality. It's very convenient for guys on here
to act like they don't know why a poster is digging up facts
and label them a fan boy BUT never answer the questions
from the posts their debating.

[al-Xander]

This whole thing started from people on here saying Floyd
duck Manny and didn't want to make the fight and Leaduppercut
was just trying to point out that it is not true and how Arum
faked everything. Greenburg confirmed there was talks but
nothing strong enough to show that Arum actually wanted to
make this fight a reality. It's very convenient for guys on here
to act like they don't know why a poster is digging up facts
and label them a fan boy BUT never answer the questions
from the posts their debating.

Seems irrelevant to say Arum trying to make the fight happen
wasn't strong enough. Did it even occur to you that no matter
how strong Arum wanted the fight happen Floyd was simply not
interested? This is like saying the blind date didn't work because
it's the matchmaker's fault.

Bud, let's just say Floyd wasn't interested and leave it at that.