Did Manny ever agree to full random drug testing?

[Doctor_Tenma]

I am replying this from another thread that got deleted while I was writing it.



There is a reason why Floyd asked for it. Floyd fans can say whatever they want. But, there is a reason why he started with Pac. I honestly feel even with Shane omission with the grand jury. That if Floyd would of gone after Shane before Pac. He would not ask Shane for OST. IMO he ask Shane to save face with the Pac situation...

You're right to a certain extent. Floyd himself admitted that Pacquiao was extraordinary, so thats the proof. But Jeff and Sr. came out and said "Mayweather knows that the only way Pacquiao would beat him is with that stuff in him". So I would hate to think that Mayweather hasn't expressed those feelings with them, I'm sure he has. As for Mayweather demanding OSDT against Mosley; had Mosley been his first option, I'm sure he would have. Mosley looked like a straight up beast against Margarito and he already has a dark past so....

I have no doubt in my mind that Floyd truly has doubts about him being able to beat Pac. I think he can't believe Pac is this damn good. And, that Pac is a serious threat. I see that as why Floyd brought it up.

I said from the very start that Mayweather views Pacquiao as a threat, but not to the extent where he isn't willin' to step inside the ring with him. Mayweather came back for Pacquiao, even eliminated Pacquiao's options of facing Marquez. Mayweather would love to steal some of Pacquiao's thuder, trust. You're right though, Mayweather views him as a threat.

However, really there is nothing wrong with better testing. As a boxing fan I would like to see OST not just for big fights but for every fight. But, I understand you have to start somewhere. And, props to Floyd for bringing this issue along. And, like I said before as a Pac fan I truly wish Pac would of agreed all the way up to the fight and after the fight. Not only does it remove all doubt IMO but it also benefits the sport that I truly love. For whatever reason he didn't.

This is what seperates you from most Pacquiao fans

But, what gets me about some Floyd fans. Not you cuz you not really a Floyd just about a fan in this issue but you also been consistent. But, there are Floyd fans who are not that consistent. And, that is what bothers me For example Pac is this scumbag for not agreeing just a straight cheat. However, when it comes to Ward and his involvement with Conte. Even after it was proved that Conte or Ward lied about not working with each other anymore. There were Floyd fans still giving Ward a pass but **** on Manny. That to me is the hypocrisy that they don't truly care about this whole PED issue. They just care about being on Floyd ****.

I was disgusted aswell, and I seen some good posters defend Ward (Not calling out any names). Ward simply lied but I honestly don't know how to look at him. Maybe he only wanted to protect his image here, but he went the wrong way about it. Anyway, a lot of hypocrites running around, I agree.

And, I don't even think Ward is juicing BTW. But, if you going to be so adamant about Pac. Then you should also question Ward involvement. I see you did it and that is what I mean by consistency. ANother one, I read after the Abraham fight Saurland wanted Dirrell to take a drug test. Shaw and camp said no. I see these same fans so adamant against Pac. Again giving Dirrell a pass.

I didn't even know Dirrell refused to be tested, WOW
You have a source?

That to me proves that fans from both sides don't give a crap about this whole PED issues. They just care about riding their favorite fighters ****. That is all and it frustrates me.

Some do, some don't. But at one point I actually respected Pacquiao, dispite hatin' his character, because of my belief of him having this fake persona. But I couldn't deny his greatness, no way. Just that when someone like Pacquiao; a great well respected athlete has all his excuses debunked, as to why he shouldn't agree to random testing, I HAVE TO question his legitimacy, have to. But I'm no longer doing that, I'm pointing the finger. I know I hurt a few posters on here, but I'm being real here.

Anyways I have no problem with Floyd asking for this. It benefits the sport. And, if we do get mandatory OST by commission. It would be thanks for Floyd and props to him for bringing it to light. I read a while ago NYSAC was thinking about it. Even NSAC, so all this makes the sport better and I am all for that.

Hopefully

[IMDAZED]

You're right to a certain extent. Floyd himself admitted that Pacquiao was extraordinary, so thats the proof. But Jeff and Sr. came out and said "Mayweather knows that the only way Pacquiao would beat him is with that stuff in him". So I would hate to think that Mayweather hasn't expressed those feelings with them, I'm sure he has. As for Mayweather demanding OSDT against Mosley; had Mosley been his first option, I'm sure he would have. Mosley looked like a straight up beast against Margarito and he already has a dark past so....



I said from the very start that Mayweather views Pacquiao as a threat, but not to the extent where he isn't willin' to step inside the ring with him. Mayweather came back for Pacquiao, even eliminated Pacquiao's options of facing Marquez. Mayweather would love to steal some of Pacquiao's thuder, trust. You're right though, Mayweather views him as a threat.



This is what seperates you from most Pacquiao fans



I was disgusted aswell, and I seen some good posters defend Ward (Not calling out any names). Ward simply lied but I honestly don't know how to look at him. Maybe he only wanted to protect his image here, but he went the wrong way about it. Anyway, a lot of hypocrites running around, I agree.



I didn't even know Dirrell refused to be tested, WOW
You have a source?



Some do, some don't. But at one point I actually respected Pacquiao, dispite hatin' his character, because of my belief of him having this fake persona. But I couldn't deny his greatness, no way. Just that when someone like Pacquiao; a great well respected athlete has all his excuses debunked, as to why he shouldn't agree to random testing, I HVAE TO question his legitimacy, have to. But I'm no longer doing that, I'm pointing the finger. I know I hurt a few posters on here, but I'm being real here.



Hopefully

This is one hell of a homerun post, bud.

[Doctor_Tenma]

This is one hell of a homerun post, bud.

Thanks,

If we had much better posters on here, I wouldn't scoop so low at times

[IMDAZED]

Thanks,

If we had much better posters on here, I wouldn't scoop so low at times

. I know exactly what you mean. Good to read an elevated debate from all viewpoints.

[ThePrince]

The USADA didn't have that hearing until one month after Mosley-Mayweather so that's a stretch. Actually, that's bull****. And the testing occured (and was going to occur) for Mayweather-Mosley regardless of whatever the NSAC felt like. I'm sure they just loved the USADA all over their turf and explaining how shoddy they were under the bright lights of HBO's 24-7, huh? Yeah, they sure crushed that. And for the record, if they are able to make a urine test available for next year, wonderful! Unless that should be "crushed" too?

Read.

The United States Anti Doping Agency sent the wrong guy to persuade the Nevada State Athletic Commission that completely random blood testing is a must for the huge Floyd Mayweather-Manny Pacquiao super bout.


I listened to over three hours of testimony over a telephone hookup Wednesday presided over by NSAC Chairwoman Pat Lundvall and including the other four governor appointed members of the Silver State's boxing board.


Travis Tygart, lawyer and publicity flack for the USADA, seemed to me to be a loser of a "split decision" to two speakers who preceded him, longtime Olympic boxing physician and Las Vegas resident Dr. Robert Voy and NSAC physician David Watson.

Need to know "background" to all this is that the Nevada interests are still "frosted" that the blood testing arrangements for the May 1 Mayweather-Sugar Shane Mosley bout in Las Vegas were strictly a private, contractual matter between two Golden Boy promoter fighters and did not involve the state boxing board in any manner or form. It's my understanding that only the always negative results and test dates were casually reported to Nevada.

Can you say let's go around the NSAC?


The testimony of the two doctors, taken in whole and in part, favored totally random urine testing as the most practical and, more important, most efficient way of deterring Pacman, Mayweather and any other boxer who might seek to use banned substances in connection with a boxing match.

Try as he might, and he was certainly quite glib, Tygart did not seem to persuade the commissioners that BOTH blood and urine random test must be put into effect for what Tygart kept repeating as "the protection for clean athletes."


If it was a battle between blood versus urine, I'd say urine was the winner but we'll have to see what the budget strained boxing board does next.

Just thinking out loud, but the commission's less than overwhelming response to highly critical Tygart might be a reason for the Pacquiao side to push even harder for a Nov. 13 but, conversely, cause the Mayweather side to seek to delay the inevitable bout into next year.

A fourth speaker was New Jersey boxing lawyer Patrick English who put in what came off as a suggestion that Nevada should enlist UCLA's highly respected Olympic drug expert, Dr. Donald Catlin, to reform and/or expand its drug testing protocol. English did point out that that some experts are scientifically uncomfortable because the USADA medical records have not been "published or peer reviewed."

Certainly, inserting Dr. Caitlin into the Big Fight mix is a solid idea. Unlike Tygart, he doesn't come off as an advocate for Mayweather and an enemy of Pacquiao. He would be regarded as properly neutral and impartial as to both boxers.

The banned susbtances most often mentioned were HGH and EPO.

Voy, former Chief Medical Office of the USOC, said current blood testing as to HGH is "ureliable and impractical."

He also said, "HGH is out there and there's not much we can do about it."

As far as EPO testing, Voy said, "I'm of the opinion that EPO is not a performance enhancer in boxing or that it gives you more endurace although that is the perception."

Regarding urine testing, Voy said it should be random and "closer to the event, the better."

Voy also said that while tiny amounts of blood are drawn for testing "it can be dangerous."

That was a theme Dr. Watson chimed in on, saying, "I believe that urine is the best substance to test. I agree with Dr. Voy that urine (random testing) is what we should require and that blood is not necessary.

"I agree with Dr. Voy that there are theoretical and real risks to blood testing one of which is a (boxer getting) a hematoma on the elbow or a clot from missing a vein. There are also HIV and Hepatitis C risks."

Dr. Watson said blood testing should be curtailed "within three to four weeks before (a fight) so that the hemotoma risk does not put a fighter at a disadvantage."

And HGH blood testing will be obsolete in a few months and you will have to find another excuse to cling on to (what's wrong with taxes and Roger's trial btw? bandwagons full to capacity?)

CERES NANOSCIENCES COMPLETES USADA FUNDED CLINICAL STUDY TO MEASURE HGH IN URINE AND ESTABLISH INTIAL HUMAN BASELINE LEVELS
MANASSAS, Va. April 13, 2010--- Ceres Nanosciences LLLP has completed a study to measure baseline levels of Human Growth Hormone (HGH) present in the urine of non-doping healthy adults. The trial was funded by the United States Anti Doping Agency (USADA).

The trial collected urine samples from a population of adult patients and used the Ceres Nanotrap® technology to consistently measure HGH concentrations present in order to establish a reference range of natural HGH concentrations in the urine of non-doping adults (the baseline).
The trial utilized the Ceres-patented Nanotrap®, an innovative technology that captures protein particles in body fluids and protects them from degradation when they are extracted for analysis. Ceres Nanosciences continues to collect data on HGH levels in urine and has recently expanded its capability to conduct a larger clinical trial to continue investigation of the analytical challenges in measuring urinary HGH. Ceres is seeking additional industry funding for development of this test.

"In our view, the results of our scientific study demonstrate the ability to measure HGH in urine using existing FDA approved assays coupled to Nanotrap enrichment" said Lance Liotta, M.D., Ph. D., co-director of the Center for Applied Proteomics and Molecular Medicine at George Mason University, "We now are exploring the feasibility of measuring specific isoforms of HGH in urine using the Nanotrap technology, which has not been done before" he continued. "We plan to proceed methodically through this process with the highest degree of scientific rigor and peer-review".

^That technology can detect HGH in a person's urine 14-21 days after doping occurs. It should be widely available early next year, just in time for more non-negotiation negotiations.

[IMDAZED]

Read.



And HGH blood testing will be obsolete in a few months and you will have to find another excuse to cling on to (what's wrong with taxes and Roger's trial btw? bandwagons full to capacity?)



^That technology can detect HGH in a person's urine 14-21 days after doping occurs. It should be widely available early next year, just in time for more non-negotiation negotiations.

Wonderful. Ok...and?

[TheSurgeonMDMPH]

if floyd didnt make those demands the FIRST time around then the fight wouldve happened for sure.

Blame manny for wanting the fight and compromising though.


what about this time around? is it the vacation against Manny thats holding up the fight or the blood tests?

please just answer in a simple sentence and do not create an elaborate story that'll end up blaming manny and arum.

Its the blood test! pacq wants no blood testing up to 7 days becuz..........who ***ing knows. I think the guy is a fraud. No one makes shyt this difficult for no other reason. He will cave when he has no where else to go for money. Or retire like calzaghe in shame.

[maguirre]

BUMP, BUMP, BUMP.

Fight's not gonna happen.

[TheSurgeonMDMPH]

BUMP, BUMP, BUMP.

Fight's not gonna happen.

Oh! Thats all u have to say? Where is the outrage at all the lies coming from those guys that protect...I mean manage pacq?