Title Defenses: W. Klitschko 13 Lennox Lewis 12

[Mr. Invincible]

Wladimir now is a top fighter yes.

Vitali has him beat in my opinion.

Every fighter has a green stage and a prime stage and then an erm fall down stage.

ATM Wlad is in his prime and has a few years to find more fighters. Now that he is on top, people will go to Germany and he will get the fights. He may surpass Leiw's resume but I don't think he beats Lewis. I still count green stage of a career into the equation when looking at a fighters resume. There was a thread before about Ali and both Klit's. I personally felt that both would not beat every fighter Ali had faced or himself. It's like going through the toughest era ever with 15 rounds, blistering heat and the fighters were strong and hungry.

Lewis is a better version of Wlad to me. Don't get me wrong, I prefer to watch Vitali, Tyson etc... above both, but for now, Lewis has the better resume.

I can respect that opinion. Not too far off base in my opinion as well.

However, it's hard to compare fighters who had not fought one another nor many opponents in common. So based strictly on facets of each mans game at their best, they stack up pretty well. If the best fighter out there was based solely on fluidity, Chambers would have beaten Wladimir and as you saw, he had no chance whatsoever.

My point? Just because Lennox looked better doing his thing didn't neccesarily mean he was better at doing it.

[TheGreatA]

What does that have to do with Michalczewski being undisputed holding the WBO and two other belts?

Umm, it has everything to do with it. Michalczewski was the linear, unified champion, because he had unified the WBA, IBF & WBO titles by beating Virgil Hill who in turn had become the undisputed champion by defeating top ranked title holder Henry Maske.

Wladimir Klitschko won the belt that Herbie Hide had held in the past. Anyone recognize Hide as a true heavyweight champion? No because Lennox Lewis was the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world despite the lightly regarded WBO trying to claim the likes of Francesco Damiani, Herbie Hide and later Wladimir Klitschko as "champions".

[Pirao]

That is true he isn't great either. He's had maybe 5 defining fights and lost some lol.

I can't argue with you on that one.

His power, speed and combo though are very potent if he can get you, and I think he could have gotten through to most.

Thank you. Same for you.

I will admit I have bias agenda's, but I do come out with honest opinion and try to bring some facts.

I'm a fan of Pac, Khan and Haye. I'll try my best to defend and bet on them always

I'm actually a fan of Vitali also. What I don;t agree with is the fact that people discredit Lewis for that win. If it had continued, Vitali would have lost his damn eye.

I'm abit erm of a hater on Wlad at times, not ebcause he is a crap fighter because he is technically and athleticall a very good heavyweight. I jusat feel that he gets beat by Lewis, Vitali and the ATG's. Heck Tyson and Holyfield have very good chances too.

I don't like comparing either Klit to Ali though. I feel those type of fighters were the ebst ever. They had to train hard, fought 15 rounds, in difficult environments at times. They had distractions, poverty and Don King to deal with aswell lol. They were powerful, fast, not flat footed.

That's another argument however buddy.

Again, thank you for appreciaitng our discusions and me for you.

No problem, every one of us has bias towards certain fighters, I'm a Klitschko fan.

I don't discredit Lennox's win over Vitali, he beat him fairly within the rules of boxing. I think he should have given Vitali a rematch though, but oh well.

I think Wlad would lose to Lennox too, I rate Lennox quite highly among the HWs, but I'm tired of people trying to discredit the Klitschkos after every fight, there are so many Klitschko haters in this forum that I get a little overzelous at times.

Anytime, bro

[Jim Jeffries]

Yes, when it contradicts facts, I do.

Well the fact is Vitali was winning the fight on all three cards and wanted to continue. And Lennox was offered a career payday for a rematch, agreed and then retired while a year younger than Vitali is today.

Oddly enough this fight is used in a way to criticize Vitali.

[Pirao]

Umm, it has everything to do with it. Michalczewski was the linear, unified champion, because he had unified the WBA, IBF & WBO titles by beating Virgil Hill who in turn had become the undisputed champion by defeating top ranked title holder Henry Maske.

Wladimir Klitschko won the belt that Herbie Hide had held. Anyone recognize Hide as a true heavyweight champion? No because Lennox Lewis was the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world despite the lightly regarded WBO trying to claim the likes of Francesco Damiani, Herbie Hide and later Wladimir Klitschko as "champions".

Of course, noone is saying that Wlad was the man at HW then, what I mean is that the WBO is as valid as the WBA,WBC and IBF belts, so Wlad was a valid titlist (although not the man) at that time, just as Vitali and Haye are titlists now, but neither are the man right now, Wlad is.

[Mr. Invincible]

Lewis didn't have a dodgy chin.

His chin was actually very good. He took some hard shots in his time, even Vitali's.

Rahman got him because he was fat, out of shape and was breathing through his mouth by round 3.

The Mccall one I rememebr but I can't comment because I can't rememebr enough fo it lol.

Naw, don't cop out like that. Lennox got sparked out twice by big right hands that were both nowhere in the same league as Wladimir's. Bad combo for Lennox in my opinion even though I am not saying Klitschko definitely lands the money shot. No way to tell what would have happened actually.

[PensionKiller]

I can respect that opinion. Not too far off base in my opinion as well.

However, it's hard to compare fighters who had not fought one another nor many opponents in common. So based strictly on facets of each mans game at their best, they stack up pretty well. If the best fighter out there was based solely on fluidity, Chambers would have beaten Wladimir and as you saw, he had no chance whatsoever.

My point? Just because Lennox looked better doing his thing didn't neccesarily mean he was better at doing it.

I understand that we can't really say one will beat the other on that, but I do feel that Lewis was big enough to handle Wlad's size.

I feel Lewis ni his prime was more athletic than Wlad which is a very good compliment.

Wlad has the power, but throws less. His jab is better, but Lewis was world class also.

Lewis had power that you had to respect, and that's why I feel Wlad's effectiveness or atleast workrate would be a lot lower.

Lewis also fought some good guys and that shows me he is a very good quality fighter.

Both won the olympic gold and have dteward so that's quite funny how they kinda match up lol. Both use the jab, box smartly, quite big etc...

Also I believe that Lewis in his prime would have had Vitali, and I feel Vitali beats Wlad. Although triangle theories don't always work

Still, for me, a green Lewis beats a green wlad 100%. a prime Lewis beats a priME wLAD BUT IT WILL BE CLOSE

[TheGreatA]

Of course, noone is saying that Wlad was the man at HW then, what I mean is that the WBO is as valid as the WBA,WBC and IBF belts, so Wlad was a valid titlist (although not the man) at that time, just as Vitali and Haye are titlists now, but neither are the man right now, Wlad is.

It was not then, only recently.

I don't think Wladimir's 2000-2003 title claim should be considered equal to Lewis, who had been avoided by Bowe, thus given the vacanted WBC heavyweight title, and side-stepped by Tyson, thus given the vacanted WBC title again. In Wladimir's case he hardly has a case to having been a legitimate champion because he went onto be knocked out by Sanders before having a chance to fight Lewis.

Of course most people probably look at it using hindsight, with the WBO given recognition as a legitimate title now, but back in the 1990's nobody recognized the likes of Damiani and Hide as legitimate title holders.

[Mr. Invincible]

Yes, when it contradicts facts, I do.

How can busting someones face up to the point where the fight has to be stopped be a "gift win"?

First off, don't take it so personal. Sorry if I shamed your hero or something.

Secondly, because that was not the gameplan to win on cuts now was it? I don't recall Lennox mentioning that prior to the fight..........maybe he did but it was on the down low or something like a secret weapon. lol.

Silly fella.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Well the fact is Vitali was winning the fight on all three cards and wanted to continue. And Lennox was offered a career payday for a rematch, agreed and then retired while a year younger than Vitali is today.

Oddly enough this fight is used in a way to criticize Vitali.

The fact is he lost the fight by 6th round TKO. You can have an opinion on who would've won had it continued or in a rematch. But you cant say "Lewis lost that fight in my opinion"....