The Benefits of Steroids May Never Go Away -- Even When Athletes Quit Taking Them

[BLooDCalibuR]

Simple question:

Why did Floyd demand that Pac undergo Olympic Style Testing? For what purpose?

Answer this simple question, please. The answer is obvious, but I want to hear it confirmed from someone else to make sure I'm not insane.

You're beating around the bush now because you can't directly rebuttal my points. My points which btw, destroyed yours.

We can speculate on that all we want, but if you ask for my opinion I'd agree and say it was because he wants to make sure Pac is not on something due to what his father brought up.

But that's avoiding answering the very question you imposed in your topic starter, which was "Why is Floyd not fighting Pacquiao because he thinks he's on PEDs but is fighting Mosley who is a proven PED user?"

And the answer to that, again, for the third time now slow guy, is because Mosley agreed to the testing, Pacquiao didn't.

It's as simple as that. Was that too hard still or should we go for the fourth? Luckily usually a third time's a charm. I hope that applies to sub-100 IQ *******s too though.

[Maidana vs Rios]

You're beating around the bush now because you can't directly rebuttal my points. My points which btw, destroyed yours.

We can speculate on that all we want, but if you ask for my opinion I'd agree and say it was because he wants to make sure Pac is not on something due to what his father brought up.

But that's avoiding answering the very question you imposed in your topic starter, which was "Why is Floyd not fighting Pacquiao because he thinks he's on PEDs but is fighting Mosley who is a proven PED user?"

Not quite the same question I asked. Here was my question:

If Floyd wouldn't fight Pac because he thinks Pac is enhanced, and thus wanted the Olympic Style Tests, why would he fight Mosley who he already knows is enhanced, regardless if he's clean now (see article above)?

The real issue is not really about the test itself. The heart of the issue is about what you can discover from the test: to determine if a fighter has an unfair biochemical advantage. Do you agree with this or not?

Even if Mosley is clean now, he may still be unfairly enhanced due to his confirmed, admitted past steroid use, which, per the sourced article I posted, may have conferred him permanent unfair benefits. If Mayweather wouldn't fight someone who he only thinks is unfairly enhanced, yet has no real proof (Pac), why would he fight someone who he knows for a fact is unfairly enhanced, by Shane's own documented, confirmed, under-oath admission of past steroid use?

And the answer to that, again, for the third time now slow guy, is because Mosley agreed to the testing, Pacquiao didn't.

It's as simple as that. Was that too hard still or should we go for the fourth? Luckily usually a third time's a charm. I hope that applies to sub-100 IQ *******s too though.

You keep saying Floyd would have fought Pac if Pac had just agreed to the tests. That isn't necessarily true. What if Pac agreed, and then Pac tested positive? Would Floyd fight him then? I'll assume your answer is hell no.

The point is Floyd supposedly wants to know whether his opponent has an unfair advantage or not. Whether he finds that out through a test, through someone's admission under oath, however he finds out doesn't matter.

"Is my opponent unfairly enhanced?" That's the central question of that whole debacle. That's the question that killed the Pac-Floyd fight. Floyd could not be sure that the answer was "No." Will it kill the Mosley-Floyd fight?

Even when (not if, but when; Shane is probably clean now) Shane passes an Olympic Style Test with flying colors, can Floyd be sure that the answer to that central question is "No," given Shane's past steroid use and the potential benefit he might still be getting from it, as described in the article that was posted?

"Is my opponent unfairly enhanced?"

[Bad Boy Dazza]

Yeah I've known about the retained benefits for a while and posted about them on this site before. There are various medical articles supporting this.

[BLooDCalibuR]

Not quite the same question I asked. Here was my question:

If Floyd wouldn't fight Pac because he thinks Pac is enhanced, and thus wanted the Olympic Style Tests, why would he fight Mosley who he already knows is enhanced, regardless if he's clean now (see article above)?

The real issue is not really about the test itself. The heart of the issue is about what you can discover from the test: to determine if a fighter has an unfair biochemical advantage. Do you agree with this or not?

Even if Mosley is clean now, he may still be unfairly enhanced due to his confirmed, admitted past steroid use, which, per the sourced article I posted, may have conferred him permanent unfair benefits. If Mayweather wouldn't fight someone who he only thinks is unfairly enhanced, yet has no real proof (Pac), why would he fight someone who he knows for a fact is unfairly enhanced, by Shane's own documented, confirmed, under-oath admission of past steroid use?

Because he agreed to the testing and Pacquiao didn't. Same answer for a differently worded question. This answer works on several levels against everything you just detailed.

Furthermore, your questions is based on your own opinionated theory and personal speculation as to why he even asked for the random testing. Whether or not he's trying to make sure the fight is executed on a level-playing-field or if he's just trying to see if there's anything to expose about Pacquiao to the public, is up in the air. He might just be trying to expose him, regardless of a level playing field for that 1 fight night or not. But all that is pointless to mention because the fact is, it was in the contract and it needed agreement, which it didn't.

So now we move on to the next point.

You keep saying Floyd would have fought Pac if Pac had just agreed to the tests. That isn't necessarily true. What if Pac agreed, and then Pac tested positive? Would Floyd fight him then? I'll assume your answer is hell no.

The point is Floyd supposedly wants to know whether his opponent has an unfair advantage or not. Whether he finds that out through a test, through someone's admission under oath, however he finds out doesn't matter.

"Is my opponent unfairly enhanced?" That's the central question of that whole debacle. That's the question that killed the Pac-Floyd fight. Floyd could not be sure that the answer was "No." Will it kill the Mosley-Floyd fight?

Even when (not if, but when; Shane is probably clean now) Shane passes an Olympic Style Test with flying colors, can Floyd be sure that the answer to that central question is "No," given Shane's past steroid use and the potential benefit he might still be getting from it, as described in the article that was posted?

"Is my opponent unfairly enhanced?"

Just like everything else, that's just you and your speculation. The point of the matter is, Floyd is finding himself willing to fight Mosley due to Mosley accepting the random drug testing, while Pacquiao couldn't agree to it. One fighter allowed an opening to the deal, the other didn't. The case is still as simple as that.

You're beating around the bush, because as I stated before, you're speculating, making assumptions, and asking different questions that all lead to the same counter-answer.

Let me give you an example:

If you and I are trying to make a deal with our fight. Let's assume both you and I were aware of the points that were brought up in the article you sourced, where use of PEDs can have "permanent" effects supposedly.

But lets say I still demanded a certain drug testing style in the contract. And you didn't agree to it.

And then let's say a second guy came up to me and said he'd agree to everything in the contract, but this guy is a known PED user.

Fact of the matter is, he agreed to the contract, you didn't. So the fight is made. Now whether or not I'll still take the fight is up to me on a personal level. But that's besides the point, because the facts here state that he agreed to the terms on the contract which means if the fight doesn't happen, it would be because of me due to the ball being in my court if I decided on a personal level not to fight you despite him agreeing to everything in the contract.

[Telepath]

HGH is very healthy for people in their 30s. In effect it creates a second "puberty", bigger influx of hormones, and revitalizes the person.

Of course those benefits don't go away.

[Maidana vs Rios]

Because he agreed to the testing and Pacquiao didn't. Same answer for a differently worded question. This answer works on several levels against everything you just detailed.

Furthermore, your questions is based on your own opinionated theory and personal speculation as to why he even asked for the random testing. Whether or not he's trying to make sure the fight is executed on a level-playing-field or if he's just trying to see if there's anything to expose about Pacquiao to the public, is up in the air.

So now we move on to the next point.



Just like everything else, that's just you and your speculation. The point of the matter is, Floyd is finding himself willing to fight Mosley due to Mosley accepting the random drug testing, while Pacquiao couldn't agree to it. One fighter allowed an opening to the deal, the other didn't. The case is still as simple as that.

You're beating around the bush, because as I stated before, you're speculating, making assumptions, and asking different questions that all lead to the same counter-answer.

Let me give you an example:

If you and I are trying to make a deal with our fight. Let's assume both you and I were aware of the points that were brought up in the article you sourced, where use of PEDs can have "permanent" effects supposedly.

But lets say I still demanded a certain drug testing style in the contract. And you didn't agree to it.

And then let's say a second guy came up to me and said he'd agree to everything in the contract, but this guy is a known PED user.

Fact of the matter is, he agreed to the contract, you didn't. So the fight is made. Now whether or not I'll still take the fight is up to me on a personal level. But that's besides the point, because the facts here state that you agreed to the terms on the contract which means if the fight doesn't happen, it would be because of me due to the ball being in my court if I decided on a personal level not to fight you despite you agreeing to everything in the contract.

True, true, but contracts are drawn up based on underlying principles, are they not? Floyd's testing demand was based on an underlying principle: no fighter should be unfairly enhanced. Agree? Disagree?

Is he going to abandon that principle to fight Mosley? That's the million dollar question. I'm 50/50 on it, not sure if he will or not.

[BLooDCalibuR]

True, true, but contracts are drawn up based on underlying principles, are they not? Floyd's testing demand was based on an underlying principle: no fighter should be unfairly enhanced. Agree? Disagree?

Is he going to abandon that principle to fight Mosley? That's the million dollar question. I'm 50/50 on it, not sure if he will or not.

IF that is the underlying principle that he's using as the basis for his random drug testing requests in the contract, AND that article you referred to about PED usage having permanent advantages is true, THEN I can agree that he's not staying consistent with that principle. In other words, that would be him being a hypocrite.

BUT, like I said before, he might have just been trying to expose Pacquiao in case Pacquiao really was on something, and not actually the desire to have a level playing field or not. That can be another underlying principle as well. And of course, there are others as well.

And then on top of all that, we'd still have to assume Floyd's camp is even aware of the points that the article you referred to as being true.

[Maidana vs Rios]

Don't tell me this is Bernardo.

[Unregistered0]

Just look at Shane Mosley. He's dangerous due to the juice.

[Championart]

Put on your thinking cap for a minute, will ya?

Why did Floyd demand OSTs from Pac?

The demands for OST's were not to determine if Pac ever took peds in the past, but rather he wants to make sure that Pac isn't taking peds while training for the fight with him.

Also he has never once accused Pac of being a steroid user. Not once. If you believe other wise find it and post it.