Berto vs. Collazo

[savorduhflavor]

Anyone who had Collazo winning that fight don't know how to score fights. Collazo had a cut over his eye opened up by a punch and he was winded and ready to go at the end. The last two rounds was what determined who deserved that win and Berto won them handily. I know there are posters who are not Puerto Rican that had Berto losing that fight. But I don't think I've come across one Puerto Rican poster who had Berto winning either. Lol.

Quit your bitching about Puerto Ricans.

I had Berto winning, and I don't like Berto. I thought it was pretty ****ing clear too.

8-4 Collazo? Insanity. I seriously don't understand what people are watching sometimes.

[jkaisen41]

Yeah, the Cotto-Clottey fight was another of those extremely razor-thin decisions that rightfully could've gone either way. On my first 3 viewings, I kept having it 115-112 for Clottey (which I naively called a robbery) and was convinced that he won, but then when I watched the HD version many months later, I had Cotto winning by 114-113. I accept that now. Nonetheless, a score of up to 115-112 either way is acceptable IMO, although 114-113 is more plausible considering how close it was.

Some of those rounds, like with Berto-Collazo, were incredibly close to call - but mainly because of the lack of offence from both guys! That's what made it a frustrating fight to watch, even though I still consider it a FOTY candidate. At least with Berto-Collazo, it was non-stop action with at least one fighter throwing in each round; but with Cotto-Clottey, you had a few rounds where neither seemed to want to attack - so you'd have to score the round based on who dictated the pace or something really specific.

But like you said, Clottey has talent and it's a huge shame that he's not fighting more often. I wish he'd drop the diva mentality about his own self-worth and just go out there and fight anyone to keep busy - there are plenty of talented guys looking for a match-up, and by beating them he could make himself a shoe-in for another title shot. I actually think Cotto should give him a rematch, but I'm probably in the minority there...



Others have disagreed with me on this, but seeing Berto struggle and look downright lost against a blown-up LWW in Urango brought him down a few notches in my estimation. Sure, he trounced him and shut him out, but by rights he should've made it look much easier than he did - all he did was hit and hold, and throw backhands instead of hard jabs (hence why I laugh when I hear people praise his jab, when Dawson's is miles better and isn't thrown like a backhand).

Meanwhile, Mosley has an underrated jab, an iron chin and a truckload of power. If he shows up in that vicious, animalistic way he did against Margarito, he should breeze this... But if he shows up rusty and frustrated like in the Mayorga fight (which was excusable because it was at 154), it's going to be a tough night.

Again I can feel yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa *loooooooooooooooool*

Of course you can say Cotto-Clottey rematch BUT Cotto fought Pacquiao instead and now he probably has two more fight left... I think you can't blame him... Clottey will always be a tough fight with less money... and he already beat him... so from his standpoint on... if Cotto was younger yes, but I think at this stage of his career I can understand it...

Yeah, the Urango match was kind of strange... Urango is really guy with brute force... I think he gave him way too much credit and held him way to often... probably thought about how often Collazo landed and ain't wanted that from Urango... Berto has some flaws... a guy like him would be perfect for Mayweather Senior to train... Mayweather's system is based on reflexes and Berto's style is made for reflexes... fighters like Hatton or even your boy Katsidis (I enjoy his fights pretty much *lol*) are wrong fighters for Mayweather Sr. because their style isn't based on reflexes... Berto could learn a lot and especially defensive wise...

I usually like to see the abilities of a fighter and not his flaws... I think Berto has a lot of abilities... he simply doesn't really know to use them right... he needs someone who teaches him. It's the same with Mosley by the way... with his physical tools Mosley is a big underarchiever in my book... now with Naazim you saw what happened against Margarito... he had a plan... he knew what to use and how and it was an masterpiece...

I agree... Mosley has a good jab if he uses it... and if he will he will make it a lot easier on him. I still have Mosley in this one on points. Berto will have to overcome his flaws and Mosley... it won't be easy... but that's his spotlight... he has TO if he wants to be a player

[Spray_resistant]

Quit your bitching about Puerto Ricans.

I had Berto winning, and I don't like Berto. I thought it was pretty ****ing clear too.

8-4 Collazo? Insanity. I seriously don't understand what people are watching sometimes.

Don't know what to tell you like I said on the thread I made about it.....I thought Collazo won all of the debatable rounds which could account for a wide score like mine.....I just liked the way he was constantly working in most rounds, and I don't give a guy a round he was losing because he lands one flashy combo and snaps a guys head back one time in a round.

[PittyPat]

Here's anothing thing that really bugs me about Berto - he is a big and stocky WW in terms of overall frame, but doesn't make use of that size at all. He has an awful stance where his legs are spread too far apart and he's hunched too far down (which seems to give away a good few inches in height). Also, he's too side-on to his opponent, resulting in him fighting awkwardly when backing up - and not in a good way.

From how he stands, his snappy jab ends up being more like a backhanded slap (unlike that of Dawson's, which is like a cobra striking hard and lightning-fast), whilst his excellent handspeed and power almost becomes redundant because he has to take the time to square up in order to throw a flurry. Like Paul Williams, I just don't think he fights effectively for his size and build. There's tons of room to improve.

Now, on the other hand, I find that Mosley fights in a bigger way than his size suggests. Height-wise he's not very tall for a WW, and neither does his frame make him look very strong... but it's deceptive, because he fights like a big man in a small man's body - he hits like a Mack truck, is fast in a subway train -ish way, yet doesn't quite have the build to impose himself like Berto should be doing.

I was a supporter of Berto's after the Collazo fight, but the poor showing against Urango made me see his glaring flaws and they subsequently ended up bugging me too much to be able to support him any more. I do appreciate his skills and he has plenty of time to improve, but unless he's suddenly become a completely different fighter in the past half-year, Mosley should have this one.

Don't know what to tell you like I said on the thread I made about it.....I thought Collazo won all of the debatable rounds which could account for a wide score like mine.....I just liked the way he was constantly working in most rounds, and I don't give a guy a round he was losing because he lands one flashy combo and snaps a guys head back one time in a round.

Well there ya go. That's one of the criteria I tend to stick to when scoring - if fighter A is winning most of the round (say, the first 2 minutes) by putting on pressure and landing softer shots, but ends up taking one hard punch from fighter B in the final minute, I still think fighter A should get it because he did more consistent work overall.

Granted, many will say that it's all about clean effective punching, but to me that's not the only thing that wins a round. I try hard to look at all aspects besides just flashy, head-snapping punches - who controlled the pace? Who held in desperation the most? Did a fighter throw a lot but not land? How about if one guy throws nothing but shows good defence? What if a fighter is throwing ineffective punches but his opponent throws absolutely nothing?

It's all subjective, but kinda part of the fun.