Is Uysk actually ranked higher than Mike Tyson as an all time great ?

[garfios]

From the time he was 18/19yo to when he got sent to jail, there's wasn't a most feared man in the HW division than Tyson. Berbick, Piklon, bonecrush smith, tucker, Spinks, Holmes was a little over the hill but still dangerous and he took the only ko of his career, bruno, tubbs, Stewart, donovan, seldom, they all were good fighters. I think he let king ruin his career and after 91 he wasn't the same. Almost 4 years in prison in the middle of his prime, could be catastrophic for a prize fighter, or any elite athlete.

[gamesworn]

Yes. Usyk actually defeated the top dogs in the HW and CW divisions. Even if he loses to Fury rematch, i don't think this would drop his standing too much.

Usyk maybe in 50-75 atg range at this point (Maybe higher) and Mike Tyson is 75-100 range

Best comparison to Usyk is Holyfield, and i'm sure everyone agrees here Holyfield is higher than Tyson in ATG list.

Usyk is the only legit atg fighter that comes out this era of fighter so far.
Canelo and Chocolatito has argument as ATG fighters but i think they are borderline.
Naoya and Crawford still active but don't really have the fighters to elevate them there.

[Boxing 112]

You're dreaming, especially when using "easily".

Sorry i meant, VERY EASILY.

Mike Tyson fought like 25 journeymen in first 2 years, no different to Wilder, only then Tyson was hyped up for doing that, whereas Wilder is ripped for it as we are in the social media era.

Usyk in just 22 fights has been undisputed in Cruiser and Heavy.
He fought and beat Glowacki in Poland took his belt
He beat Hunter in the US
Beat Huck in Germany
Briedis in Latvia took his belt
Gassiev in Russia took his belt
Beat Bellew in the UK
Witherspoon in the US
Chisora in UK

Joshua was considered top by many when he fought him he held 3 belts, beat him in his backyard took his belts

He then also beat Fury when he was considered the top heavyweight and took his belt

Most of them all in their backyards and not when they were considered past it

Tyson barely fought out of the US. When he was washed he did other than that Japan earlier in his career and 2nd time he went there he went and got his ass beat by Buster Douglas. Then in 96 when Lewis was mando they paid him 5m to duck him.

There is no debate, Mike Tyson is the most over rated by far, great career still but way way over rated. He does not even come into the debate of top 10 boxers all time, Usyk can be in that convo

[garfios]

Sorry i meant, VERY EASILY.

Mike Tyson fought like 25 journeymen in first 2 years, no different to Wilder, only then Tyson was hyped up for doing that, whereas Wilder is ripped for it as we are in the social media era.

Usyk in just 22 fights has been undisputed in Cruiser and Heavy.
He fought and beat Glowacki in Poland took his belt
He beat Hunter in the US
Beat Huck in Germany
Briedis in Latvia took his belt
Gassiev in Russia took his belt
Beat Bellew in the UK
Witherspoon in the US
Chisora in UK

Joshua was considered top by many when he fought him he held 3 belts, beat him in his backyard took his belts

He then also beat Fury when he was considered the top heavyweight and took his belt

Most of them all in their backyards and not when they were considered past it

Tyson barely fought out of the US. When he was washed he did other than that Japan earlier in his career and 2nd time he went there he went and got his ass beat by Buster Douglas. Then in 96 when Lewis was mando they paid him 5m to duck him.

There is no debate, Mike Tyson is the most over rated by far, great career still but way way over rated. He does not even come into the debate of top 10 boxers all time, Usyk can be in that convo

Okay, very easily have it your way. He has faced a murderous row. By the way AJ was exposed as soon as he started facing real fighters, and he has the dubious distinction to be knockout by a 300 mexican chaparro, in 96 Tyson was a shadow of himself.

[Boxing 112]

Okay, very easily have it your way. He has faced a murderous row. By the way AJ was exposed as soon as he started facing real fighters, and he has the dubious distinction to be knockout by a 300 mexican chaparro, in 96 Tyson was a shadow of himself.

Tyson was exposed soon as he got ass beat by Buster. What was his best win before that, an old Holmes coming off a 2 year lay off, or a Spinks who spent most his career at light heavy.

[garfios]

Tyson was exposed soon as he got ass beat by Buster. What was his best win before that, an old Holmes coming off a 2 year lay off, or a Spinks who spent most his career at light heavy.

1990 was the beginning of the end withina year he was in real big trouble, that wasn't an expose more like he wad exposing himself. Holmes was old, no glory on that, but he was never knock out before nor after Tyson, it's funny your point it that Spinks was a career LHW and dismiss the win because of that, when in fact they match very even in size, the other thing is we praised him when he won the title from Holmes, but take away from Mike when he destroyed him, seems to me you using a very selective narrative, you not mentioning Tucker, Razor, Berbick, Thomas, Smith and Bruno, while not ATG they were not journeymen and any of them would have given a run for their money to any present champ. You probably were not born back them or you're a british fan, back then Tyson was the scariest fighter in the world, earning the moniker "the baddest man on the planet".

[Elheath]

As a boxer in a vacuum right now the arguement can be given for both sides IMO.

However in terms of charisma and casual pull I don't see anyone beating Tyson any time soon, if ever again. I mean Tyson was basically has more name value of Canelo and Usyk and Inoue and Mayweather and Pac combined right now, and was the star in an era where boxing popularity will never reach again.

[Boxing 112]

1990 was the beginning of the end withina year he was in real big trouble, that wasn't an expose more like he wad exposing himself. Holmes was old, no glory on that, but he was never knock out before nor after Tyson, it's funny your point it that Spinks was a career LHW and dismiss the win because of that, when in fact they match very even in size, the other thing is we praised him when he won the title from Holmes, but take away from Mike when he destroyed him, seems to me you using a very selective narrative, you not mentioning Tucker, Razor, Berbick, Thomas, Smith and Bruno, while not ATG they were not journeymen and any of them would have given a run for their money to any present champ. You probably were not born back them or you're a british fan, back then Tyson was the scariest fighter in the world, earning the moniker "the baddest man on the planet".

Yeah because back then there was no social media. So knocking out 27 journeymen in 2 years got him hype. Any fighter in the current age would be ripped apart by fans, social media you are judges by the whole world interacting all day every day. Wilder KOd just as many journeymen but is ripped apart. You see lots of top talents and they fight a journeyman in theit 10th fight and still are ripped by fans. There is more demand now from fans. Fans now are not fooled like the 80s fans who only have select media to report and show their bias. Now the whole world has a live opinion people can't be fooled as much anymore. The wins you mention are decent but he is still EASILY the most over hyped boxer in the world. By far no one comes close. This isn't me saying he wasn't good or a threat, im saying exactly what i mean "overhyped" for what he is. Just look at 2024 and peoples opinion they are hyped for a 58 yr old fighting acting like he is some real threat. They'll have bigger gloves and no way commision are authorising it as any type of real fight where Tyson can get hurt. He's a 58 yr old who's been washed 25+ years if it was real fight pro boxing rules the youtuber would KO him

[garfios]

Yeah because back then there was no social media. So knocking out 27 journeymen in 2 years got him hype. Any fighter in the current age would be ripped apart by fans, social media you are judges by the whole world interacting all day every day. Wilder KOd just as many journeymen but is ripped apart. You see lots of top talents and they fight a journeyman in theit 10th fight and still are ripped by fans. There is more demand now from fans. Fans now are not fooled like the 80s fans who only have select media to report and show their bias. Now the whole world has a live opinion people can't be fooled as much anymore. The wins you mention are decent but he is still EASILY the most over hyped boxer in the world. By far no one comes close. This isn't me saying he wasn't good or a threat, im saying exactly what i mean "overhyped" for what he is. Just look at 2024 and peoples opinion they are hyped for a 58 yr old fighting acting like he is some real threat. They'll have bigger gloves and no way commision are authorising it as any type of real fight where Tyson can get hurt. He's a 58 yr old who's been washed 25+ years if it was real fight pro boxing rules the youtuber would KO him

I don't care how old he is now or what he is doing? I mentioned a few names, but you keep talking about 27 journeymen, none of the guys I mention were journeymen at the time he fought them, actually at 20yo he fought three champions to unified the division, no social media, a lot of newspaper and magazines where people will get their news, and TV, so most of the time you would read from an expert instead of today reading from cult followers, fanboys and kids that doesn't know what they're posting. Think what you will, but just by you comparing wilder to Tyson, I know you're a biased fan and doesn't watch boxing for what it is. Be safe, son, and I really wish you have something of substance to say on your next post.

[PRINCEKOOL]

By the start of the 1990's, Mike Tyson's resume and legacy 'Had already solidified him as not just one of boxing great athletes, but one of the greatest athletes in all of sports history'.

It is not just about winning, it is also about how you win 'People live and go through their lives experiencing moments. Most people don't compile statistics, and individual data points 'Life plays out like a story, and virtual reality experience which they are vividly observing and interacting with'.

Oleksandr Uysk is the most accomplished active fighter in the entire sport of boxing, and pound for pound 'His wins over both Tyson Fury and Anthony Joshua, are the greatest feats of achievement in the sport of boxing in the last 15 years'.

But still there are multiple fighters who's boxing legacy's, performances and resumes have had a by far greater impact on the sport of boxing. Of course Muhammad Ali, Mike Tyson, Prince Naseem Hamed, Sugar Ray Leonard, and potentially even fighters such as Oscar De La Hoya, Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather Junior.

The reason why their legacy's, performances and resumes have had a greater effect than Oleksandr Uysk's 'Is because it is not just about winning, it is about how you win'.

Note: Michael Spink's was essentially the Oleksandr Uysk of the 1980's 'Mike Tyson blasted Spinks out in 91 seconds'. And for the people who may disagree with that comparison? Is Larry Holmes considered universally, as one of the greatest Heavyweight fighters and Champions of all time? Yes. Is Larry Holmes considered right now as we speak, a greater Heavyweight fighter than Tyson Fury? Yes. Well Michael Spinks beat Larry Holmes twice back to back.

Mike Tyson blasted Michael Spinks out in 91 seconds 'He did not win a split decision, or win a fight over the distance on points. The entire World categorically knew that Mike Tyson was the Heavyweight Champion of the World'.

And those are the level of performance which Mike Tyson's ability could produce 'Those moments in time, the shockwaves are still traveling through the sport. Mike Tyson's story and rise, has been told many times over. And it is still having a deep profound effect on inspiring people and fighters'.

Mike Tyson elevated himself to such a level in his career 'That he went beyond being, just a great fighter. He became a fundamental part of boxing, Mike Tyson was the fundamental image and action in physical reality, of a boxing archetype. Violence, competitiveness, raw masculinity, power. Those descriptive's can be immediately associated with Mike Tyson'.

Oleksandr Uysk is a great fighter 'But he is not that level of a fighter. Uysk has accumulated some very impressive statistics in his career. And that is how he has proved his greatness, but that is not the only way greatness is recorded or proven'.

Greatness is not just a statistic, a number of wins or titles collected 'Greatest is romance, it's moments in time which have a effect on people's lives. Mike Tyson also has a very impressive list of career statistics and data points, but he also has moments in time performances which have had a deep profound effects on the sport of boxing'.

And even if we want to talk about statistics as a Heavyweight fighter 'Oleksandr Uysk is not the level of Champion Mike Tyson was. Mike Tyson achieved 10 successful defenses of his world titles, and has fought 13 Championship fights in total. Mike Tyson also a two time World Heavyweight Champion, and deserves credit for being able to regain the World Heavyweight titles after coming out of jail'.

Greatest is not just about statistics and data points, the sport more and more in this era of boxing 'Is kind of set up, so fighters can accumulate useless statistics, that really only have relevance in this era of boxing, but not historically against past all time greatest fighters. All the weight classes, all the World titles. The day before weigh in rule, which gives the ability for fighters to play around in weight classes which during past era's they would of not be competed in'.

The cruiserweight Division was first created in 1979, and the weight limit was 190 pounds. And then in the mid 2000's the Weight Limited was moved to 200 pounds. Oleksandr Uysk has been consistently weighing in and around the 220 pound region as a Heavyweight fighter'.

If Oleksandr Uysk started his career, at the exact same time as Mike Tyson 'Is Oleksandr Uysk side by side, fight by fight competing in the Heavyweight Division? Would he of been one of those up and coming Heavyweight fighters, that the media and boxing community would say? WOW, those two up and coming Heavyweight fighters are on a collision course. The high likely-hood is that Oleksandr Uysk would not of been that level of fighter in the 1980's or 90s boxing era's. But he potentially still would of been a great fighter'.

So what type of fighter, would of Oleksandr Uysk been during the 1980's ? He would most likely of been a Cruiserweight fighter in the 190 pound division 'So he is coming up against Evander Holyfield. How would Uysk compete against Holyfield? And would Oleksandr Uysk jump from the 190 pound division, knowing that he would have to come into conflict with Iron Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis, Rid**** Bowe and all the other dangerous and formidable Heavyweight fighters of the late 80's and 90's'.

Evander Holyfield, David Haye, and Oleksandr Uysk are the three fighters in boxing history 'Who have been able to move up from the Cruiserweight Division and become the Heavyweight Champion of the World. But in reality? It was a different type of challenge which Evander Holyfield took upon himself. Holyfield went from fighting in the 190 pound Cruiserweight Division, to competing in the Heavyweight division. During one of the greatest Heavyweight era's of all time, in terms of skill for skill ability and violence'.

And for me personally, at his peak as a Heavyweight fighter or Cruiserweight fighter 'I would rate David Haye as a better fighter than Oleksandr Uysk. Haye beat all the major fighters in the Cruiserweight Division, and he won his fights by knock-out. David Haye was the Lineal and Unified Cruiserweight World Champion, and he achieved all of those feats in a more difficult manner than Oleksandr Uysk. Haye had to invade countries, and beat those Champions the old fashion way. No Super Sixx tournament was created for him'.

7th November 2009 'David Haye fought Nikola Valuev, in a fight where he was being outweighed by 7 stone. Haye weighed in at 218 pounds, vs Valuev 315 pounds. The total the weight differential in pounds between the two fighters was 98 pounds. The fight was billed as David vs Goliath.

To conclude: The main point, I am trying to make is that greatness 'Is not just a collection of career statistics or data points. Greatness is also record and proven, through moments in time. Performance's of high magnitude'.

Oleksandr Uysk is a all-time great fighter, who has impressive career statistics and many great performance's 'But not on the level of Mike Tyson. Maybe Oleksandr Uysk's rematch vs Tyson Fury II, will be a moment in time for many people. But right now as we speak? Oleksandr Uysk has not quite entered into the same realm as Mike Tyson, in terms of greatness' etc.