Not Pound for Pound…Champ for Champ 2009

[crold1]

Nice to see Cliff Rold do Hozumi Hasegawa justice. I guess Caballero should be included too. Where would Mijares have been in the list if he hadn't lost to the Raging Bull.

If and buts my friend...who knows.

As to Hasegawa, I have him 10 P4P too. He's on an outstanding run.

yeah this happened in the LHW division until Calzaghe retired, the lineal went round them all, Tarver, Jones, Hopkins etc.

Off topic here but is the Dawson vs Johnson fight for the Ring title? Can't remember what Johnson is ranked.

Not yet but Hopkins will be inactiove over a year when they meet and could have been removed from their ratings by then. I will advise he should be. He's rated too high by Ring as is considering he hasn't beaten a Light Heavy since 2006.

Good article. I think a lot of focus has gone off one of the more important things in boxing, as this article pointed out, that being a proper title reign. It can often be easier to jump between divisions fighting certain 'champions' to grab another belt and add another weight division to the resume. While it may look good on paper it often is highly misleading and not a true measure of skills or greatness. It seems that now you don't even need to rule any one division to be considered great. All you have to do is move through a few weight classes and beat a few 'name' fighters and everyone and their dog will jump on the bandwagon. Sadly, this seems more of a constant over the last decade or so.

The thing is I believe that it is more of a test to hold and unify one division these days. Jumping through and picking easy challenges or beating name fighters that are highly beatable is not the same as taking on every challenger, no matter how skilled or high good, and unifying one division and keeping that title for a long period. So few fighters actually are able to rule one division for long periods of time and unify. There are quite a number of long time champs, but are very often of the WBO/IBF type and they never unify.

The way to greatness and true legacy in the future should be the same as what it used to be. That is, a champion should rule one division, try to unify and then hold that title as long as he can defending against the best and then once that is accomplished, move up and around and all over fighting the big name/money fights that are easily winnable against the old great champs etc etc. Taking on all comers in a division, as long as there are good fighters in it, really shows the true grit, skill, will and greatness of a fighter. Taking specific fights through different weight divisions against fighters that the team knows can be definitely beaten just doesn't measure up anymore.

Great for business, bad for the true legacy of boxing and bad for the fans.

It's a point historically against Pacquiao in comparing him to guys like Armstrong who managed great title reigns and division hopping.

[BattlingNelson]

They aren't the same, but Mayweather made very clear he no longer wished to be champ through all available channels.

And to the last question: No. Marquez isn't a Welterweight. Ali-Holmes (or Johnson-Jeffries) mattered because a new king at Heavyweight emerged and the old returned to challenge. Not the case here, and the catchweight is the first indication. If Mayweather had returned to fight Mosley or Cotto, Welterweights, the winner there would be the strongest claimant.

It's still a welterweight fight and JMM fights in that division. This is not the first time a championship would be decided while the stipulated weight is below the limit yet inside the boundairies of the division.

Nope.

Doesn't work that way.He gave it up.

A case can be made that it whatever the linear champion has said it's what he does that matters. Cliff himself puts forward James Jeffries who definetely was brought out of retirement when facing Johnson and yet Johnson first gained undisputed worldwide recognition as champion after beating Jeffries as I recall it. Whether or not Jeffries is a good example it still remains that Floyd hasn't lost his title in the ring and is only 2 years removed from his latest fight so, if nothing else, he holds the strongest claim for the linear championship IMO.

[crold1]

It's still a welterweight fight and JMM fights in that division. This is not the first time a championship would be decided while the stipulated weight is below the limit yet inside the boundairies of the division.



A case can be made that it whatever the linear champion has said it's what he does that matters. Cliff himself puts forward James Jeffries who definetely was brought out of retirement when facing Johnson and yet Johnson first gained undisputed worldwide recognition as champion after beating Jeffries as I recall it. Whether or not Jeffries is a good example it still remains that Floyd hasn't lost his title in the ring and is only 2 years removed from his latest fight so, if nothing else, he holds the strongest claim for the linear championship IMO.

Yeah, but Mosley and Cotto have done so much, with Welters, since Floyd has been gone they can't be discounted. Marquez could make himself a piece of the puzzle, but the puzzle still needs connection.

And while Johnson got total recognition there, he was still the defending champ on paper.

[kayjay]

It's still a welterweight fight and JMM fights in that division.

What are you talking about, Bat? Marquez has never weighed in above 135, and has only weighed in as high as 130 three times. This might be a welterweight fight, technically speaking, but Marquez does not "fight in that division." I can't imagine that Marquez could crack the top six at WW, and if he took enough fights would likely be pushed out of the top ten.

[BattlingNelson]

What are you talking about, Bat? Marquez has never weighed in above 135, and has only weighed in as high as 130 three times. This might be a welterweight fight, technically speaking, but Marquez does not "fight in that division." I can't imagine that Marquez could crack the top six at WW, and if he took enough fights would likely be pushed out of the top ten.

What I meant KJ, is that Marquez fights his next fight in the WW division. Believe me; I'm well aware that JMM is not a WW.

[crold1]

What I meant KJ, is that Marquez fights his next fight in the WW division. Believe me; I'm well aware that JMM is not a WW.

So does Floyd.

[BattlingNelson]

So does Floyd.

Lol yeah.

Still this is sold as a legit 'p4p'-fight........

[We want Floyd]

Crold you have my vote for the next "boxing commissioner".


When I first clicked on your article, I actually skipped the article and went straight to your P4P list. I had smoke comin' out of my ears when I did not see PAC's name,hehe. In my mind I was thinking, this guy better have a good explanation. I'm glad scrolled back up. Good piece!

[crold1]

Crold you have my vote for the next "boxing commissioner".


When I first clicked on your article, I actually skipped the article and went straight to your P4P list. I had smoke comin' out of my ears when I did not see PAC's name,hehe. In my mind I was thinking, this guy better have a good explanation. I'm glad scrolled back up. Good piece!

Me too.

[Ch@mpBox@PR]

yeah this happened in the LHW division until Calzaghe retired, the lineal went round them all, Tarver, Jones, Hopkins etc.

Off topic here but is the Dawson vs Johnson fight for the Ring title? Can't remember what Johnson is ranked.

Non of those you mention were the lineal champs.

They were the RIng mag Champs but not the Lineal Champs

Zolt Erdei is teh LHW lineal Champ!!!!!