Ranking Crawford All Time Off Eye Test Alone

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

The guy who had no legs that shot his wife?

Nah the #1 ranked fighter in the division at the time.

[BodyBagz]

I’m not actually a Bud fan, like his style but I find his personality rather grating. I’m actually a big Spence, have been since he turned pro as he reminded me of a young Mike McCallum.

You can’t hate on who he beat at 135 and 140 whatsoever, they were the best the division had to offer. Klitschko never beat one HOF’er but we still appreciate his greatness. You can’t call his career fraudulent, that’s crazy talk man. His welterweight run has been majorly underwhelming but that doesn’t change what he achieved at 135 and 140.

If you look at it coldly and objectively, his resume is actually very solid:

-Defeats Burns (2 Division World Champion, #4 Ring, WBO Lightweight champion, 4 defences.)
-Defeated Beltran (#2 Ring.)
-Defeated Dulorme (#10 Ring.)
-Defeated Postol (#1 Ring, WBC Light Welterweight Champion, 0 defences.)
-Defeated Indongo (#5 Ring, Unified WBA, IBF Light Welterweight Champion, 1 defence.)
-Defeated Horn (#8 Ring, WBO Welterweight Champion, 1 Defence)
-Defeated Kavaliauskas (#10 Ring)

So if you break that down he’s defeated 7 top 10 guys and 4 top 5 guys across three divisions. He’s claimed 2 lineal titles, 6 ABC titles and 1 undisputed title, going 15-0 (12 KO’s) in World title fights, 5-0 (3 KO’s) in Lineal title fights and 8-0 (5 KO’s) against former, current or future World Champions. To suggest that represents a fraudulent career is baseless and inaccurate.

Not sure why people discuss Bud's NON WW career

Horn and Kav would NEVER be mentioned in good standing in anyone's Greatest fights list

[Ryannn]

Ranking someone off "eyetest" is dumb.

I'll look like prime SRR if I keep fighting 8 year old kids with polio.

[Citizen Koba]

We don't even know if Crawford can beat current top guys at 140 like Taylor and Prograis man, it's time to stop sugarcoating Crawford's resume

I'd be pretty confident based on their relative handling of Postol... It's what? 4 or 5 years since Bud comfortably boxed past a near prime Pistol whilst an older Victor gave Josh all he could handle until the KD. You could make a case that an even older Victor should have got the nod or a draw vs Ramirez too. I know triangles ain't perfect but I'd be pretty confident in this case.

[Scopedog]

Hard to say because we don't really know where his limit is because he makes most fights look so easy. There has been fights where he's run into some challenge like Kavaliauskas and Gamboa but he's always turned those fights on their head with adjustments to his strategy.

[Left Hook Tua]

Nah the #1 ranked fighter in the division at the time.

Not the South African track and field athlete with no legs?

Oscar postol?

[John Locke]

I'd be pretty confident based on their relative handling of Postol... It's what? 4 or 5 years since Bud comfortably boxed past a near prime Pistol whilst an older Victor gave Josh all he could handle until the KD. You could make a case that an even older Victor should have got the nod or a draw vs Ramirez too. I know triangles ain't perfect but I'd be pretty confident in this case.

The thing is look at how much pro xp both guys had when they fought Postol, Taylor has achieved everything he has in 18 fights. I consider Postol Crawford's best career win to date and Crawford definitely handled him better than Taylor, but that's one fight and there are many variables with each opponent, styles etc. I don't think Ramirez is as good as Taylor or Prograis and would favour Crawford to light him up.

But my original point was ranking Crawford in any kind of 'all time' debate is just a crazy, even if it's all theoretical. He hasn't separated himself or beaten better opponents than recent elite fighters at 140 like Taylor, Danny, Bradley etc, he's not getting anymore passes from me I'm afraid.

[elfag]

What about Oscar

and why love Shane so much. From memory he had an excellent physique and punched real fast and hard

shane gets rated super high at 135 but his resume there isnt anything special. people are just backfilling how he would have done there based on him being able to move up to 147-154 and speculating he would be even better at 135


some guys get better as they move up in weight in terms of durability and also as theyre older/more experienced. Cotto and Canelo were better at higher weights and their chin got better as they moved up from 140 and 147 respectively. I think their punch resistance suffered when they were cutting a lot to make weight. we saw them both get rocked at those weights by lesser fighters and take much more at higher weights from bigger punchers.

[elfag]

It’s a completely relevant comparison. I’m not saying he’s as great as those two guys but like Crawford has fought nobody elite at 147, Mayweather fought nobody elite at 140 and Pacquiao fought nobody elite at 135. The point is Crawford’s lack of qualify opposition at 147 doesn’t change the fact he became lineal champion at 135 and 140, and you don’t become lineal without beating the best available opposition in your division.

Hopefully when his deal runs out with Bob, he doesn’t extend and develops a working relationship with PBC, which will allow us to see him face Spence, Porter, Ugas. Thurman, Garcia etc.

floyd and pac didnt linger at 135/140 for 5 years though. they moved through them pretty quickly. Crawford has been at 147 for some time now and as the lineal/unified guy from 140 people had high hopes. He also claims to be the best welter, fights bums and continues to renew his contract with arum every time it comes up due knowing the supply of fighters that arum will give him.

Floyd and pac both became lineal at 147/140 after their brief stints at 140/135. That would be like crawford being at 147 for 2 years then going on to be lineal at 154 which isnt whats happening and he turns 34 in a few months. Look at his resume in his early 30s vs floyd/pacs early 30s resume. he wasted his prime.

[Citizen Koba]

The thing is look at how much pro xp both guys had when they fought Postol, Taylor has achieved everything he has in 18 fights. I consider Postol Crawford's best career win to date and Crawford definitely handled him better than Taylor, but that's one fight and there are many variables with each opponent, styles etc. I don't think Ramirez is as good as Taylor or Prograis and would favour Crawford to light him up.

But my original point was ranking Crawford in any kind of 'all time' debate is just a crazy, even if it's all theoretical. He hasn't separated himself or beaten better opponents than recent elite fighters at 140 like Taylor, Danny, Bradley etc, he's not getting anymore passes from me I'm afraid.

Well yeah, I agree with the thread premise being daft, I mean I mean the eye test might be cool for evaluating a fighters potential and I guess if you're into the P4P thing it's kinda necessary given the impossibility of accurately comparing dudes whio can never fight due to size difference... But 'greatness' however describe such a nebulous term has to be to do with what you actually accomplished not just how you looked doing it.

And no Ramirez isn't as good as Taylor (obviously) and if anything stylistically I think Regis might even handle him easier than Josh, but if had to put money down I would favour Bud over all 3 with little hesitation. That said I got nothing but respect for Taylor's accomplishments, despite in my estimation being less talented than Bud he took a much harder route to undisputed and has proved over and over that he has the will to dig deep when he needs to, a characteristic that can sometimes be the difference between a good fighter and a special one.