Toney vs Holmes

[Ryn0]

You are constantly confusing today's James Toney with the 1998 one. That James Toney was a cruiserweight who could smash any old heavyweight with ease. And don't forget that Toney also beat Holyfield in '03. It was only after 2005 he started slipping.

Toney IS NOT a great HW, he beat Jirov at CW and a past it Holyfield who after being beaten by Lewis seemed to have lost his ability as an elite HW.

Jirov moved up to HW remember and look at the success he had (or lack of), Holmes is alot better than you give him credit for and comparing his to an 98' Toney is still ****** because Holmes would outweigh him by some 30 lbs or more and Holmes has an incredible jab, a better jab than anyone who have faced Toney previously

[Benncollinsaad]

Toney IS NOT a great HW, he beat Jirov at CW and a past it Holyfield who after being beaten by Lewis seemed to have lost his ability as an elite HW.

Jirov moved up to HW remember and look at the success he had (or lack of), Holmes is alot better than you give him credit for and comparing his to an 98' Toney is still ****** because Holmes would outweigh him by some 30 lbs or more and Holmes has an incredible jab, a better jab than anyone who have faced Toney previously

Please! When has anyone with jab given Toney serious problems?! Even McCallum couldn't beat him and he had a great jab too. That's just my point, take away the jab and Holmes is pretty much an ordinary fighter. Hasn't got any other strong sides. His power is insufficient, his movement can't rival Toney's.

[The Gambler1981]

Ok, fair enuff. My point remains-Toney would school Holmes. Even a prime Holmes would be outhustled and outboxed by Toney. Holmes NEVER fought anyone with as good defence as Toney's. Let's see how you can deny that.

If Larry Holmes was a middleweight I might listen to your point, but the fact remain we are talking about a heavyweight fight and Larry Holmes is a far superior heavyweight fighter to James Toney.

James Toney would eat his jab all night and there really is not much Toney could do about it. James Toney was not a wrecking machine he was in tons of close fights even at his best, Holmes was much more dominant.

[GJC]

What if Toney fought Larry Holmes as a heavyweight? I believe Toney would win by a late stoppage. He could knock Holmes out, especially an old Holmes, but he'd have too much respect for him. Something Holmes didn't have for Ali. So either a TKO 10-11 or an UD for Toney.

Holmes did his job on Ali, it looked to me like he held back out of compassion.
Toney was a great fighter but Holmes at heavyweight is too much for him.
SRR was to my eyes the greatest fighter to lace on gloves but I wouldn't give him much chance against the top tier of HW's of which Holmes is one.
Toney has become a HW through ill discipline more than anything, the fact that he has been competetive proves:
a) What a great fighter he has been
b) What a truly poor era it is in the Heavyweight division.

To have him beating Holmes though is a big stretch

[Benncollinsaad]

If Larry Holmes was a middleweight I might listen to your point, but the fact remain we are talking about a heavyweight fight and Larry Holmes is a far superior heavyweight fighter to James Toney.

James Toney would eat his jab all night and there really is not much Toney could do about it. James Toney was not a wrecking machine he was in tons of close fights even at his best, Holmes was much more dominant.

Dominant against who?! Tomato cans! Compare his opposition with Toney's and you'll find out they are beyond compare. Toney fought ALL the best guys!

[Poet682006]

A lot of people believe Toney got a gift decision in the second McCallum fight.

Poet

[Ryn0]

Dominant against who?! Tomato cans! Compare his opposition with Toney's and you'll find out they are beyond compare. Toney fought ALL the best guys!

At what HW? He beat a way past prime Holyfield and Oquendo thats it.

Holmes wins at HW are MUCH better; Shaversx2 , Cooney, Spinks, Berbick, WAY past it Ali, Norton, Witherspoon, Smith, Mercer

[The Gambler1981]

Dominant against who?! Tomato cans! Compare his opposition with Toney's and you'll find out they are beyond compare. Toney fought ALL the best guys!

Like I said before learn what you are talking about before speaking on a subject. There is no point in going on from this comment~.

[MANGLER]

Holmes woulda won this 4 sho.

[Benncollinsaad]

A lot of people believe Toney got a gift decision in the second McCallum fight.

Poet

I still have to watch the entire fight. But what I saw of it, it was very close. And McCallum and Holmes can't be compared. McCallum's technique is far superior.