boxing managers trying to sign me to a contract, questions

[DC Fight Fan]

Also Alfa, don't let these guys tell you that winning a Golden Gloves title is going to boost your negotiating stance. Local GG champions are a dime a dozen. You are 26 with limited amateur experience. Therefore you truly have about a 1 in million chance of making it in pro boxing. That was not to discourage you, it was just being real. With that said, your number one goal should be to not be viewed as an opponent starting out your career. Therefore you need a connected trainer, manager or promoter that is going to make sure that you enter your first 10-15 fights with a more than fair shake at winning. During those 10-15 fights you should slowly ascend the ability level of your opponents. If you go out there with no one looking out for you, you will find yourself at 5-10 or something like that very quickly.

Question, why did you ever leave the DC area? Many more qualified trainers and gyms that are putting out top talent in the northeast than there are in Chicago. If you can really fight and if you are really serious about getting down to 140 lbs send me a message and I will put you in touch with some people that can help you. Peace.

[OnePunch]

Since financially you seem to be able to take care of yourself, you probably could get by without management at this point. But if you are going to sign with someone, here are 2 big points to consider.....

1. Can he get you fights? The best manager in the world is worthless if he doesnt have working relationships with promoters in order to get you on cards.

2. In the manager contract, make sure the language says "must offer" in regards to the number of fights per year rather than "may offer". Otherwise, he may never offer you even 1 fight, but would still have a valid contract. If you put in the "must offer", then even if he is a total hack, you can dump him for breach after the first year if he doesnt deliver. (you would also want similar wording in any promotional contracts you might eventually sign)

If you can sell some tickets though, you could probably go directly to someone like Dominic Pesoli in Chicago and he would put you on his shows without signing you as long as you can sell enough tickets to pay for both sides of your fight. Bobby Hitz used to run regular up there too, but he hasnt been doing any shows lately........

[DC Fight Fan]

I would be very careful of Pesoli. He is strictly a club guy that will use you as an opponent and has zero connections in the business. He is also pretty sleazy.

[Rockin']

Yeah now I see why I get mixed answers. None of these wanna-bees even know me, yet I feel the hate. Thanks for your advice though.

About you and your manager, well that was "back in the day", was this in the 80's? When everyone just had fun? Never thought about tomorrow? Those were the days when Mike Tyson was at his most reckless too, so was glam rockers, and everyone else. Those days of reckless trust are over.

I don't think trainers in general will ask for a contract, it's between trainers and managers.

It was in the 90's.

I can never remember when professional boxing was just for fun. It is the most serious business you can be in. No fighter ever died in the ring just for fun.

Jackie and I knew eachother from the time that I was like 15 or so. She came down to our gym with her first fighter and she was there like every night watching the happenings of the gym, she saw me grow as a fighter She was at my graduation party, I designed her logo for the Galaxy Gym for her when she opened it. It was in no way reckless trust. It was pure trust and the love similar to a mom and son. She is a great lady.

With the contract with the trainer, I realize that generally a contract will not be drawn up. It was more a thing of this trainer guy is helping you grow as a fighter but doesnt ask for a thing where as this manager guy is pushing you to sign for making a couple of connections that just about anyone in the game in that area could have probably done....................Rockin'

[OnePunch]

I would be very careful of Pesoli. He is strictly a club guy that will use you as an opponent and has zero connections in the business. He is also pretty sleazy.

that may be so, or maybe not, it doesnt really matter as long as he's not signing with him. As a club show guy myself, I can tell you a fighter needs to do at least one of the following 3 things to be able to fight on one of my shows......

1. be signed with me
2. have a relationship with a manager or trainer that I work with
3. be able to sell enough tickets to pay for their fight

If they cant do one of those things, why should I waste a slot on my show on them? Every fight I put on a show has to make sense on some level. We're not in the charity business here. By the time you figure in purses, travel, hotel, meals, insurance, and commission fees, even the cheapest 4 rounder will cost the promoter at MINIMUM $2,000. How many people here just go around giving away $2000 for giggles??

[Drunken Cat]

Don't misrepresent the young cat man. You obviously have no idea what you speak of.

Good managers most definitely front money to legitimate prospects for living expenses, training expenses etc.... For this front the manager will usually get anywhere between a 20-30% take of the negotiated purse and potentially the same % of the fighters PPV revenue if the fighter was ever fortunate to fight at that level. The manager will also try to cut endorsement deals for the fighter which the manager will also get a cut of. How else is the manager suppose to make back his investment? A good manager dealing with a legitimate prospect will usually not enforce the 20-30% owed to him until the fighter starts fighting for purses upwards of $10,000.00. Also, I haven't even got into the misconception you gave on promoter and fighter dealings. Let's finish with manager/fighter.

Say a manager signs a prospect for a $10,000 signing bonus and provides $2,500 per month in living expenses. The manager also pays out roughly $20,000 in training expenses over the 3 year building period. With those numbers his minimum investment to the the fighter at this point would be $120,000 after 3 years. The fighter if successful up to this point will be fighting for $100,000 - $150,000.00 purses maybe twice a year. Let's say it is on the high side and the fighter fights for $300,000 in year 4. At 20% the manager's return would be $60,000. Still a ways to go to recoup his initial investment. Now think of all the fighters that manager invested in that never made it to year 4. Point is that good managers spend a lot of money on a lot of fighters hoping for the chance of getting rewarded with a Pac, Mayweather, Pavlik, Mosely, etc... type of return.

Now on to the lie you said about fighter/promoter dealings....

You said, "DON'T FORGET YOU HAVE TO SPLIT YOUR CASH WITH YOUR PROMOTER".

A promoter by law can never touch any of the fighter's purse money. The promoter makes his money off of prenegotiated site fees, live gate sales, ad sales, network fees and possible PPV revenue. The promoter offers the fighter a purse to perform, if the fighter and his manager think it is fair they accept. If a fighter has a strong negotiating position, see Manny Pacquiao, he can also get a good portion of the PPV revenue on top of his agreed upon purse. PPV revenues are usually split as follows...

AFTER PRODUCTION EXPENSES ARE PAID
50% network
50% lead promoter

the caveat to this is if the fighter has negotiated a % from the promoter or if you have 2 promoters each putting their A list fighter against each other at which time they would negotiate a split of the promoter's share of the PPV revenue and accordingly negotiate the fighter's %

Great analysis, very insightful.

[mike ruler]

Stay away from fat black dudes with weird hair and last name king...lol