what had happened if RJJ had gained these fights

[Toney Loc]

He'd get his ass kicked by Toney @ CW

[sandyvahra]

He'd win most. Probably be top 10 ATG.

[#1Assassin]

i think tyson beats him, roy cant hurt him. if tyson is smart and uses his jab then goes to the body.. he stops roy.

mcclellan i also think would beat roy. granite chin, power, reach, skills.. i think he would do it.

hopkins i also think wouldve beaten roy in a rematch.

other than that its roy all the way. knocks joe silly in about 4 rounds. boxes holyfields ears of. micheal..whatever..ski gets a beatdown too. benn is to aggressive and too chinny, roy catches him and takes him out. hes too much for eubank aswell.

[larry x]

11 more fights???thats a prospects record..a bit much

[THE REED]

Of these fight I could really only rank Hopkins II, Tyson, Holyfield, Calzaghe, Michalczewski.

Tyson v. RJJ
In the Tyson fight I think Roy would dance all over him. After a few rounds of dancing Tyson starts to get frustrated and tired and RJJ can pick him off for 12 rounds. Tyson's chance, apart from landing a big shot, would be too pressure him against the ropes but at that time I don't think Tyson had the quickness or stamina to do it apart from short bursts.
RJJ by points unless Tyson gets a lucky shot.

Holyfield v. RJJ
Holyfield has more stamina and is a bit quicker than Tyson but doesn't have the power. RJJ should still be able to dance to outpoint him BUT this would be a much tougher fight. Holyfield loves to put pressure on and if he can catch him RJJ would have a tough fight.
RJJ slightly by points due to speed and better stamina but I wouldn't put it past Holyfield to outmuscle him and grab the win.

Calzaghe v. RJJ
This is an interesting one. RJJ is faster and has more power but Calzaghe has better stamina, is a better combination boxer with excellent handspeed (RJJ could combo but rarely did it unless he outclassed his opponent or got in trouble on the ropes), and will pressure his opponent which can bother RJJ. A lot of this depends on how RJJ comes into the fight. If he wants to win and lets his hands go Calzaghe could get beat. Too often though I see RJJ fighting good opponents and just being lazy while his opponents are unwilling to engage and push him because of his speed. Calzaghe will push him which would make for a great fight and a tough call. If RJJ is lazy Calzaghe wins. If RJJ comes to fight then a lot will depend on how many rounds he wins before he starts to tire and Calzaghe's stamina takes over the fight. This fight is going to points unless RJJ knocks Calzaghe down at least a couple times.

Hopkins v. RJJ II
Watching their first fight I was surprised by two things:
1. I had never seen RJJ fight off the ropes so effectively before or since.
2. Hopkins still gave RJJ lots of trouble by pushing him to the ropes and I couldn't figure out why no one else until Tarver tried that tactic as much.
I still had RJJ winning their first fight on points but I didn't have it as the blowout that the judges in attendanec had it.
By 2002 Hopkins had gotten stronger, RJJ had lost some stamina from their first match, and I think Hopkins would have beat him on points. Hopkins improved in nearly everything from their first fight while RJJ only gained power and in many ways became a sloppier boxer. However, while I think Hopkins would win I wouldn't put it past RJJ to dig deep and outpoint him.
Hopkins on point but give RJJ a chance.

Michalczewski v. RJJ
Tigers prime was 1997-2001 and I'd rather have him fight RJJ during these years. Michalczewski had a chin, terrific stamina, and would pressure his opponent all fight long while landing precise shots and deflecting/blocking his opponents punches. He was tailor made to beat RJJ. But, RJJ would have without a doubt been the fastest opponent Michal fought when it comes to both footspeed, handspeed, and dodging. Against the ropes Tiger would have eaten RJJ alive. RJJ would have thrown but Michalvzewski could take his punches and would have connected hard with his owns. RJJ's only hope would be to score enough from range to win on points. The big question would be if RJJ's hands would have been too fast for Michalczewski to block or deflect which I don't know if they were. If they aren't Michalczewski could possibly knock him out or at the very least win on points. If RJJ's hands are too fast than it becomes a tougher one too call. Either Michalczewski can get him on the ropes enough to score a TKO or win on points or RJJ can score at range and slip the ropes enough to win on TKO.

RJJ could win all of them or lose all of them. I'd see him conceivably winning 2-4 of them. Winning all would be a bit of a stretch just as losing them all would be.

I was just Curious.... when have you ever... and I mean EVER... seen Roy fatigued from HW and before?

[d9rat]

I was just Curious.... when have you ever... and I mean EVER... seen Roy fatigued from HW and before?

In heavyweight his stamina would not be an issue. He would not tire like Holyfield or Tyson would.

As a light heavy/super middleweight he would tire though. His work rate was low which is not surprising considering his style but he would still tend to tire faster than Hopkins, Calzaghe, and Michalczewski.

Those three throw punches in bunches and don't seem to tire in their prime. (Michalczewski started to tire and get sloppy in 2002 and was done within a year.).

Even at lower levels Roy would tire faster than Hopkins though. In their first fight Hopkins kept the pace up for almost the whole fight. Roy, by the end, was fighting in bursts. His bursts were fantastic though. Accurate and powerful but there were less of them as the fight went on.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying RJJ had bad stamina. His stamina was just fine it just was not as great as Hopkins, Calzaghe, and Michalczewski in their primes.

Willie Mays wasn't as great a home run hitter as Ruth but that is no slight against his power. :P

[THE REED]

In heavyweight his stamina would not be an issue. He would not tire like Holyfield or Tyson would.

As a light heavy he would tire though. His work rate was low which is not surprising considering his style but he would still tend to tire faster than Hopkins, Calzaghe, and Michalczewski.

Those three throw punches in bunches and don't seem to tire in their prime. (Michalczewski started to tire and get sloppy in 2002 and was done within a year.).

Even at lower levels Roy would tire faster than Hopkins though. In their first fight Hopkins kept the pace up for almost the whole fight. Roy, by the end, was fighting in bursts. His bursts were fantastic though. Accurate and powerful but there were less of them as the fight went on.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying RJJ had bad stamina. His stamine was just fine it just was not as great as Hopkins, Calzaghe, and Michalczewski in their primes.

Willie Mays wasn't as great a home run hitter as Ruth but that is no slight against his power. :P

I still dont understand how you come to the conclusion he would tire... just because he wasnt a volume puncher.

THat doesn't really prove or mean anything.

He was a hit you and not be hit style fighter, being a volume puncher would negate what he liked to do.

He has never been tired in a fight, ever... ruiz or before... so to say he would tire... just doesnt make sense to me.

[d9rat]

It depends on what you mean by "tired". In my eyes RJJ never looked tired before the Tarver fights.

But he did tire, I mean to say slow down, in the Hopkins fight and the Ruiz fight. Ruiz because of the weight and Hopkins because of the pressure.

He wasn't tired in those fights but he did slow down. Unfortunately no one pressured him like Hopkins did until after the heavyweight stint so it's tough to say how much he would have tired against pressure before age and the weight loss.

Based on the Hopkins fight and the Tarver fights (a little bit based on the Calzaghe fight) I see RJJ tiring under pressure. His stamina certainly seems better at weights under light heavy but I don't see him having better stamina than Hopkins, Calzaghe, and Michalczewski in their primes. He did have other attributes that could trump stamina which I did mention.

[THE REED]

It depends on what you mean by "tired". In my eyes RJJ never looked tired before the Tarver fights.

But he did tire, I mean to say slow down, in the Hopkins fight and the Ruiz fight. Ruiz because of the weight and Hopkins because of the pressure.

He wasn't tired in those fights but he did slow down. Unfortunately no one pressured him like Hopkins did until after the heavyweight stint so it's tough to say how much he would have tired against pressure before age and the weight loss.

Based on the Hopkins fight and the Tarver fights (a little bit based on the Calzaghe fight) I see RJJ tiring under pressure. His stamina certainly seems better at weights under light heavy but I don't see him having better stamina than Hopkins, Calzaghe, and Michalczewski in their primes. He did have other attributes that could trump stamina which I did mention.

Honestly I think using the Joe fight at all whatsoever would not even be close to accurate.

A 30 year old Roy stops 40 year old Roy.

Roy carried his fighters a lot of the time just to put on a show, but he was always in absolute ridiculous shape... and Ive never seen him even breathe with his mouth open pre Tarver...

I still can't see how you can make a prediction of Roy tiring when it has never happened in his prime. I mean you can assume, under pressure... he might, but there is nothing to say he would.

Also, Calzaghe's workrate would be offset by Roys lightning fast counterpunching in his prime. Roy NOW couldnt keep Joe off of him, Prime Roy, Joe would definitely respect... and would not be flurrying too much or hed find himself in trouble.

168 Roy was the fastest and most powerful.

[d9rat]

Honestly I think using the Joe fight at all whatsoever would not even be close to accurate.

A 30 year old Roy stops 40 year old Roy.

Roy carried his fighters a lot of the time just to put on a show, but he was always in absolute ridiculous shape... and Ive never seen him even breathe with his mouth open pre Tarver...

I still can't see how you can make a prediction of Roy tiring when it has never happened in his prime. I mean you can assume, under pressure... he might, but there is nothing to say he would.

Also, Calzaghe's workrate would be offset by Roys lightning fast counterpunching in his prime. Roy NOW couldnt keep Joe off of him, Prime Roy, Joe would definitely respect... and would not be flurrying too much or hed find himself in trouble.

168 Roy was the fastest and most powerful.

Honestly, his style makes it tough to judge if he tires. In later rounds his counter-flurries seem to have less power (though tough to say as a viewer) and he tends to take longer between jumping in with a shot or a quick burst. Against lesser opponents this doesn't show because he was so talented he could walk over them. Against Hopkins it showed a bit though he saved some for a brilliant 10th round. In the later rounds, save for 10, he just didn't look as sharp.

Against Tarver, Johnson, and Calzaghe he did tire. For those fights he was ages 34-39. Against Joe he was just too old. Against Tarver and Johnson... well, maybe it was the pressure and maybe it was the weight and age. Tough to say since no one, outside of Hopkins, pressured him at all before then.

Pressure would have been brought by Michalczewski, Calzaghe, and Hopkins because that's how they fought. I don't think he would have beat all three but I would certainly not have bet against RJJ though. He was a great fighter in his prime when he felt like fighting*.

They would have been great fights.

*See first Griffin fight for him not feeling like fighting.