Manny Pacquiao is not top 10-30 all time...

[Alibata]

Think? Roach himself knows DLH was a zombie. Any1 with eyes knows that wasn't a fresh DLH. He did nothing in there. I said Hatton was a good fighter and Marquez very good.

You know what I said...

People don't look back at marciano's record and say he beat a shot joe lewis. They just know he beat joe lewis. There are many fighters in your top 30 that had notable wins againts fighters you can call faded or drained. Just that people are so protective of letting people into a fraternity of ATG legends. It is probably harder for someone like manny to break barriers but he already has. 30 years from now nobody is going to say pac beat a "faded" morales who is the same age as manny having started at the same age and fought wars, yet Manny is in his prime now. People will see the longevity and durability that guys like Morales or Barrera did not have and that pacquiao did.

[-EX-]

Well no one is arguing that Pacquiao is better than Leonard should he beat Floyd. That's for another debate--Leonard is a top ten all-timer IMO. And I see no reason why Manny wouldn't be either if he handed Floyd his first defeat. That would be two MONSTER wins on his resume. How many more do you need? Notice how you had to use Leonard - a top ten all-timer - to counter? Then you look at the rest of the Pacquiao's dossier. It's extensive...dude, this guy was the flyweight champ. FLYWEIGHT. What other flyweight could beat a prime HOF champ at featherweight? And then dispatch the consensus top junior welter in two? Methinks you're pulling a Hatton and underestimating Pacquiao.

George Foreman has 2 and maybe 3 ATG's on his resume. You'd rank him below Pacquiao? Your putting too much on weight. Pac turned pro as a late teen. His body grew into the weight. If you go up in weight and fight bums it means nothing(not sayin he did). Opponents is what matters when its over.

Floyd has titles in 5 weightclasses but people don't rank him too high cuz his opponents aren't the best...

[baracuda]

Then leave the thread...nowhere have you even offered to put up an argument. Your acting like I said Pacquiao was a bum. I said if he beats Floyd he's the fighter of the decade...

sorry but i like to read and plus i already saw what i think about this topic so no need to repeat it!

[m00ks]

Enough with the weight divisions Floyd went from 130-154, facing average opposition at times. Pacquiao didn't just stock up on food and move up his body grew into it. The weightclasses business is really overrated...opponents is all that matters.

Are you insane? They have weight classes for a reason not cuz they feel like making them up. Why do you think great fighters from higher weights are able to climb the ladder more? And no one from flyweight has ever made it pas 130/135? It's called bone density. While Floyd packed ~15 pounds of muscle to fight at an elite level, Pac put on ~30.

[MakeDamnSure]

Pac will end on the Top 10, no matter what **** you'll do....
Deep inside you know he's in there, you're just in denial...

[-EX-]

People don't look back at marciano's record and say he beat a shot joe lewis. They just know he beat joe lewis. There are many fighters in your top 30 that had notable wins againts fighters you can call faded or drained. Just that people are so protective of letting people into a fraternity of ATG legends. It is probably harder for someone for manny to break barriers but he already has. 30 years from now nobody is going to say pac beat a "faded" morales who is the same age as manny having started at the same age and fought wars. Yet Manny is in his prime.

They sure as hell do. If they lived during that time they'll tell you how it was. In that case letz give Floyd props for beating a old DLH, or maybe even give props to the guys who beat old Tyson. That logic doesn't make sense.

And its well documented Morales struggled to make weight the second fight and he had been thru 3 wars wit Morales. I aint say Morales was past prime I said he was weight drained...

[FasTHarD]

The man is a great fighter and has the opportunity to be the greatest of his decade but that doesn't place him that high on the all time list. For samples I looked at ESPN's list.

1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Henry Armstrong
4. Joe Louis
5. Willie Pep
6. Roberto Duran
7. Benny Leonard
8. Jack Johnson
9. Jack Dempsey
10. Sam Langford
11. Joe Gans
12. Sugar Ray Leonard
13. Harry Greb
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Jimmy Wilde
16. Gene Tunney
17. Mickey Walker
19. Stanley Ketchel
20. George Foreman
21. Tony Canzoneri
22. Barney Ross
23. Jimmy McLarnin
24. Julio Cesar Chavez
25. Marcel Cerdan
26. Joe Frazier
27. Ezzard Charles
18. Archie Moore
28. Jake LaMotta
29. Sandy Saddler
30. Terry McGovern

I know some don't like this list but who on here that is notable to you outside of maybe Chavez(and he even has a billion wins) would you put Pacquiao ahead of?

And please, this thread has nothing to do with Mayweather cuz he aint in the top 30 either.

No Pac, No Hearns, No Whitaker.. You're least is horible.

[IMDAZED]

George Foreman has 2 and maybe 3 ATG's on his resume. You'd rank him below Pacquiao? Your putting too much on weight. Pac turned pro as a late teen. His body grew into the weight. If you go up in weight and fight bums it means nothing(not sayin he did). Opponents is what matters when its over.

Floyd has titles in 5 weightclasses but people don't rank him too high cuz his opponents aren't the best...

Refresh my memory, who are the two maybe three ATG's Foreman beat?

But getting back to the point, I don't think you can ever put too much on weight in a sport where our divisions/conferences are measured by it. Yes, his body grew into the weight..and? It's bad to grow? He's been a champ everywhere he's been. And yes, if you go up and fight bums it means nothing...why bring it up if it has nothing to do with Pacquiao? And YES, opponents matter--wasn't that what we were discussing? What happened?

[-EX-]

Are you insane? They have weight classes for a reason not cuz they feel like making them up. Why do you think great fighters from higher weights are able to climb the ladder more? And no one from flyweight has ever made it pas 130/135? It's called bone density. While Floyd packed ~15 pounds of muscle to fight at an elite level, Pac put on ~30.

If Pac was a grown ass man and moved up that much I'd be shocked. He was a teenager. His body hadn't finished maturing yet. And like some1 sed earlier Floyd around that age was fighting around that weight as well...so if he had turned pro he would have gone all the way to 154 winning belts!

[Weebler I]

Think? Roach himself knows DLH was a zombie. Any1 with eyes knows that wasn't a fresh DLH. He did nothing in there. I said Hatton was a good fighter and Marquez very good.

You know what I said...

Oscar wasn't a zombie that was an excuse that no one should buy. He just couldn't pin Pac, that's the reason 'he did nothing in there'. The little guy was too elusive, that's why you have Oscar holding the back of his head to get punches in.