When did Joe Calzaghe become an ATG??

[Rich Loc]

[IMG]http://i45.***********.com/albums/f90/Guled89/GFF.jpg[/IMG]

[Abstraction]

He didn't.

You got to go Prime v Prime again an Elite fighter for a start.

[SkilledB]

neither do his skills

i agree, but we can't take away what he's done feel me?

[rizkybizness]

i agree, but we can't take away what he's done feel me?

i know, i agreed with your post and was just adding a minor detail

[THE REED]

[IMG]http://i45.***********.com/albums/f90/Guled89/GFF.jpg[/IMG]

Right after he beat Prime Bernard and Roy... two pound for pound legends...

[Technical_Skill]

Probably after 21 title defenses (Including Pudwill, Thornberry, Ashira, Mc Intyre, Veit x2, Starrie, salem, sobot and manfredo) winning all of the belts at 168 (In probably the worst division in boxing at the time), then moving up and beating top 5 p4p Hopkins (43 years old, controversial decision).

There you go.

[Abstraction]

There you go.

Roflmao... You are actually going to say someone is a Boxing superstar for beating those guys?

Look at a Proper Resume, like Hopkins

De La Hoya, Winky Wright, Joppy, Trinidad, Pavlik, Tarver, Allen, Eastman, Glen Johnson etc.

All those, Prime v Prime, is what you call big wins.

Who has Joe beat Prime v Prime who is a decent fighter. Only one that comes to mind is Kessler, but even then, he is nothing but a tomato-can chaser

[THE REED]

Roflmao... You are actually going to say someone is a Boxing superstar for beating those guys?

Look at a Proper Resume, like Hopkins

De La Hoya, Winky Wright, Joppy, Trinidad, Pavlik, Tarver, Allen, Eastman, Glen Johnson etc.

All those, Prime v Prime, is what you call big wins.

Who has Joe beat Prime v Prime who is a decent fighter. Only one that comes to mind is Kessler, but even then, he is nothing but a tomato-can chaser

I think you completely missed what technical skill did there...

[Libido Sanchez]

Full disclosure, I'm not a Calzaghe fan and I think his fans hype him up mostly because he's a European fighter (and I know some of his fans feel like this is the main reason he's hated on, and I can understand how they can interpret it that way).

Often, too much emphasis is on Joe's "0." There's fighters like Ali and Duran who don't have perfect records, but there is no doubt that they are ATGs (at least there shouldn't be any doubt, but these days I'm not surprised by outrageous statements anymore). An undefeated record shouldn't automatically get you ATG status, IMO, mainly because I don't think perfect necessarily = great.

Sure, it can be tough defending your title 20 times, but what's the level of adversity involved? What are the real tangible risks involved? Overcoming real adversity and risk is what I think should qualify for greatness not just statistics. Statistics can support your claim, but although there's fans that can rattle off stats like Rain Man, it should be more about the great moments that you can easily re-live in your brain. And even if you get the W, HOW did you get that W?

Of course, there are those special athletes who everyone knows are among the greatest from early on in their pro careers. Other greats take time to get recognition. Calzaghe is fresh in his fan's minds. But let's wait to see what people are saying 10, 15, 20 years down the line. Those who gave us truly great memories stand the test of time.

[rizkybizness]

I think you completely missed what technical skill did there...

the bus left town without him