Calzaghe: "Pavlik is Full of Bull****, Overhyped Fighter"

[bsrizpac]

Oh come on. The legitimate fights for Pavlik are Abraham, Kessler and Joe. Pavlik's next fight is at LHW, the class above Kessler.

I'm not arguing the truthfulness or falseness of that statement. I'm asking you why you changed your tune.

[abadger]

What makes them good?

Siaca was WBA champ when he fought Kessler, having beaten Mundine.
Mundine was a former world champion, and highly ranked in the SMW division.
Andrade fights for a title in his next bout in an-all top ten fight with Bute.

They are all good boxers, I'm sorry that for you the only way to respect is to beat a famous Yank.

[abadger]

I'm not arguing the truthfulness or falseness of that statement. I'm asking you why you changed your tune.

From what?

[bsrizpac]

Siaca was WBA champ when he fought Kessler, having beaten Mundine.
Mundine was a former world champion, and highly ranked in the SMW division.
Andrade fights for a title in his next bout in an-all top ten fight with Bute.

They are all good boxers, I'm sorry that for you the only way to respect is to beat a famous Yank.

I think the problem here is mostly that the SM division has historically been ****.

It's not about Yanks. Don't go playing the Dirk insecure card. It's about fighting the best.

When Kostya was the best no one went damn ****ing Aussie. People around here loved him. You fight the best. Period. If you fight clowns,that's fine but don't give me the Kessler "would, could" stuff.

[IMDAZED]

Siaca was WBA champ when he fought Kessler, having beaten Mundine.
Mundine was a former world champion, and highly ranked in the SMW division.
Andrade fights for a title in his next bout in an-all top ten fight with Bute.

They are all good boxers, I'm sorry that for you the only way to respect is to beat a famous Yank.

Nice try to duck and dodge with the "Yank" comment. Sorry, I won't touch it.

Back to the task...what makes them good?

Who did Siaca beat that made him good?

Who did Mundine beat that made him good?

And Andrade?

Did these three ever lose? You can answer that too, thanks.

[bsrizpac]

From what?

You have argued before in defense of Joe that "jones, toney, hopkins" were not in his weight class so him facing them wasn't required- the fact that it happened is not a huge deal.

now you say that Pavlik's most legit challenge is Kessler. Fine. But aren't they in different weight classes?

[abadger]

Nice try to duck and dodge with the "Yank" comment. Sorry, I won't touch it.

Back to the task...what makes them good?

Who did Siaca beat that made him good?

Who did Mundine beat that made him good?

And Andrade?

Did these three ever lose? You can answer that too, thanks.

Here is what boxrec has:

Siaca beat Mundine for the WBA title.

Mundine beat Echols in an eliminator for the WBA title

Andrade beat Otis Grant in a WBC title eliminator.

It is their ability to do these things that causes me to judge them as being 'good' boxers, note, not 'great'.

Yes they have all lost, sometimes to not-so-good opposition, in Andrades's case, only to Kessler. Does this make them, 'bad'?

What is your criteria to be 'good'. Be a) Bernard Hopkins, b) Antonio Tarver, c) Glen Johnson, d) Roy Jones, e) Chad Dawson, f) Kelly Pavlik?

[THE REED]

u ready?????

[abadger]

You have argued before in defense of Joe that "jones, toney, hopkins" were not in his weight class so him facing them wasn't required- the fact that it happened is not a huge deal.

now you say that Pavlik's most legit challenge is Kessler. Fine. But aren't they in different weight classes?

Calzaghe boxed rigidly at SMW all his career. If he went back and forth between SMW and LHW then there would be a better case for him 'having' to have fought say Tarver and Johnson, Jones if he could get him, I even think he should have moved up earlier.

Pavlik by contrast beat Taylor at MW, fought him again at what was really SMW and is now going to LHW for his next fight. I think he deserves a lot of credit for facing Hopkins, but if he can box at LHW he can certainly box Kessler at SMW. Joe never did fight above SMW, which might be a good or a bad thing.

[abadger]

u ready?????

OK, lets do it. You start the thread.