hopkins became a legend in an ocean. calzaghe became a legend in a swimming pool.

[Stormin' Norman]

and that's all I gotta say...

ill bet all my points on a hopkins victory, provided one of you calzaghe supporters are dumb enough to give me 2 to 1 odds.

[supermandathoe]

Lol the first half of the sentence sounded admirable and confident, the second half made you sound like an unsure *****.

[Bizzle_LDN]

What a ridiculous statement. I suggest the Britain Vs. USA thread for a proper discussion.

[abadger]

I am tired of seeing US fans claim that US boxers are head and shoulders above all the rest of the world's fighters.

The reality of most elite US fighters career is this: They spend their prime years holding and acquiring titles, usually against opposition not as good as themselves, but sometimes acquiring one or two good wins along the way. Towards the end of this period they start to be acclaimed as legends. Then they start fighting the other 'legends' in and around their weight, and their results become mixed. When faced with fighters of equal or similar ability they start to win some, lose some. Since the US fans and media have long since agreed that these fighters are 'legends', their losses have absolutely no impact on their legacy whatsoever, at least in the eyes of US fans, and fighters like Winky, Hopkins, Jones, Trinidad etc remain acclaimed as essentially unbeatable monsters well into their thirties and past their primes. This even happens to average fighters like Tarver.

These fighters never leave America, which consistently puts them at an advantage over any foreign champions who visit, but means they are never tested in similar circumstances to the foreign fighters they beat. This is justified by saying that the US is the "mecca of boxing", but really this is nothing more than US hubris. The United States is just another country, a very large one its true, but still just a country. Try telling a Cuban or Mexican that the US is the mecca of boxing. It is only the mecca of boxing for US fighters and fans.

Meanwhile, any foreign champion, no matter how impressive his record, is derided as protected. If he comes to the US and loses he is instantly a bum. Look at what people say about Hatton. US fans choose to focus intently on any loss suffered by foreign fighters as undeniable eveidence of their mediocrity, bumness and crow that they have been exposed. Meanwhile they look right on past the gaps in the records of their own fighters.

I am not trying to stir anything up here, there are lots of US fight fans with balanced views, just as fans of foreign fighters like me can sometimes be too generous to our own favourites. I am merely responding to the thread starter's claims about oceans and swimming pools, which are symptomatic of this "better than all the rest" perception you sometimes see from US fans and especially on these boards.
________
Vaporizer Manufacturers

[Bizzle_LDN]

I am tired of seeing US fans claim that US boxers are head and shoulders above all the rest of the world's fighters.

The reality of most elite US fighters career is this: They spend their prime years holding and acquiring titles, usually against opposition not as good as themselves, but sometimes acquiring one or two good wins along the way. Towards the end of this period they start to be acclaimed as legends. Then they start fighting the other 'legends' in and around their weight, and their results become mixed. When faced with fighters of equal or similar ability they start to win some, lose some. Since the US fans and media have long since agreed that these fighters are 'legends', their losses have absolutely no impact on their legacy whatsoever, at least in the eyes of US fans, and fighters like Winky, Hopkins, Jones, Trinidad etc remain acclaimed as essentially unbeatable monsters well into their thirties and past their primes. This even happens to average fighters like Tarver.

These fighters never leave America, which consistently puts them at an advantage over any foreign champions who visit, but means they are never tested in similar circumstances to the foreign fighters they beat. This is justified by saying that the US is the "mecca of boxing", but really this is nothing more than US hubris. The United States is just another country, a very large one its true, but still just a country. Try telling a Cuban or Mexican that the US is the mecca of boxing. It is only the mecca of boxing for US fighters and fans.

Meanwhile, any foreign champion, no matter how impressive his record, is derided as protected. If he comes to the US and loses he is instantly a bum. Look at what people say about Hatton. US fans choose to focus intently on any loss suffered by foreign fighters as undeniable eveidence of their mediocrity, bumness and crow that they have been exposed. Meanwhile they look right on past the gaps in the records of their own fighters.

I am not trying to stir anything up here, there are lots of US fight fans with balanced views, just as fans of foreign fighters like me can sometimes be too generous to our own favourites. I am merely responding to the thread starter's claims about oceans and swimming pools, which are symptomatic of this "better than all the rest" perception you sometimes see from US fans and especially on these boards.

Thats a great statement, a good piece of writing to finish off a ridiculous unjustified thread.

[SkilledB]

I am tired of seeing US fans claim that US boxers are head and shoulders above all the rest of the world's fighters.

The reality of most elite US fighters career is this: They spend their prime years holding and acquiring titles, usually against opposition not as good as themselves, but sometimes acquiring one or two good wins along the way. Towards the end of this period they start to be acclaimed as legends. Then they start fighting the other 'legends' in and around their weight, and their results become mixed. When faced with fighters of equal or similar ability they start to win some, lose some. Since the US fans and media have long since agreed that these fighters are 'legends', their losses have absolutely no impact on their legacy whatsoever, at least in the eyes of US fans, and fighters like Winky, Hopkins, Jones, Trinidad etc remain acclaimed as essentially unbeatable monsters well into their thirties and past their primes. This even happens to average fighters like Tarver.

These fighters never leave America, which consistently puts them at an advantage over any foreign champions who visit, but means they are never tested in similar circumstances to the foreign fighters they beat. This is justified by saying that the US is the "mecca of boxing", but really this is nothing more than US hubris. The United States is just another country, a very large one its true, but still just a country. Try telling a Cuban or Mexican that the US is the mecca of boxing. It is only the mecca of boxing for US fighters and fans.

Meanwhile, any foreign champion, no matter how impressive his record, is derided as protected. If he comes to the US and loses he is instantly a bum. Look at what people say about Hatton. US fans choose to focus intently on any loss suffered by foreign fighters as undeniable eveidence of their mediocrity, bumness and crow that they have been exposed. Meanwhile they look right on past the gaps in the records of their own fighters.

I am not trying to stir anything up here, there are lots of US fight fans with balanced views, just as fans of foreign fighters like me can sometimes be too generous to our own favourites. I am merely responding to the thread starter's claims about oceans and swimming pools, which are symptomatic of this "better than all the rest" perception you sometimes see from US fans and especially on these boards.

This is the mecca of boxing, the Us has more champions(because of population) and the skill of fighters is better, PBF,RJJ,hopkins,Toney,Winky, SSR,SRL,Ali, Fraizer,Louis,Liston the list goes on of great american fighters and the UK champs are shadowed but the US champs, when hopkins was winning fights and titles the level of talent in the division was great, he even lost too Taylor twice in two great fights. Calzaghe,Hatton, and haye are good fighters, Haye is the best in the HW division imo, hatton can still be a force at 140, but calz is the one that gets me, he diddn't begin to rise to the top of the boxing world till after his fight with Bika in 2006, then lacey, then Manfredo(see where im getting at?) he came into this top spots being bums, and Floyd made hatton look like a bum from a one sided bout. if you look at my sig, they all have beat champs and former champs defending their title. We says we have the best fighters in the world because we do and the talent pool is much better and bigger then anywhere else(sorry cuba,P-rico,Mexico,Uk,Russia etc...)

[Nicky_Hatton]

Ocean? You mean sea pal.

Still **** metaphor.

[sterling]

I am tired of seeing US fans claim that US boxers are head and shoulders above all the rest of the world's fighters.

The reality of most elite US fighters career is this: They spend their prime years holding and acquiring titles, usually against opposition not as good as themselves, but sometimes acquiring one or two good wins along the way. Towards the end of this period they start to be acclaimed as legends. Then they start fighting the other 'legends' in and around their weight, and their results become mixed. When faced with fighters of equal or similar ability they start to win some, lose some. Since the US fans and media have long since agreed that these fighters are 'legends', their losses have absolutely no impact on their legacy whatsoever, at least in the eyes of US fans, and fighters like Winky, Hopkins, Jones, Trinidad etc remain acclaimed as essentially unbeatable monsters well into their thirties and past their primes. This even happens to average fighters like Tarver.

These fighters never leave America, which consistently puts them at an advantage over any foreign champions who visit, but means they are never tested in similar circumstances to the foreign fighters they beat. This is justified by saying that the US is the "mecca of boxing", but really this is nothing more than US hubris. The United States is just another country, a very large one its true, but still just a country. Try telling a Cuban or Mexican that the US is the mecca of boxing. It is only the mecca of boxing for US fighters and fans.

Meanwhile, any foreign champion, no matter how impressive his record, is derided as protected. If he comes to the US and loses he is instantly a bum. Look at what people say about Hatton. US fans choose to focus intently on any loss suffered by foreign fighters as undeniable eveidence of their mediocrity, bumness and crow that they have been exposed. Meanwhile they look right on past the gaps in the records of their own fighters.

I am not trying to stir anything up here, there are lots of US fight fans with balanced views, just as fans of foreign fighters like me can sometimes be too generous to our own favourites. I am merely responding to the thread starter's claims about oceans and swimming pools, which are symptomatic of this "better than all the rest" perception you sometimes see from US fans and especially on these boards.

gd statement owned.. nuff said thread closed usa isnt the mecca of boxing imo.

[Bizzle_LDN]

This is the mecca of boxing, the Us has more champions(because of population) and the skill of fighters is better, PBF,RJJ,hopkins,Toney,Winky, SSR,SRL,Ali, Fraizer,Louis,Liston the list goes on of great american fighters and the UK champs are shadowed but the US champs, when hopkins was winning fights and titles the level of talent in the division was great, he even lost too Taylor twice in two great fights. Calzaghe,Hatton, and haye are good fighters, Haye is the best in the HW division imo, hatton can still be a force at 140, but calz is the one that gets me, he diddn't begin to rise to the top of the boxing world till after his fight with Bika in 2006, then lacey, then Manfredo(see where im getting at?) he came into this top spots being bums, and Floyd made hatton look like a bum from a one sided bout. if you look at my sig, they all have beat champs and former champs defending their title. We says we have the best fighters in the world because we do and the talent pool is much better and bigger then anywhere else(sorry cuba,P-rico,Mexico,Uk,Russia etc...)

OK well is your going on who has the most world titles then Europe is the mecca of boxing!


USA: 17 World titles.
Europe 20 (21 including Russia, as I believe Russia should not be included as it is unpopular and such a vast population.)


With the European countires that currently have a world champion the population total is...(UK, Hungary, Ukraine, Germany, Uzbekistan, Romania, France) the population total is approx. 105+10+64+21+26+82)

=308 million... A margine higher then USA's population of 303 million... But 3 more world titles (4 more including Russia).

[abadger]

OK well is your going on who has the most world titles then Europe is the mecca of boxing!


USA: 17 World titles.
Europe 20 (21 including Russia, as I believe Russia should not be included as it is unpopular and such a vast population.)


With the European countires that currently have a world champion the population total is...(UK, Hungary, Ukraine, Germany, Uzbekistan, Romania, France) the population total is approx. 105+10+64+21+26+82)

=308 million... A margine higher then USA's population of 303 million... But 3 more world titles (4 more including Russia).

Nice. Case closed forever I think.
________
Fisting French