Who was the best: Ali or Louis?

[squealpiggy]

The transcendence of one fight (Louis-Schmelling II) vs the the transcendece of one career (Muhammad Ali).

If you went up to a random person and asked them about Ali, they'd know what you were talking about, guarunteed. But you walk up and ask them about Louis-Schmelling, and there's about a 70% chance you'll get a blank stare.

Well both Schmeling fights were of import, with the second one being more significant. But Louis was a dominant champion and was historically important for other reasons than the War for both the sport and civil rights in general. He was a major player in encouraging the acceptance of black athletes in mainstream sports.

[Sweet Pete]

Ali also got up in 4 seconds, and went back to his corner on non-wobbly legs. Watch the footage. The footage I have seen doesn't look like it has any cuts in it at all, and Ali has maybe a few more seconds than usual. The whole story on Ali/Cooper is so immensely exagerrated it is laughable. He stopped Cooper the very next round anyway.



I watched this footage and you're right. Here's my question about all that.
In the corner after the round, Ali was obviously dazed.

Now back then were smelling salts illegal or legal to use in between rounds?
I know they are now. I don't know if they were back then because Dundee is doing something in the corner.

All the same Ali beat him again. I just always wondered that part of it.

JReckoning

I believe that is the only shady thing about it, as it looked like Ali was given smelling salts. I believe they were not allowed then either, not sure though.

[Jim Jeffries]

They did not go back to the dressing room, that is the biggest pile of bull**** ever. Many cases state it as around 12 extra seconds, while the very longest is stated as around 40 more seconds. Dressing room my ass.

Ali also got up in 4 seconds, and went back to his corner on non-wobbly legs. Watch the footage. The footage I have seen doesn't look like it has any cuts in it at all, and Ali has maybe a few more seconds than usual. The whole story on Ali/Cooper is so immensely exagerrated it is laughable. He stopped Cooper the very next round anyway.

From Ali's autobiography:

"Desperate to buy his man some time, Dundee alerted the referee to a split on Clay's glove, from which horsehair was protruding. The futile search for a replacement gained Clay an extra minute on his stool. With his powers of recovery, it was all Clay needed"

http://www.boxing-memorabilia.com/biocooper1.htm

Closer to 6 seconds, he was knocked down at 3:03 on that vid, gets up at 3:09. The bell rings at 3:05 and doesn't ring again till 4:13, plus we have no idea if it was spliced or not.

[Silencers]

I think Ali is the greatest heavyweight of all time. Louis is number 2.

Ali was the better all around fighter IMO.

And when Dundee alerted the referee that Ali had a torn glove, they never went all the way back to the dressing room. The glove never came off.

[Azteca]

Joe Louis had the greatest win of all time and was the originator of sorts.

Ali has the best resume of all time. This cant be debated.

I'm going with Ali.

Louis has the best skillset I've seen from a heavy all time though. Reason being, is that he only weighed about 207 in his prime.

[-Swizzy-]

espn's heavyweight ranking is rediculous. marciano and holmes made it in the top 10 over liston and patterson. that is crazy. what were they smoking when they made that list?

[flat1985]

Ali imo ...

[The Hammer]

Joe Louis was the greater fighter, Ali was 75% hype and is the most overrated boxer in history.

Joe Louis never lost in his prime (ages 24 to 35). Ali lost five times during that age span: age 29 to Frazier, age 31 to Norton. He was defeated three more times (including another loss to both Norton and Frazier) before his 36th birthday, but given gift decisions.

(Ali's last three official losses and Lewis last two should not be considered, because the fighters were past it when those fights happened)

[Pugilistic™]

muhammad ali

[Sweet Pete]

Joe Louis was the greater fighter, Ali was 75% hype and is the most overrated boxer in history.

Joe Louis never lost in his prime (ages 24 to 35). Ali lost five times during that age span: age 29 to Frazier, age 31 to Norton. He was defeated three more times (including another loss to both Norton and Frazier) before his 36th birthday, but given gift decisions.

(Ali's three late losses and Lewis two should not be considered, because they were past it when those fights happened)

LOL, you claiming Frazier beat Ali in their second fight is as ridiculous as if I were to claim Ali won the first fight.

Ali is all hype and overrated? He beat every single top contender and titlist of his era, every single one, which is something noone else in any weight class, ever can lay claim to. His resume is easily better than any top HW of all time, including Louis.

Louis lost to lesser fighters and was hurt by lesser fighters than Ali. And what the hell do you mean he never lost in his prime? He was surely in his prime when he lost to Schmeling by FIRST ROUND KO, or did you forget that one? Or are you gonna say his prime started after that?

Either way, Ali was banned from boxing for 3 and a half years, came back rusty, and managed, with deteriorating physical ability, to continue to clean out the HW division and beat all comers.

Ali outranks Louis based on superior opposition beat and head to head ability. He was never KO'd in one round like Louis was either, and never truly KO'd period.