Does Kessler Belong with PBF and Pac?

[TheDanniIce]

Intresting list, i don't agree on Kessler being above guys like Bernard Hopkins and Winky Wright and the Marquez brothers.

I like how you have Bernard at #5 and i expect him to put a master performance and dominate Winky Wright.

[crold1]

Floyd has not beaten 12 world champs; he's beaten five men who held/would hold world titles (G. Hernandez, Corrales, Castillo, Judah, Baldomir). Don't confuse world titles with alphabet straps. With four of those per weight class, that means ****. SRR (edit) faced 12 World champs; May may soon have six.

On Rafa, the reason I don't have he and JMM higher is their age. Watch tapes from a few years back. They are fighting at a different speed now (as is Izzy Vasquez; watch Larios-Vasquez II v. Rafa-Izzy).

Historically, the best fighters are the ones at the peak of experience and natural gifts. Calzaghe is still solid but he was better and faster against Brewer. Hopkins was better seven years ago. Kessler can still fight 12 hard at full speed; most of the over-30 bunch can't. Look at MAB-JMM and how bad MAB was fading. He didn't do that against McKinney.

For those who would say: Kess doesn't deserve ranking ahead of Cal, I understand the perspective. You're weighing the whole career and that is a factor. However, of Cal's five best wins (Lacy, Mitchell, Woodhall, Reid, Eubank), aall but one were years ago. Kessler has done more over the last three years, against better, is younger...I just think at this moment he's better. Time will, hopefully, tell.

It would be easy to do what everyone does and parse conventioanl wisdom to avoid the chanc e of looking bad later but if I honestly think Kess is that good why not say it? I speak with people who have held him up for awhile but they want to see that vindicating win first. I don't need it. I'd rather look prescient if he gets, and defeats, Cal then say "I secretly thought so but can't prove it later" a la Manny Steward's prediction abilities.

[Easy-E]

Floyd has not beaten 12 world champs; he's beaten five men who held/would hold world titles (G. Hernandez, Corrales, Castillo, Judah, Baldomir). Don't confuse world titles with alphabet straps. With four of those per weight class, that means ****. SRR (edit) faced 12 World champs; May may soon have six.

On Rafa, the reason I don't have he and JMM higher is their age. Watch tapes from a few years back. They are fighting at a different speed now (as is Izzy Vasquez; watch Larios-Vasquez II v. Rafa-Izzy).

Historically, the best fighters are the ones at the peak of experience and natural gifts. Calzaghe is still solid but he was better and faster against Brewer. Hopkins was better seven years ago. Kessler can still fight 12 hard at full speed; most of the over-30 bunch can't. Look at MAB-JMM and how bad MAB was fading. He didn't do that against McKinney.

For those who would say: Kess doesn't deserve ranking ahead of Cal, I understand the perspective. You're weighing the whole career and that is a factor. However, of Cal's five best wins (Lacy, Mitchell, Woodhall, Reid, Eubank), aall but one were years ago. Kessler has done more over the last three years, against better, is younger...I just think at this moment he's better. Time will, hopefully, tell.

It would be easy to do what everyone does and parse conventioanl wisdom to avoid the chanc e of looking bad later but if I honestly think Kess is that good why not say it? I speak with people who have held him up for awhile but they want to see that vindicating win first. I don't need it. I'd rather look prescient if he gets, and defeats, Cal then say "I secretly thought so but can't prove it later" a la Manny Steward's prediction abilities.

No, world champs means they held a world title.
Hes beaten 12.

[crold1]

Yippee, he beat twelve guys who paid their sanctioning fees. I put more stock in the five real champs he beat (and give him props because that's also the most in the sport right now among the guys on my list). You can give love to Sillyman and Maid Marian if you'd like though.

[Njord777]

You must be letting emotion get to you rather than using logic if you catapult Kessler into the top 5 pound for pound. Winky Wright has fought solid, tough opposition- including the undisputed middleweight champion in Taylor. How can you ignore what he's done with himself, the men he fought- even Ike Quartey is more respected than Librado Andrade- and shove him down? Kessler is young, promising and skilled but he has not yet done what it takes to show he can bump down those men who have fought respected, tough opponents like Winky Wright and Bernard Hopkins.

In summary, whoa- calm down. You're jumping the gun. Just because fighters are younger and hungry does not mean they deserve a pound for pound list over older fighters who belong there.

[bigtime9]

Yippee, he beat twelve guys who paid their sanctioning fees. I put more stock in the five real champs he beat (and give him props because that's also the most in the sport right now among the guys on my list). You can give love to Sillyman and Maid Marian if you'd like though.

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you're list is garbage but I think everyone has told you that already

[wmute]

#1 Manny Pacquiao

that's where i stopped reading

[Gareth Ivanovic]

Even though what Kessler did last night was probably what he was supposed to do. Andrade was slow and had no defense at all, but IMO it was a pretty impressive performance. Most people would have been knocked out from a lot of those punches and Kessler kept coming even though he could have been frustrated because it seemed Andrade wasn't effected by those punches. He isn't a top p4p fighter yet. He would need some convincing wins on some good opponents to be put in the p4p category.

[Super_Lightweight]

Kudos for having Pacquiao at number one though. More people should have the nerve to say it. Pac is absolutely deserving of number one status based on the quality and fashion of his victories.

Kessler could be higher than Calzaghe based on your logic, but still not over guys like Winky and so on.

[crold1]

Still disagree. I could even go with this sort of lame logic: Wright has a rough fight with Soliman; Soliman blown out by Mundine; Kessler >>>Mundine. Mostly though, it's just a gut feeling and I'm willing to voice it. If I'm wrong, time will bear that out.