Tweet
Would that have been the greatest tragedy in boxing history? He would have been snuffed out in his prime and we would have never seen his comeback.
-
-
I will address the OP directly in a moment, but first it has to be said . . .
we all understood back in '66 (and after Ali's death it was finally confirmed) that the military made it clear Ali's role would be one of morale building: Vietnam's Joe Louis. You don't get killed standing next to Bob Hope.
Of course that is why Ali had to refuse induction, he wasn't actually being asked to defend his country, he was being asked to recruit other young men into the military via the prestige of his name. He was never actually allowed an individual decision. (Here I don't mean the Black ******s, although that was real too.)
The OP
Today we would be arguing that Ali 'would have been the greatest of the all' (the GOAT).
Although there would be some today, here on this forum, who would feel he could have easily defeated Frazier, but not Foreman, irony!
Politicians, even up to today (at least on the ********ic side) would still be invoking his name.
Finally, more young Black men would have died in Vietnam.
P.S. I guess this question actually digresses into what happens to Foreman.Last edited by Willie Pep 229; 06-05-2020, 07:12 PM. -
-
Once he became a Moslem, the jig was up. Larry Holmes practically beat that apostate to death for what he did to Sunday school. But you can't keep a Mossback down until an islander pounds him senseless and chants some Santeria spells over him. Then he'll mumble, by buggery. Then he'll mumble all right.Comment
-
Jack Dempsey was a draft dodger during WWI but never got the same amount of grief over it that Ali did.Comment
-
Plot twist. Bob Hope was planning to murder Muhammad Ali on a USO tour.Originally posted by Willie Pep 229 View Post
I think if Ali had went & got killed in the 60s we'd not really have known what was lost fully. The Frazier trilogy wouldn't have been a thing. The Foreman rope a dope wouldn't have been a thing. So much of what made Ali Ali was what come with his refusal to fight in Vietnam & the big fights in the 70s.
Hell if Ali had not lost those few years to all that Vietnam sh^t boxing history & Ali's trajectory might be off from what we know to have happened. Maybe Frazier is bigger off of meeting & beating Ali sooner or Frazier isn't as big as he got cuz Ali stifled him early & maybe Foreman surprises Ali like he surprised Frazier. All speculative but just saying lotsa things coulda ended up way differently even in the case of Ali not losing years.Comment
-
- -Dempsey had a draft deferment, but no deferment for U over abject stoopidity.Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View PostComment
-
Never would have happened he would have been doing boxing exhibitions and USO tours.
Dempsey had a deferment, didn’t dodge the draft. Also served in the Coast Guard Reserve during WWII.
Dempsey reported for duty in June 1942 at Coast Guard Training Station, Manhattan Beach, Brooklyn, New York, where he was assigned as "Director of Physical Education." As part of the ongoing war effort, Dempsey made personal appearances at fights, camps, hospitals and War Bond drives. Dempsey was promoted to lieutenant commander in December 1942 and commander in March 1944. In 1944, Dempsey was assigned to the transport USS Wakefield (AP-21). In 1945, he was on board the attack transport USS Arthur Middleton (APA-25) for the invasion of Okinawa. Dempsey also spent time aboard the USS General William Mitchell (AP-114), where he spent time showing the crew sparring techniques. Dempsey was released from active duty in September 1945 and received an honorable discharge from the Coast Guard Reserve in 1952.Comment
-
Dempsey was formally charged, tried, but acquitted. It was quite the big deal.Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
Sacramento Union
June 16th 1920
SAN FRANCISCO. June 15.—Jack Dempsey, world’s heavyweight champion, was found not guilty on a selectlve draft evasion indictment by a jury in the United States district court here today. The jury was out ten minutes. The jury took but one ballot. . . . .
https://cdnc.ucr.edu/?a=d&d=SU192006...-txIN--------1Comment
-
A contrived deferment. Letters that would have proved it were somehow not allowed in court.Originally posted by QueensburyRules View Post
"On January 23, the San Francisco Chronicle printed an open letter from Cates that rocked the sporting world. In it, she charged that Dempsey, along with Jack Kearns, the steely-eyed boozer, brawler, fleecer, and finagler, had conspired to avoid the draft. “I have positive proofs in a letter in his own handwriting, naming his manager, Jack Kearns, and two others, and telling me how they succeeded in having him put in class 4A,” Cates wrote.
On February 23, a grand jury indicted Dempsey on charges of draft-dodging, and a few days later he was shockingly arrested by a U.S. Marshall...
For the next four months, Dempsey remained in a bleak holding pattern until his trial finally began on June 8, 1920, in U.S. Federal Court in San Francisco. His good fortune, which would eventually vault him from sleeping in hobo camps to visiting the White House, held up during the trial. When the letters Maxine claimed would prove that Dempsey had knowingly dodged The Great War were ruled inadmissible in court by Judge Maurice T. Dooling, the case became a battle of character. (“The indictment was largely based on thirty-five letters from Dempsey to Maxine and other western friends, which had been uncovered by federal agent O. O. Orr,” Randy Roberts wrote in his biography of Dempsey...)
No matter how sordid the jury found the Dempsey–Cates lifestyle—graphically detailed by several witnesses—or how serious the charges against him were, the benefit of the doubt would go to the celebrity with a high-powered lawyer on one side and an amoral fixer (Jack Kearns) on the other. "
https://hannibalboxing.com/the-aspir...-bill-brennan/Comment
Comment