Roberto Duran vs. Henry Armstrong

[ShoulderRoll]

It is hard to weigh in on the topic when I do not know enough about Armstrong. However, it is easy to see that any strict referee is going to kill his chances against most great fighters. The man fought with his head, and easily out Holyfielded Holyfield. I have not seen anyone yet I thought had much chance against a peak Duran at lightweight, Armstrong included.

Hank has one thing going for him--mythic matchups are fought under rules and conditions of the older fighter. Hank may get to keep his dirty fighting after all. But I doubt if it will help him much. What is that little tyke going to do, make Duran say no mas again?

Duran beat Ken Buchanan at lightweight with a punch to the balls. He was no choir boy either.

[QueensburyRules]

Duran beat Ken Buchanan at lightweight with a punch to the balls. He was no choir boy either.

- -Nor was Ken who carried on the fight past the end of the rd bell.

Duran was already doing a number on him, hence the frustration. Ref was too scared to intervene.

[The Old LefHook]

Duran already had Buchanan crushed. It was Kenny who decided to keep punching at round's end, since he was finally having a modicum of success. Duran just followed suit.

[Rusty Tromboni]

- -Ace in the hole! Benny!!!

The same one that struggled mightily with Featherweights Kilbane and Dundee?

Not only is he going to be fighting a guy with McLarnin-level offense, he's going to be fighting a man much craftier and more slippery than ones who foiled him.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Duran beat Ken Buchanan at lightweight with a punch to the balls. He was no choir boy either.

Maybe go back and watch that fight.

But yes, everything Armstrong can do "dirty", Duran can do better. It's an ugly fight for Armstrong, and a stoppage cannot be ruled out.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Its never a bad thing to have skeptascism regarding any legacy so in a sense I guess I am inviting you to tear down. You keep referring to higher weight classes, and guys who could punch up. I don't dispute that assertion. Let me say this again because you may misunderstand this: At a higher weight punchers could be a threat to Armstrong, starting at Welter and up through Middle. Its a different ballgame!

I am talking at lightweight, around 135. And the bone of my contention is not Armstrong being a big puncher, it is his ability to not be punched out AT THAT WEIGHT... SPECIFICALLY @135 and below.

I never wanted to make the case that Armstrong fell off Rusty. How can a guy who fought that long "fall off?" It was just a statement. Your pinning too much to it frankly. Armstrong fought for years.

Regarding whom Hank should avoid: Uppercuts. I think a great boxer punchers, But they have to fight Hank at a weight where power translates better: Welter, or Middle. I posted a film detailing weaknesses that Armstrong had and I don't know if I buy the left hook so much, the angle is all wrong. To me you would want to have a very accurate jab, an uppercut, and be able to have the strength to keep your ground under you, hence...the need to fight Armstrong at welter at least, to beat him up.

Think of it this way: how much stronger is a guy who weighs 150 and can bench press 300 pounds, than a guy 200 pounds who can bench the same weight? Now think of real usable strength: Being pushed back on your heels, snapping a pole arm jab into someone's face... If that someone is Hank, at 135 you will be facing a very strong bull and your punches and body have much less weight to use against him. At 155 ish and above, even slightly below, your weight becomes more of a factor when you snap that jab with weight front foot, when you grapple for position, etc.

Rusty this is straight out of your playbook...aren't you the one who places a premium on strength vis a vis size?

You still haven't actually told me what Zivic can do better than Duran.

If that's got you stumped, then what could Freddie Miller do that Duran couldn't?

If Armstrong ducked Miller, why should we even believe he'd enter the ring against Duran?

[Rusty Tromboni]

; I mean the dude went 27-0 in 1937. But I'd favor Duran to win more often than not here.

Again no bodies.

I bet in 2020, Duran (who's pretty much a stand-in for Fluffy) could still go 27-0, if he were fighting 12 year olds.

that 27-0 was soon unraveled once he stepped up his level of competition.

[Rusty Tromboni]

It is hard to weigh in on the topic when I do not know enough about Armstrong. However, it is easy to see that any strict referee is going to kill his chances against most great fighters. The man fought with his head, and easily out Holyfielded Holyfield. I have not seen anyone yet I thought had much chance against a peak Duran at lightweight, Armstrong included.

Hank has one thing going for him--mythic matchups are fought under rules and conditions of the older fighter. Hank may get to keep his dirty fighting after all. But I doubt if it will help him much. What is that little tyke going to do, make Duran say no mas again?

Hmmm, funny you should say all that. I wonder where you might have read that insight? Really scratching my head on this one.


Anyway, if you read the ENTIRETY of my post, you'd see that Armstrong's predecessors got away with exactly the moves needed to foil that head-first charge.

Seriously, seeing a dude coming in head-first and throwing 1,000s of punches stops the heart of anyone who has ever been in a real fight, or trained any martial art. If you do that anywhere other than a Boxing ring you WILL get wrecked.

Watch how McFarland and Kilbane have Karate style stances. No one in K-1 or MMA has EVER fought that way either.

[The plunger man]

Duran beats him convincingly ....Duran was too versatile

[The plunger man]

U have Alzheimers?

Lomachenko couldn't beat Salido but he's going to beat Henry Armstrong?

AgIn the pbc crew and there crazy notions.......nice to know that you didn’t mention it was lomas 2nd professional fight lol.
Salido would not win one round if that fight took place now you know and I know it.
Me coming from a background of following the greats of the sport in Louis , Ali , Leonard and so on and I can say loma is easily one of the most skilled boxers I have ever seen....it’s only your prejudice and pride that stops you admitting it also