Who are some of the best defensive fighters who didn't use the philly shell?

[SheenLantern]

Floyd, Pernell, Toney, Benitez etc, it seems like all of the all-time greats used at least some kind of variation of it.

[Marchegiano]

Floyd, Pernell, Toney, Benitez etc, it seems like all of the all-time greats used at least some kind of variation of it.

Reckon that depends on your terms.

To me, as in in my day , Archie Moore didn't shell he used a cross arm defense. I reckon it's the same damn thing but when asked who uses shells and who don't that's what jumps to mind.

More don't use a shell, that there be'uh cross.

[NChristo]

The boxers you named didn't just use the shoulder roll, like all great defensive boxer they utilized more than that, if you're looking for guys that rarely used it though or it wasn't there main defence then

Miguel Lora, Marlon Starling, Winky Wright, Azumah Nelson, Roberto Duran, Willie Pep, Hilario Zapata, Jose Napoles, JCC, Bernard Hopkins, Freddie Welsh, there's plenty.

[The Old LefHook]

A decent question.

[billeau2]

Floyd, Pernell, Toney, Benitez etc, it seems like all of the all-time greats used at least some kind of variation of it.

Marchiagano gave you some very good feedback. It would make this excellent topic better if you defined what you call the Philly Shell. Right off the cuff I can see confusion between the Shell and the Shoulder Roll...Certainly what Moore used (As Marchiagano says) bares little resemblance to someone like James Toney (my example), much less Mayweather.

There are at least two sets of movements here to consider: You have positioning the arms and putting the weight back, then you have a whole set if shoulder movements that include angles, protecting the chin, and...counter punching.

[HOUDINI563]

The greatest defensive fighters such as Loughran, Tunney, B Leonard, J Johnson all used a wide varied techniques that defined classic boxing. The ability to parry, slip, block, use footwork and then counter to vital areas of an opponents body.

[NChristo]

Marchiagano gave you some very good feedback. It would make this excellent topic better if you defined what you call the Philly Shell. Right off the cuff I can see confusion between the Shell and the Shoulder Roll...Certainly what Moore used (As Marchiagano says) bares little resemblance to someone like James Toney (my example), much less Mayweather.

There are at least two sets of movements here to consider: You have positioning the arms and putting the weight back, then you have a whole set if shoulder movements that include angles, protecting the chin, and...counter punching.

Philly Shell is just another name for the shoulder roll defense, it's got no connection to the cross arm defense and has never been used for it, can see where the mix up could be made though with the names.

[QueensburyRules]

Floyd, Pernell, Toney, Benitez etc, it seems like all of the all-time greats used at least some kind of variation of it.

--- Chin tucked is basic boxing 101 hardly confined to any style.

Benitez relied on his reflexes, and as those slowed, he became a sitting duck. Two Ton Toney was always a face first plodder. Only became defensive when he larded into the heavies, and even then took unholy punishment, the reason he's barely intelligible these days.

[billeau2]

Philly Shell is just another name for the shoulder roll defense, it's got no connection to the cross arm defense and has never been used for it, can see where the mix up could be made though with the names.

There is another "shell" that Cus taught... Winky Wright used it to my understanding, but I don't know what this was called if it was not called a 'shell' of one sort or another?

[NChristo]

There is another "shell" that Cus taught... Winky Wright used it to my understanding, but I don't know what this was called if it was not called a 'shell' of one sort or another?

Isn't that just the high guard ?, same with Starling, haven't heard it referred to as a specific term.

Thinking about it when boxers are "in their shell all night" it just means they were in the high guard and were inactive not being able to do anything or if a boxer is told to "go into your shell" they go into the high guard but I think it's but more of a quick way of telling someone to go on the defensive, turn into Josh Clottey for a moment, take the punches on the gloves and think / reset than it is an actual term for it.

Dunno if this is what you're referring to or if there was some kinda mix up somewhere.