Why Does Jack Johnson Get a Pass on Opposition while Marciano Does Not?

[Mr.MojoRisin']

Pardon me, just poking fun at the above guy for being too damn emotional I don't think any of us here have accused Dempsey of being racist. However, he did duck black fighters. Whether that was strictly because of his management or because of other reasons, I don't know.

But you are accusing Dempsey of being racist lmfao. Saying that you won't fight someone because you don't like their race is racist.

If you had literally any sort of intelligence on the subject you would know from square one that it was Dempsey's promoter and manager that absolutely refused to put on a fight with a black fighter. It's not up for debate, it's been proven ad nauseum!

Let me school you real quick. In 1910 Jeffries came out of retirement to fight Jack Johnson in probably the most racially motivated high profile fight in history. Jeffries got whooped and all across America riots took place and people were killed. Guess who promoted that fight? Tex Rickard. Who was Dempsey's promoter? You guessed it, Tex Rickard! After the DISASTER that took place because of Rickard, he left the boxing business and went into cattle farming in South America. Now, what do you think Rickard is going to do when he comes out of retirement, be eager to make another mixed race title bout or avoid that like that plague? There you go.

[Mr.MojoRisin']

Why didn't Dempsey fight Langford when he was offered the fight in 1916?

Because he knew he would have lost and probably have been ruined.

Do you think that Joe the Barber was looking out for Dempsey's best interests? He was trying to make as much money off of him as fast as he could. He had no interest in taking him to the title. It wasn't as if it was some big deal anyway. Joe the Barber offered it to him and he declined. End of story. It wasn't this hyped up duck that you seem to have it built up in your head as.

[travestyny]

But you are accusing Dempsey of being racist lmfao. Saying that you won't fight someone because you don't like their race is racist.

WHATTTT???? DUDE. WHERE DID I EVER SAY THAT????? CAN YOU PLEASE QUOTE ME SAYING THAT SO I KNOW WHERE YOU ARE GETTING THAT FROM?????

If you had literally any sort of intelligence on the subject you would know from square one that it was Dempsey's promoter and manager that absolutely refused to put on a fight with a black fighter. It's not up for debate, it's been proven ad nauseum!

I've never denied that his management didn't want him to fight colored fighters. I literally just said the same thing in my previous post. I also asked if he deserves any blame for that, particularly before he became champion.

[travestyny]

Because he knew he would have lost and probably have been ruined.

Do you think that Joe the Barber was looking out for Dempsey's best interests? He was trying to make as much money off of him as fast as he could. He had no interest in taking him to the title. It wasn't as if it was some big deal anyway. Joe the Barber offered it to him and he declined. End of story. It wasn't this hyped up duck that you seem to have it built up in your head as.

Dude, what you said just basically tells me it was a duck. As I mentioned, Bill Tate was 1 year younger than Dempsey with the same amount of professional fights as Dempsey, yet he fought Sam Langford at this same precise time that Dempsey was offered the fight. Actually twice. One draw and one win for Tate.

To be clear, I can see your point about him wanting to swerve this, but I think you are also ignoring that Langford was 33 with over 100 fights at this time. Dempsey also admits that he was bigger than Langford. The only reason that Dempsey gave for not taking the fight was that he was scared. That's cool and honestly I don't hold this against him very much. But for him to go his career only fighting 2 black boxers...one who finished his career 0-4 and the other who fought him to a draw and broke 3 of his ribs...then getting his license suspended in NY for refusing Wills....well, like I said, if that's all on his managers, then ok. Should he take any blame at all, especially before he became champ? I think it can be debated.

[Mr.MojoRisin']

Seems that you are the moron. Can you read? It says clearly that it took place in New York.


Now read it carefully again. It will explain who the moron is!!!

Lmfao still you! You're the one claiming Jeanette ran Dempsey out of New York!

You found a black boxer that Dempsey fought who was making his debut. Whoopty dooo for you. That makes 2. The last one broke his ribs and he didn't fight another after that, did he? Do you have any information to add about this?

Your reading ability sucks. Reread what I said then respond with something logical.

I thought I just posted a quotation saying he was offered a fight with Langford but he said he was scared. But then again, I forgot that you can't read properly.

Here we go again. You're lack on knowledge about the era coming through. After the Johnson fight Dempsey went back west and pretty much reached rock bottom. He lost motivation for fighting and considered quiting. It wasn't until he hooked up with Kearns in 1917 that things picked up. By 1919 he was pretty much known as the guy that came out of obscurity and was knocking everyone out in 1918. It was at this time (late 1918) that fights with top black fighters could have been proposed. I ask you again, who was there to fight? Langford was busy fighting Dempsey's sparring partners and getting knocked out by Harry Wills as well as losing to Fred Fulton who Dempsey had knocked out in 30 seconds.

And clearly you haven't learned to read yet. Once you get hooked on phonics, come back and perhaps you can do better

Question: Did Dempsey say he felt he won or lost? I'll bold it so you can read it more clearly

Then why do we have judges in boxing? Why don't we just ask the fighters themselves who won??

[GhostofDempsey]

You're making it out as if Dempsey was drawing the color line because he wanted to. That's twisting his words around.

Keep overusing the term triggered. Makes you sound like a high school conservative kid that thinks increasing the minimum wage would cause inflation. Lmao loser.



Alright I'll give you that. But Dempsey wasn't "ran out of New York". That's a blatant misrepresentation on your part and you know it's false. Try to be objective here.



I never said it did. That's what a large chunk of the newspaper article is referring to. They were asking Dempsey about fighting Johnson to which he said he isn't going to fight Johnson because nobody wants to see it. You conveniently leave out the part after he said "I will never fight a colored man" to where he immediately begins to refer to Jack Johnson. That obviously what the context of that statement was.




Good, keep telling yourself that.

He is frazzled because the guy in his signature photo is not the great HW that the casuals in the media made him out to be. A black man drew the color line as champion and there is no excuse for that. Dempsey had to avoid the possibility of riots had he not obeyed the color line, which of course he was willing to fight Wills, but they reneged on the money.

When Dempsey was offered the Langford fight he had about 15 fights to his name, and Langford was way more experienced. Meanwhile, Jack Johnson's greatest win was a washed up Jeffries. Celebrating Johnson's win over Jeffries is like celebrating Holmes win over Ali or Marciano over Louis. Johnson fought a shell of the man, who, during his prime challenged Johnson to a one on one fight in the basement of a bar. Johnson wasn't a name yet and so there was no money in a fight in the ring. But Jefferies told him we go downstairs just you and I. The door gets locked for the inside. Whoever comes out with the key is champion. Johnson refused and walked out.

[Mr.MojoRisin']

How the fvkc did I conveniently leave out anything when I posted the entire article, you fool? I didn't leave anything out. It's YOU that is leaving the part out that says clearly, "I will never fight a colored man." I believe there was more than one colored man around at that time, yea?

You didn't say a peep about that comment being in relation to Jack Johnson. He literally continues in the next sentence talking about Jack Johnson. You instead posted some low quality newspaper article that you have to zoom in 300% to even begin to try and make out what it says then you tell people what it says.

I wasn't telling myself anything. I was telling you to calm down, take a breath, and read carefully.

Lol you are good boy.

[travestyny]

He is frazzled because the guy in his signature photo is not the great HW that the casuals in the media made him out to be. A black man drew the color line as champion and there is no excuse for that. Dempsey had to avoid the possibility of riots had he not obeyed the color line, which of course he was willing to fight Wills, but they reneged on the money.

When Dempsey was offered the Langford fight he had about 15 fights to his name, and Langford was way more experienced. Meanwhile, Jack Johnson's greatest win was a washed up Jeffries. Celebrating Johnson's win over Jeffries is like celebrating Holmes win over Ali or Marciano over Louis. Johnson fought a shell of the man, who, during his prime challenged Johnson to a one on one fight in the basement of a bar. Johnson wasn't a name yet and so there was no money in a fight in the ring. But Jefferies told him we go downstairs just you and I. The door gets locked for the inside. Whoever comes out with the key is champion. Johnson refused and walked out.

Wrong. You don't even know the details of your own favorite boxer


By the way, the guy in my sig is there because I honor him for what he went through and I think the picture looks cool. He's not even on my radar as one of my favorite boxers

Meanwhile. you're "frazzled" because Dempsey used bicycle tape, ducked black fighters, and was accused of just about every thing you accuse another famous boxer of. Maybe next we should discuss if Dempsey really broke his wife's jaw

[travestyny]

You didn't say a peep about that comment being in relation to Jack Johnson. He literally continues in the next sentence talking about Jack Johnson. You instead posted some low quality newspaper article that you have to zoom in 300% to even begin to try and make out what it says then you tell people what it says.

I don't understand what the quality of the picture has to do with it. Do you believe that the quotation is false? If so, just come out and say it.

Dempsey-Louis just posted that later Dempsey erased the color line. Obviously he had drawn it previously. The quotations are all there.

Lol you are good boy.

Thank you.....????

[Mr.MojoRisin']

WHATTTT???? DUDE. WHERE DID I EVER SAY THAT????? CAN YOU PLEASE QUOTE ME SAYING THAT SO I KNOW WHERE YOU ARE GETTING THAT FROM?????

So you are not saying that Dempsey himself drew the color line? Drawing the color line is racist if you haven't figured that out yet.

I've never denied that his management didn't want him to fight colored fighters. I literally just said the same thing in my previous post. I also asked if he deserves any blame for that, particularly before he became champion.

You literally are taking quotes out of context such as when Dempsey said "I will never fight a colored man." and using them as evidence he ducked black fighters. Your entire premise is that he ducked black fighters. There was only one black fighter in the era that was worth fighting when Jack got on top and that was Wills. Dempsey tried going through with the fight and the promoter failed to pay a single dollar.