Ali is overated thread

[King Koyle]

I wouldn't say Ali is overrated.But he did sometimes struggle
with lesser opposition.But he looked great when it really
counted.Against Foreman,Frazier,Liston,ETC.

[butterfly1964]

now that butterfly is gone we can make "ali sux and ali is overated threads".


ali is overated cause


- he lost to a blown up light-H but got a gift decision

- he was nearly knocked out by a 183lb man with 1 punch but his trainer saved his ass

- he wanted to quit on his stool vs liston, but his trainer once again had to save his ass

- liston took a dive in both bouts, ali would never beat a prime liston


- ali lost all 3 fights to ken norton. the judges however gave ali gifts.


- the only matchup where ali-frazier fought closest to there prime, frazier won handily.

- he recieved several gift decisions in the 1970s young, shavers, norton III, frazier II, etc

- he dogded foreman in a rematch after getting lucky in the first fight because foreman fought the dumbest fight of all time.

- his 60s title reign is a joke it consists of....

*a shot cleveland williams, literally and figuratively

* a far past his prime zora folley

* bad back patterson whose back was so bad he couldnt even hunch over

* a fighter who went down from a punch which didnt land

* a 6'6 uncoordinated freak who is perhaps the most boring fighter of all time

* a canadian human punching bag

* a european fighter who is perhaps the worst challenger to ever get a title shot

* a british champion who cuts more easily than scissors


- he created the worst linear heavyweight champion of all time in leon spinx

very mature suzieq. anyway, i would say that some people overrate ali, and some people underrate ali, so ali is rated just about where he should be.

[RockyMarcianofan00]

Ali is very overrated
not to say he was an unskilled boxer but his legacy is blown out of proportion more then any other boxer i've seen beside MAYBE Jack Johnson

[butterfly1964]

Ali is very overrated
not to say he was an unskilled boxer but his legacy is blown out of proportion more then any other boxer i've seen beside MAYBE Jack Johnson

if you want to see overrated just look at your avatar.

[RockyMarcianofan00]

if you want to see overrated just look at your avatar.

you really are a retart

the only reason people say Marciano fought bums is because you have nothing else to rag on him 4, i mean you can't rag on him losing because he's 49-0, you can't say he was weak so you go right to the he fought bums ploy, get over it Marciano's opponents were better then Jack Johnsons and many other fighters so get off it

[Verstyle]

very mature suzieq. anyway, i would say that some people overrate ali, and some people underrate ali, so ali is rated just about where he should be.

as a loser

[RockyMarcianofan00]

honestly i'll say Ali was a good fighter with many accomplishments but who here besides you sucks his nuts like you very few. You have him on this invincible pedistal. I mean you say that we all don't put fighters in persepective when we say stuff like Marciano could beat Joe Frazier but then you say stuff like Ali dancing around could beat prime foreman and it just shows how you can't put fighters in perspective

[butterfly1964]

you really are a retart

the only reason people say Marciano fought bums is because you have nothing else to rag on him 4, i mean you can't rag on him losing because he's 49-0, you can't say he was weak so you go right to the he fought bums ploy, get over it Marciano's opponents were better then Jack Johnsons and many other fighters so get off it

well, maybe they were better than johnson's, but marciano did struggle with alot of his opponents and barely beat some of them. and if you don't think rocky competition was to say the least "questionable", then you are blinded by love.

[butterfly1964]

honestly i'll say Ali was a good fighter with many accomplishments but who here besides you sucks his nuts like you very few. You have him on this invincible pedistal. I mean you say that we all don't put fighters in persepective when we say stuff like Marciano could beat Joe Frazier but then you say stuff like Ali dancing around could beat prime foreman and it just shows how you can't put fighters in perspective

i don't overrate ali at all. i never said he was unbeatable. no one is unbeatable.

[Brassangel]

Originally posted by butterfly1964
i don't overrate ali at all. i never said he was unbeatable. no one is unbeatable.

While you may not come out and say he's invincible, you do overrate him while incinuating his invincibility. Without having to list so many examples, as many of us could do, you often claim that his competition was the greatest of any fighter's in history. In actuality, his competition is, at the very least, just as questionable as any champion's.

On the issue of invincibility, you have repeatedly thwarted anyone's attempt to prove that Ali suffered legitimate losses by stating that Ali was beyond his prime. You have then claimed that had Frazier, Norton, Holmes, Berbick, etc. faced Ali during his prime, he would have beaten them easily and without much trouble. From 1966-1967 you have said, he would have beaten anybody, regardless of style. This seems to be the only time in which Ali was experiencing his prime. Any time before, when someone has pointed out Ali's trouble, you claim that Ali was "green". Any time after, when Ali suffered a difficult battle, you claim that he was no longer in his prime. This shows us, the BoxingScene community, that you basically ignore Ali's flaws and only focus on the short period of time that you have decided was his prime. There are even occassions where someone will post a very convincing argument, based on real research, to show how Ali could have lost during that short time frame where he was in his prime. He did lose rounds and show weaknesses during that time, weaknesses that great fighters would have exploited. A great example of this is against Folley, where he was losing on the cards until he tapped Folley's glass jaw and put him away. When this example comes up, you generally fly in to defend Ali by saying things like, "Ali didn't prepare for that fight!" or, "Folley was a top 40 all-time heavyweight!" and other comments that show no signs of research, or are just plain rediculous. For being the guy who always shows up when the word Ali is mentioned, you present an incredible lack of knowledge (or realistic opinions) on the subject of said champion.

I normally try to avoid offending anyone on this site in any way, so I apologize to butterfly1964 and those who found these remarks offensive. I'm afraid it just had to be said. Let's face it: by dumping excuse after excuse in Ali's defense in sight of his flaws, as well as claiming an invincibility during the shortest prime in championship history (which questions his greatness, all together), you overrate Muhammad Ali, butterfly.