when should ali called it quits?

[BKM-2010]

Perhaps not, but the disease might have been delayed for several more years.

Not only because of the punches he took in Manila, but also from contenders such as Lyle, Norton, Young and confirmed hardhitter Shavers.
Besides all sparring rounds he went through during these years.

Couldn't have been good for his health.

But if it wasn't for his genetic predisposition to the disease, he might have been one of the lucky fighters who would stay healthy through an old age, even despite a damaging boxing career.

By the time he had fought Foreman he had already taken a lot of damage too. I wish it could have been proven that his last couple of fights caused or worsened his parkinsons but I have yet to see evidence.

[juggernaut666]

Often crossed my mind. Which version of Ali was the better?
Had the more ring-wise version of '74 beaten the quicker, brilliant Ali of '67? ...

Well just look who fought the better fighters..Its a no brainer.MOST think the Ali of the 60's was better simply because he ran around the ring more,but the reality is Ali of the eraly 70's/74 was stronger,set his punches better and became a better counter puncher who wasted less punches that became more accurate and was also more durable and lost little speed at a heavier weight...don't take my word for it or just listen to him speak after he defeated Quarry in 71 in post fight interview.

[Ben Bolt]

Ali of the eraly 70's/74 was stronger,set his punches better and became a better counter puncher who wasted less punches that became more accurate and was also more durable and lost little speed at a heavier weight

You may very well be right. Still, a battle between Ali 67 and Ali 74 would be a dream fight, wouldn't it?

But if it wasn't for his genetic predisposition to the disease, he might have been one of the lucky fighters who would stay healthy through an old age, even despite a damaging boxing career.

By the time he had fought Foreman he had already taken a lot of damage too. I wish it could have been proven that his last couple of fights caused or worsened his parkinsons but I have yet to see evidence.

Matthew Saad Muhammad was no doctor, but a boxer. But I think he sums it up quite well:
“Boxing ain’t good for you.”
Like smoking ain’t, or drinking too much ain’t, but people still do.

A famous cancer specialist, Dr. Jerzy Einhorn, once said that after operating heavy smokers with lung cancer, it wasn’t uncommon that the first thing the patient asked for when waking up, was to be transported to the smoking room.
And he and his wife, also a Doc, regularly went to the Mediterrean beaches to sunbath, though they knew the strong sun increased their risk to contract skin cancer.
“We humans ain’t rational”, he said, “and we shouldn’t be condemned because of that”.

Boxing made Ali happy. Also, Larry Holmes has said, some of his best moments in life has been that special feeling when walking down the aisle to another fight.

We humans do a lot of things that we know will come with a high price later in life.
Some will regret paying the price, some won’t. About ourselves, we will only know afterwards.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

After he won the rematch against Spinks and regained the WBA title, Ali announced his retirement. He should have remained retired.

This^^^^^

But in all honesty, I don't blame him for taking Holmes fight.. Ali had never looked completely shot before and was the retired champ facing the current champ...
Hindsight 20/20, but I can't blame ali for giving it one last go around, especially since it was a former sparring partner that he was familiar with and probably thought he could beat. Most great fighters need that embarrassing loss to nudge them out of the sport..

The berbick foght was a travesty and should have never happened....

[LacedUp]

After Manila without question. All of his fights after that he wasn't the same.

I wonder how he would have been today had he called it quits after that.

Other than that, the next point was Shavers. Then the second Spinks fight and then DEFINITELY after Holmes.

There were quite a few times he should have retired.

[billeau2]

Its easy to say we all want to wind up healthy and happy at an advanced age...but at what expense? Would we not sacrifice what a man like ali did to accomplish greatness? What is ten to fifteen years worth? And even when we don't get brian damage etc at an advanced age, its still no picnic!

Its easy to judge Ali's decision to fight on without seeing his decision in totality, taking the good with the bad. To put things in perspective....if Pac had upset Mayweather and I mean by KO, it would have been remarkable to many people....and pac was at most what? a three to one underdog? Ali twice in his career was a much greater underdog and managed to not only win but shock people.

My point is that I understand the decision to be a fighter and take the pain and suffering to accomplish something noteworthy... We all do really. Try getting paid union salary to work in a smelting mine.....you get paid good (my stepbrother did it) and retire young at about 40....with a permanently busted back, and you expect chronic back problems the rest of your life.

Yes the brain is special but we all make the same decisions that Ali did, we take the invitable damage for out own seeking! its part of living and using this body and mind the great creator gave us. You show me a perfectly able 95 year old who passes away with no chronic burdens from living hard...and I will show you a man/ woman who accomplished little.

[The Old LefHook]

Its easy to say we all want to wind up healthy and happy at an advanced age...but at what expense? Would we not sacrifice what a man like ali did to accomplish greatness? What is ten to fifteen years worth? And even when we don't get brian damage etc at an advanced age, its still no picnic!

Its easy to judge Ali's decision to fight on without seeing his decision in totality, taking the good with the bad. To put things in perspective....if Pac had upset Mayweather and I mean by KO, it would have been remarkable to many people....and pac was at most what? a three to one underdog? Ali twice in his career was a much greater underdog and managed to not only win but shock people.

My point is that I understand the decision to be a fighter and take the pain and suffering to accomplish something noteworthy... We all do really. Try getting paid union salary to work in a smelting mine.....you get paid good (my stepbrother did it) and retire young at about 40....with a permanently busted back, and you expect chronic back problems the rest of your life.

Yes the brain is special but we all make the same decisions that Ali did, we take the invitable damage for out own seeking! its part of living and using this body and mind the great creator gave us. You show me a perfectly able 95 year old who passes away with no chronic burdens from living hard...and I will show you a man/ woman who accomplished little.

Excellent points, lad. The lungs are special too. How many people smoke?

When should Ali have retired is an easy question in retrospect. Two fights sooner is better than one, three is better than two... Right after Foreman would have been about perfect. The legacy loses nothing the brain might gain some time.

[kendom]

I agree with this answer. He would have avoided the two damaging losses to Berbick and Holmes.

If he had retired after SHavers he wouldn't have had the awful loss against Spinks, but then he also wouldn't have had the record breaking claim of 3-time heavyweight champion.

I'd still say after the second Spinks fight.

Did Ali really need to beat Shavers or be the first third time champion in boxing history? I dont see any fights Ali needed legacy wise after Manila

[young_robbed]

Did Ali really need to beat Shavers or be the first third time champion in boxing history? I dont see any fights Ali needed legacy wise after Manila

to be fair the Shavers win is a pretty impressive scalp. Ali absorbed huge shots in that fight and almost stopped him in the final round

[BKM-2010]

Did Ali really need to beat Shavers or be the first third time champion in boxing history? I dont see any fights Ali needed legacy wise after Manila

They enhanced his legacy for sure. And I still don't think they made a difference to his health in the long run.