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Originally posted by NextRocky
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...but, that's not the only criteria, nor even the most important. Like I said in my other post, everything must be taken into consideration from a proportional stand-point...not JUST longevity and dominance. Quality of opposistion, displays of championship traits, etc. It's not a laundry list of criteria as much as it is ingredients in a cauldron. -
Originally posted by butterfly1964
here i am going to comment on each of the guys from your list
1. Muhammad Ali
2. Sonny Liston- too high
3. George Foreman- too high
4. Joe Frazier- too high
5. Larry Holmes
6. Mike Tyson
7. Joe Louis- WAY to low
8. Jack Johnson
9. Jack Dempsey
10.Lennox Lewis
11.Rid**** Bowe- WAY TO HIGH
12.Rocky Marciano- he should defintley be in the top 10
13.Evander Holyfield
14.Floyd Patterson
15.Ezzard Charles
16.Gene Tunney
17.Ken Norton
18.Jersey Joe Walcott
19.Michael Spinks- TOO HIGH
20.Jimmy Ellis- WAYYYYYYYYY TO High
21.James Jeffries- too low
22.Max Schmeling
23.Sam Langford- too low
24.Max Baer
25.Cleveland Williams- too high
26.Primo Carnera- DEFINTLEY should not be on the list
27.Vitali Klitchko- DEFINTLEY should not be on the list
28.Jack Sharkey
29.Zora Folley- DEFINTLEY should not be on the list
30.Eddie Machen- to high
31.Ingemmar Johannson
32.James Toney- DEFINTLEY should not be on the list
33.Rex Layne- DEFINITLEY should not be on the list
34.Jerry Quarry
35.George Chuvalo- DEFINTLEY should not be on the listComment
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But; Ali did dominate, for 19 defenses in two reigns and beat some of the best heavyeight competition the sport has seen....and gave rematches and three peats. The man ducked no one and was on top from 1964-1970 and from 1974-79. That's not too shabby.
Liston, Patterson, Terrell, Ellis, Frazier, Norton, Quarry, Mathis, Lyle, Bugner, Forman, Shavers, & Foster.
While Bugner, Foster, Mathis, & Ellis were above average, the rest were great fighters. And Ali faced and beat all of them, avenging losses to Frazier and Norton.
Louis & Holmes lists of tough opponents isn't quite as impressive to my way of thinking.
Part of what puts Ali on top and what keeps Louis and Holmes a notch below is the list of competition that came along at the same time as Ali. A fighter without great opposistion is never fully tested.
Look at Roy Jones Jr.....great talent, great figher; but never had that defining moment in his prime where he was tested.
Hopkins....20 defenses....that's dominance and a long reign; but, once again, besides Tito..which is arguable at 160....B-Hop never had the test that pushed him over the top.
Hagler had Hearns
Leonard had Hearns as well.
Zale had Graziano
Ketchel had Papke
Ali had Frazier, Norton, Foreman, & Liston that helped showcase his greatness.
Louis had Schmeling, Baer, and Conn...and Walcott in the rematch.
Holmes had Norton, Weaver, Snipes, & Cooney
See what I mean?Last edited by K-DOGG; 03-23-2006, 04:27 PM.Comment
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Louis & Holmes lists of tough opponents isn't quite as impressive to my way of thinking.
yes but louis defintley beat better competition than holmes.
- also JOE LOUIS BEAT FAR BETTER COMPETITION THAN ALI DID PRE TITLEComment
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yogi, shut up! that is my real list. i don't base it on accomplishments, i base it on head-to-head matchups. so what wrong with my head to head matchup list?Originally posted by YogiComment
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No argument with the second half of your post; the first half is a little debateable.Originally posted by SuzieQ49Comment
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i don't think my list is that bad, considering it's the first time i ever made a top 35 list. also i base my list on head-to head matchups in their respective primes, and i think i hit the nail on the head there.Originally posted by SuzieQ49
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Nope sorry...I don't believe you, Butterfly, because your list is/was obviously a joke.Originally posted by butterfly1964Comment
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who isnt gonna list ali and louis in #1 or #2, those spots r reserved for most in their top heavyweights list, so lets see sumone who doesnt put them there at all n ignores them...id like to see who was #1 thenComment
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tell me what's wrong with it?Originally posted by YogiComment
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