Tell me your opinion of these fighters.

[soul_survivor]

morrison was a much better than average fighter but he just didnt have the gas tank or chin to be elite. dangerous puncher and had that punchers chance against almost everyone. would have had a better chance in this era

doesn't make him better than average

[Humean]

Benn, the guy who headbutted his way to MCclellan's title, killing him along the way. He landed at least two huge headbutts, one or both of which killed MCclellan. Benn deserved every beating he took.

What a load of old bollocks!

1: It was Benn's big hooks that did the damage to McClellan, not headbutts.
2: McClellan was the challanger for Benn's title
3: McClellan wasn't killed, he's still alive, albeit in a terrible state.

[Mugwump]

Julio Cesar Chavez

Incredibly tough fighter. Technically excellent. Brutal body puncher. Think he deserves a lot more credit than he gets for the Whittaker fight. Didn't see most of his fights but I was impressed by his performance in those I did.

Carlos Monzon

Not seen enough fights to make a worthwhile contribution to the discussion.

Joe Frazier

I'd fight alongside any solider who possessed the kind of guts Joe Frazier had. Watch the Joe Frazier documentary and you can't help but be both appalled and amazed by the look on his face as watches (and re-lives) the 14th round against Ali in Manilla. When Frazier's mind was set you literally had to KILL HIM to win because he wasn't going out any other way.

Additionally, one of the greatest exponents of head movement in boxing. Vicious body puncher. Probably deserved to come out of the Ali fights with the same amount of credit.

Tommy Morrison

Extremely limited fighter who possessed one hell of an equalizer. Probably achieved all he could hope to.

Steve Collins

Good technician. Solid set of skills. Another fighter who had guts in spades. Unfortunate to be handicapped by soft hands. Possibly he overachieved through a mixture of his own hard work and resiliance as well as the good fortune to meet the better fighters at the ends of their careers. His first victory against Eubank was a joke. I bet someone like Joe Frazier wishes he had fights against top-tier guys who put him on the canvas and then refused to press home the advantage because of guilt issues.

[Mugwump]

Benn, the guy who headbutted his way to MCclellan's title, killing him along the way. He landed at least two huge headbutts, one or both of which killed MCclellan. Benn deserved every beating he took. Not that I had any love for MCclellan, I just hate headbutters. MCclellan was an animal torturer and domestic animal killer, so he got what he deserved too. People who torture and abuse animals are worthless. Any shrine to him would be worth emptying my bladder on.

Come on! I'm not saying Benn was innocent in that fight. But there are head-butts and there are head-butts. I mean, you can't equate the kind of behaviour shown by, say Andrew Golota or even Tim Bradley with what Benn got away with.

That was a TOUGH fight and I think had McClellan not sustained a brain injury Benn would have. I really am struggling to recall too many bouts in which so many bombs were thrown. It was savagery and I must admit to one or two feelings of guilt taking enjoyment from it.

There's a good argument that McClellan should never have been allowed to fight after taking a battering in the Jackson bout. I'm not an expert in brain injuries but several people noted he wasn't the same fighter afterward.

If McClellan was fit to fight he only had himself to blame in defeat. Any fighter who is a) so easy to hit and b) technically incompetent throwing a basic punch such as the uppercut (which would have won him the fight in round two) has NO BUSINESS stepping into the ring with a murderous puncher such as Benn.

[billeau2]

Come on! I'm not saying Benn was innocent in that fight. But there are head-butts and there are head-butts. I mean, you can't equate the kind of behaviour shown by, say Andrew Golota or even Tim Bradley with what Benn got away with.

That was a TOUGH fight and I think had McClellan not sustained a brain injury Benn would have. I really am struggling to recall too many bouts in which so many bombs were thrown. It was savagery and I must admit to one or two feelings of guilt taking enjoyment from it.

There's a good argument that McClellan should never have been allowed to fight after taking a battering in the Jackson bout. I'm not an expert in brain injuries but several people noted he wasn't the same fighter afterward.

If McClellan was fit to fight he only had himself to blame in defeat. Any fighter who is a) so easy to hit and b) technically incompetent throwing a basic punch such as the uppercut (which would have won him the fight in round two) has NO BUSINESS stepping into the ring with a murderous puncher such as Benn.

There is precedent for this opinion. One of the people killed in the ring was a fghter who had been badely beat up by I think Primo Canera and then hit by Max Baeur and there are many other instances.

[sonnyboyx2]

Julio Cesar Chavez

Carlos Monzon

Joe Frazier

Tommy Morrison

Steve Collins

Julio Cesar Chavez - Incredible fighting machine who would be a champion in any era.

Carlos Monzon - Great middleweight champion, methodical in his approach.

Joe Frazier - Legendary Heavyweight Champion, The Toughest of the Tough.

Tommy Morrison - Exciting Kill-or-be-Killed Contender

Steve Collins - Mediocre Alphabet body champion who beat a couple of aged, over-the-hill warriors. Very limited in ability, class and competition. retired so as to avoid certain defeat.

[Scott9945]

There is precedent for this opinion. One of the people killed in the ring was a fghter who had been badely beat up by I think Primo Canera and then hit by Max Baeur and there are many other instances.

Sounds like Ernie Schaff. He died after the Carnera fight despite taking (reportedly) light punishment. Many felt the damage was caused by Baer about six months before.

[f15bone]

Steve Collins: capable alphabet titlist...a few decent wins over name fighters who were over-the-hill when they met...

Carlos Monzon: top 5 middleweight...rugged, tough, methodical in his approach...overlooked by some but respected by most...

Joe Frazier: big heart & an even bigger hook...Epic fights with Ali will be remembered 4ever...epitome of a professional fighter in & out of the ring...

Tommy Morrison: talented & skilled, above average power & speed...Tommy lacked the "boxing intangibles" however...fragile chin, poor fight management, & an often empty gas tank cursed Morrison against the elites....

Julio Ceasars Chavez: one of the best of his era or any era for that matter...devastating pressure fighter, vicious body attack, crazy chin, & the power of a middleweight...JCC beatdown many of my favorites...much respect!!!

[Humean]

Sounds like Ernie Schaff. He died after the Carnera fight despite taking (reportedly) light punishment. Many felt the damage was caused by Baer about six months before.

I think the most plausible explanation was that Schaaf had had Meningitis.

[#1Assassin]

Chavez was a great fighter. excellent stamina, chin, toughness and fundamentals. his best attribute however was his lack of flaws, dude was solid across the board and he had a very strong sense of self and identity allowing him to mold his style to perfection.

Monzon was a beast. i admittedly havent studied him to the extent i should but i have seen enough to recognize what a special fighter he was. hagler is in a league of his own as far as MWs go imo, but monzon has a solid case for second place.

Frazier was a special fighter who was unfortunate to fight in the worst possible era given the fighter he was. Ali was the greatest HW in history by far, Foreman isn't far off and he had the worst possible style for joe. throw in the rest of the beasts of that era and you can tell how good joe was by getting as far as he did. everyone knows about his legendary toughness, bodypunching and left hook. what i want to add is his very underrated boxing ability, a pure brawler couldnt have given ali the probles he did. frazier was able to get in position to work ali over and successfully apply that much pressure because he was a tremendously well schooled fighter. if he didnt have such a hard head he could have been even better, i get the sense he limited himself because of his personal ideal of what a fighter should be and would have been much better if he didnt.

Morrison was a good fighter. decent skills and mental capacity, rocket left hook but a shaky chin. it wasnt his chin that kept him from reaching that next level though, he was just too one dimensional. very one dimensional offensively and not a good enough boxer to fight any other way than gunning for that big shot (foreman was way past it when morrison outboxed him). much like frazier he fell in love with that left hook, sure it was leaps above any other punch they had, but thats because that hook was so incredible not because the rest of their arsenals was bad. joe got away with it more because he was such a ferocious body puncher and could work up and down . plus he was a very good combination puncher and a solid counter puncher off that sharp head movement. morrison on the other hand was just way too predictable, had he used more variety it would have set up that left hook even more. but he was just too obsessed with that one shot.

Collins was a very good fighter, well rounded, tough as nails and smarter than he gets credit for. beat some very good fighters, fell short against the ebest he faced (mccallum) and would have done the same against the other top guys of that time imo. very good fighter none the less.

Steve Collins - Beat Benn, Eubank and McCaullum. Solid guys on a resume but I don't know what else there is to say about him.

collins lost to mccallum by a wide margin, got taken to school and nearly shut out.