Larry Homes better than Ali? Should Holmes be GOAT?

[McGoorty]

Hypothetical opinions shouldn't matter when rating fighter's historically. You should go by who they beat and what they did. Regardless of who you think would have won it can never be proven. The quality of opposition can and Ali beat and fought superior opponent's to Holmes and it's not debatable.

That is very well put Joseph.

[violaandme]

Holmes would have been battered good by Foreman Holmes wanted to out box you Foreman was not looking for KO's he was looking to hurt you bad and he would have hurt Holmes bad real bad Holmes himself gives Foreman no credit as being a top fighter a sure sign he was jealous of Foremans Prestige as a force Holmes would have had perminent internal injuries if he had fought Foreman in his prime and Ali is not the GOAT but he is closer than Holmes

[McGoorty]

Holmes could beat Foreman how? Ali was quicker on his feet than Holmes and he was trapped against the ropes. So would Holmes. The main difference is Ali could take a body punch way better than Holmes could and was a lot better at pulling his head away at the last second. Holmes ducked Foreman in their primes for a reason. Not because he believe he could win.

I agree that Foreman is too much for Holmes but I have to disagree with your assumption that Larry Holmes ducked Foreman when they were both in their prime because Larry's prime is post 1978 and Foreman was a shot duck by then, well at least he certainly needed a few years away from boxing. This word, ducking is used far too often, as often as the term GREAT is claimed and I just don't see Larry Holmes as a man who would duck anyone, most fighters at that level are the opposite to a coward.
.................. Larry was certainly not ready to fight Foreman in 1975 was he.

[greeh]

Holmes would have been battered good by Foreman Holmes wanted to out box you Foreman was not looking for KO's he was looking to hurt you bad and he would have hurt Holmes bad real bad Holmes himself gives Foreman no credit as being a top fighter a sure sign he was jealous of Foremans Prestige as a force Holmes would have had perminent internal injuries if he had fought Foreman in his prime and Ali is not the GOAT but he is closer than Holmes

I don't rank Ali as the GOAT either, but I'm intrested to hear from a ****** like you which one you rank as the GOAT?

/greeh

[Ray Corso]

No! not greater than Ali! BUT an ATG heavy that was equiped to be competitive with anyone! Solid right hand hand, great jab, underated upper cut, good hook inside and punched the body when needed!
One of the "Tuffest" men ever with a great chin and the will to win!
To many people here are looking at the Tyson fight as if its a meaningful one!!! Holmes was an old man ib boxing and his ego thought that the old inside uppercut would still work on Mike. To Old!! Prime for prime Tyson would have to be perfect to defeast Holmes, Holmes was a more determined fighter which he learnede from Ali as Ali young sparring partner!

Louis
Ali
probably Holmes, have to think about it! Anyone who doesn't have Holmes high on their heavy list needs to watch Holmes vs Norton. Then you'll know the importance of a fighters "will to win"!! When solid men fight each other the will of one usually over rides the other and thats the winner!

As for Holmes vs Foreman, Holmes people wanted no part of George but Larry would have fought him in a heart beat! This has always been a Business kids!!! Understand when you sign a contract you don't make all the choices, your word counts but the money people are in charge! Ray

[StarshipTrooper]

I called Marciano who is a bum that only whites like to build up overrated and Ali and Holmes are overrated. Any person who gets put on a pedestal Poet is overrated. No human deserves to be worshiped. There are no unbeatable fighters, When people say you are the greatest when their is no greatest then you are overrated in my book.

Then you do have a problem since clearly there's nothing egalitarian about boxing and there is a definitive hierarchy based on merit. Not all fighters are created equal and there have always been fighters who were clearly better than everyone else.

[young_robbed]

I don't know why people say Larry could ever be better than Ali, but Larry is clearly just a copy cat of Ali. The problem is at his best he couldn't replicate Ali's style and character. Ali's speed, footwork and movement is on a different level than Holmes. His footwork was phenomenal. His ring IQ was great. The few things Larry DOES do better would be the fact that he hits harder, his jab might be harder, and that he goes to the body. Besides that, I don't think he really is better than Ali.

Just look at their resumes. Yeah, ok, Holmes beat his fair share of fighters (Berbick, Shavers, Norton, Cooney, etc) but in my opinion he lost to Witherspoon and he clearly got outboxed by Carl Williams. Holmes likes to bÎtch about how he should have won against Spinks but he got 2 gifts right there. He's lucky he kept his title against those 2 men.

Now look at Ali's resume. He's beat Foreman, Liston, Shavers, Frazier, Norton (a better version of Norton than Holmes beat) Cooper, Lyle, etc. Some people might try to argue he lost to Young and Norton the third time, but he did beat Norton in my view. The Young fight is so bad that it should just be discarded considering how faded Ali was.

The point is, prime for prime you have to consider Ali to be the better fighter and greater technician. Even comparing their wins, it's not even close.

[StarshipTrooper]

Funny how Tommo aka HWeightblogger has to make yet another alt so he can have a conversation with himself :chuckle9:

[greeh]

Funny how Tommo aka HWeightblogger has to make yet another alt so he can have a conversation with himself :chuckle9:

/greeh

[McGoorty]

I don't rank Ali as the GOAT either, but I'm intrested to hear from a ****** like you which one you rank as the GOAT?

/greeh

I will hazard a guess here that there is some "history" with you two blokes. XD