Tyson hit harder than Foreman and Earnie Shavers

[joseph5620]

Not on average, and that's kind of telling when Tyson's prime was so short, and didn't never even hit his potential.

Frazier was made for bomber like Foreman, so again using such narrow example of hypothetical situation doesn't really work. Put Prime Frazier against prime Tyson and it's lights out in a similar fashion for Frazier. Mike was stronger, faster, two handed version of Frazier, with better defense.

1. Tyson hit his full potential. Don't use the not training or undiciplined excuse either. Because that's a part of what makes a fighter great.

2. You're claiming a Hypothetical situation doesn't work yet you're using one with Frazier and Tyson.

3. Tyson never knocked anybody out like Frazier or Norton and when he faced a great fighter he lost. Badly. Those are facts that can never be changed, distorted, downplayed or rewritten. Facts.



You can use all of the fantasy situations you want but Foreman beat better fighters and proved himself to be better than Tyson. Can't be argued.

As for Frazier he never lost to any fighter on the level of Buster Douglas. Tyson was not better.

[jiopsi]

1. Tyson hit his full potential. Don't use the not training or undiciplined excuse either. Because that's a part of what makes a fighter great.

2. You're claiming a Hypothetical situation doesn't work yet you're using one with Frazier and Tyson.

3. Tyson never knocked anybody out like Frazier or Norton and when he faced a great fighter he lost. Badly. Those are facts that can never be changed, distorted, downplayed or rewritten. Facts.



You can use all of the fantasy situations you want but Foreman beat better fighters and proved himself to be better than Tyson. Can't be argued.

As for Frazier he never lost to any fighter on the level of Buster Douglas. Tyson was not better.

First, you started the whole hypothetical situation with Tillis argument, which already was logically naive because of Peralta - Foreman.

Secondly, Tyson stopped normally training somewhere before Spinks fight when it didn't seem to matter anymore, Tyson's personal life was all shattered then, everyone of his close ones were either dead, fired or divorced. Again, it's naive to say Tyson reaching his potential when did stuff like this so young, long before he lost.

Here's the same fighters they fought

Tyson

Savarese KO (Foreman 12)
Stewart KO (Foreman 10)
Holyfield 11 (Foreman 12)
Jameson KO (Foreman KO)
Young KO (Foreman KO)
Jaco KO (Foreman KO)
Zouski KO (Foreman KO)

Tillis 10 (Shavers 10)
Holmes KO (Shavers 10, 11)

The same fighters they fought, Tyson KO'd everyone Foreman and Shavers KO'd, but Foreman and Shavers didn't KO everyone Mike KO'd. How's that for hypothetical situation?

[Galileo]

1. Tyson hit his full potential. Don't use the not training or undiciplined excuse either. Because that's a part of what makes a fighter great.

2. You're claiming a Hypothetical situation doesn't work yet you're using one with Frazier and Tyson.

3. Tyson never knocked anybody out like Frazier or Norton and when he faced a great fighter he lost. Badly. Those are facts that can never be changed, distorted, downplayed or rewritten. Facts.



You can use all of the fantasy situations you want but Foreman beat better fighters and proved himself to be better than Tyson. Can't be argued.

As for Frazier he never lost to any fighter on the level of Buster Douglas. Tyson was not better.

Tyson knocked out Holmes & Spinks both Class A opponents.

Tyson also knocked out Marvis Frazier, Golota, Stewart, Truth Williams, Neilson, Bruno, Botha, Ruddock, Tubbs, Pink Thomas, Berbick all Class B opponents at best, yet all vastly superior in every way than almost every opponent Foreman & Shavers ever fought and beat in their careers.

So lets give credit where it is due here. Mike Tyson is without a doubt one of the greatest fighters who ever lived.

Tyson Knocked Out 9 World Champions
Foreman knocked Out 6 World Champions
Shavers Knocked Out 2 World Champions

[Stuntman Mike]

Guys like foreman and earnie shavers get the credit for being the hardest punchers ever, but I have a theory.

Foreman and earnie shavers hit with STRENGTH foreman pushes too much, Tyson hits with true power or SNAP he has much better technique.

All the fighters said earnie hit the hardest but maybe earnies punches just FELT the hardest.

Tysons punches are clean and fast as hell, and I suspect they may be more powerful, I bet they dont FEEL as punishing especially to the body, but I bet they are more likely to put your lights out!

Remember a prime Tyson forman and shavers weighed around the same mark and Tyson was much faster than both of them put together and power in a punch is largely from speed, bodyweight being secondary to that.

I bet Tyson would turn out smokin joe fraiziers lights much faster than foreman did, forman was LIFTING HIM UP OFF HIS FEET etc that requires a PUSHY STRONG punch, a snappy punch would instantly turn their lights out and not look so dramatic.

Jesus christ this site is going downhill...People could see Earnies and Foreman punches coming yet got flat out ko'd .. thats why people claim them to be harder hitters...Tyson disguised his bombs with other punches and hurt his opponents with punches they never see coming..but granted he was a tremendous puncher just not on the level of Foreman who uppercutted Frazier nearly through the roof,look at the punch he floored moorer with and cooney..punches they both saw coming and it looked like he wasn't even full power on them... oh and looked at the damage single shots were doing to Holyfield,never saw the same effects on Tysons punches

[joseph5620]

Tyson knocked out Holmes & Spinks both Class A opponents.

Tyson also knocked out Marvis Frazier, Golota, Stewart, Truth Williams, Neilson, Bruno, Botha, Ruddock, Tubbs, Pink Thomas, Berbick all Class B opponents at best, yet all vastly superior in every way than almost every opponent Foreman & Shavers ever fought and beat in their careers.

So lets give credit where it is due here. Mike Tyson is without a doubt one of the greatest fighters who ever lived.

Tyson Knocked Out 9 World Champions
Foreman knocked Out 6 World Champions
Shavers Knocked Out 2 World Champions

I stopped reading after seeing you include over the hill and inactive Larry Holmes, Marvis Frazier, and Golota.


If you're going to be that ridiculous I can't take you seriously.

BTW, Tyson didn't knock Golota out . Golota quit. Lewis knocked Golota out.

[joseph5620]

First, you started the whole hypothetical situation with Tillis argument, which already was logically naive because of Peralta - Foreman.

Secondly, Tyson stopped normally training somewhere before Spinks fight when it didn't seem to matter anymore, Tyson's personal life was all shattered then, everyone of his close ones were either dead, fired or divorced. Again, it's naive to say Tyson reaching his potential when did stuff like this so young, long before he lost.

Here's the same fighters they fought

Tyson

Savarese KO (Foreman 12)
Stewart KO (Foreman 10)
Holyfield 11 (Foreman 12)
Jameson KO (Foreman KO)
Young KO (Foreman KO)
Jaco KO (Foreman KO)
Zouski KO (Foreman KO)

Tillis 10 (Shavers 10)
Holmes KO (Shavers 10, 11)

The same fighters they fought, Tyson KO'd everyone Foreman and Shavers KO'd, but Foreman and Shavers didn't KO everyone Mike KO'd. How's that for hypothetical situation?

If you're going to continue to use Foreman in his forties as an example, then I know this is a pointless debate.

But if you want to play that game, Tyson couldn't even beat let alone knock out Danny Williams while in his thirties.


Foreman knocked out the better fighters. Deal with it.


Edit: You listed Holyfield as a Tyson KO victim in 11 rounds LOL! This is nothing more than a Tyson propaganda thread.

[Galileo]

If you're going to continue use Foreman in his forties as an example I know this is a pointless debate.

But if you want to play that game, Tyson couldn't even beat let alone knock out Danny Williams while in his thirties.


Foreman knocked out the better fighters. Deal with it.

who are the better fighters Foreman knocked Out?




Tyson Knocked Out 9 World Champions
Foreman knocked Out 6 World Champions
Shavers Knocked Out 2 World Champions

[joseph5620]

who are the better fighters Foreman knocked Out?




Tyson Knocked Out 9 World Champions
Foreman knocked Out 6 World Champions
Shavers Knocked Out 2 World Champions

Read my post above. If you don't already know that's pretty funny.

[Galileo]

I stopped reading after seeing you include over the hill and inactive Larry Holmes, Marvis Frazier, and Golota.


If you're going to be that ridiculous I can't tame you seriously.

BTW, Tyson didn't knock Golota out . Golota quit. Lewis knocked Golota out.

Larry Holmes went 23-1 and won The WBO Heavyweight title from Ray Mercer after being knocked out by Mike Tyson, So claiming him to be over the hill is a little premature.

Your splitting hairs now claiming Tyson's victory over Golota was NOT a KO. Yet Golota quit because his jaw was broken. tha is a KO in anyones book.

We could claim Foreman's win over Dwight Qawi was not a KO and that Qawi quit.

What has Lewis KO of Golota got to do with this topic?... for your info Golota took a panic attack 20 minutes before the opening round and was given a tranqulized injection in his dressing room (so not a wonder he was KOd).

[Galileo]

Read my post above. If you don't already know that's pretty funny.

Are you claiming Joe Frazier (1973 & 76) was in better condition than the Larry Holmes who Mike Tyson knocked out?

Ken Norton lost every time he fought a puncher, Gerry Cooney nearly killed him in less than 60 seconds.

Holmes & Spinks both KOd by Tyson along with 7 other former champions.


Tyson Knocked Out 9 World Champions
Foreman knocked Out 6 World Champions
Shavers Knocked Out 2 World Champions