Todays athletes aren't always better

[Poet682006]

a half second lead in a race that lasts less than 10 seconds is a huge deal.

Now think about it in practical terms rather than in the confines of an artificial construct: If someone snatched your wallet and you're chasing him that half second advantage isn't going to get him any real separation from you. In football a half a yard is "huge", the difference between an ordinary running back an elite running back. Out in the real world that half a yard is nothing. People can divvy up any artificial construct and claim those differences are huge. In practical terms, though, that really amounts to splitting hairs.

[Poet682006]

Scott and NE, STFU! Poet said it! He's always right!

And you're Cardinal ****tard and you're always ******ed.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Now think about it in practical terms rather than in the confines of an artificial construct: If someone snatched your wallet and you're chasing him that half second advantage isn't going to get him any real separation from you. In football a half a yard is "huge", the difference between an ordinary running back an elite running back. Out in the real world that half a yard is nothing. People can divvy up any artificial construct and claim those differences are huge. In practical terms, though, that really amounts to splitting hairs.

running down the street after a mugger is completely different,, you and the mugger arent training hard every day for races,,,

In a race/dash where everyone has trained for, that .5 second is huge

[Cardinal Buck]

1. Jesse Owens wouldn't qualify for the 100m today
2. If he were allowed to run, he'd most likely finish in last
3. He might lose every race to Bolt and Gay unless they tripped or something.

[New England]

Now think about it in practical terms rather than in the confines of an artificial construct: If someone snatched your wallet and you're chasing him that half second advantage isn't going to get him any real separation from you. In football a half a yard is "huge", the difference between an ordinary running back an elite running back. Out in the real world that half a yard is nothing. People can divvy up any artificial construct and claim those differences are huge. In practical terms, though, that really amounts to splitting hairs.

i really don't know what you're getting at. usain bolt could catch up to jesse owens after the worst start of his career. a half a second is hugely significant in a 100 meter sprint.

these guys are sprinting 100 meters. they're sprinters. those are the confines of any meaningful discussion of the subject,

[Poet682006]

running down the street after a mugger is completely different,, you and the mugger arent training hard every day for races,,,

In a race/dash where everyone has trained for, that .5 second is huge

Again, that's an artificial construct not a practical one. Point being, from any sort of practical standpoint the differences between world class sprinters is minute. The difference between those world class sprinters and an ordinary person is huge. The differences between those world class sprinters is only huge if you arbitrarily declare that the difference between first and last MUST be huge (regardless of the actual duration of time) therefore it IS huge, when in reality it's of less duration of time than snapping your fingers. That sort of arbitrary designation easily becomes designating any difference at all between times as "huge" when, in fact, they are not in a practical sense.

[New England]

1. Jesse Owens wouldn't qualify for the 100m today
2. If he were allowed to run, he'd most likely finish in last
3. He might lose every race to Bolt and Gay unless they tripped or something.

unless they pulled up with hammies, their worst races would be faster than owens' best.

[Cardinal Buck]

Again, that's an artificial construct not a practical one. Point being, from any sort of practical standpoint the differences between world class sprinters is minute. The difference between those world class sprinters and an ordinary person is huge. The differences between those world class sprinters is only huge if you arbitrarily declare that the difference between first and last MUST be huge (regardless of the actual duration of time) therefore it IS huge, when in reality it's of less duration of time than snapping your fingers. That sort of arbitrary designation easily becomes designating any difference at all between times as "huge" when, in fact, they are not in a practical sense.

You're talking about horses, muggers, pedestrians...actually, nobody knows what the f uck you're talking about. It's funny though. And everyone else is talking about sprinters, just to make that clear.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Again, that's an artificial construct not a practical one. Point being, from any sort of practical standpoint the differences between world class sprinters is minute. The difference between those world class sprinters and an ordinary person is huge. The differences between those world class sprinters is only huge if you arbitrarily declare that the difference between first and last MUST be huge (regardless of the actual duration of time) therefore it IS huge, when in reality it's of less duration of time than snapping your fingers. That sort of arbitrary designation easily becomes designating any difference at all between times as "huge" when, in fact, they are not in a practical sense.

I have no idea what any of this means,,, all i know is that half a second in sprinting is huge,,,,,,

People that dont realize that is equal to someone not knowing the difference between a straight punch and a wide punch,, to the common casual viewer, there all just punches but to trainers and boxers, that narrow time and distance a straight punch shaves off compared to a wide punch, is a huge difference

[billeau2]

Well to be fair: It becomes difficult in racing because the comparison depends on isolated things that cannot be compared easily outside the split second differences in a sprint, or any race.

We can consider that split second difference, fair enough, but what of the difference in materials, footwear, ground conditions, etc? Heres the proof of this assertion and why Poet might have partial ground to stand on:

Look at the difference between the sprint times and the difference in the mile. I believe that the mile has been upped quite a bit more than the split second times in the sprints...Can we assume that this is not partially due to better gear? Is the difference in the mile proportionate to the difference of the Jesse Owen's comparison? More progress has been made on the mile I would think.

The problem is how do we separate the performance from progress in materials......More progress on the mile than a sprint (proportionately) would suggest to me that materials worn play a bigger factor in the progress than simply athletic performance. Suddenly a small difference that would be relevant in the context of a race does not seem so great outside the context of the race IF other factors are causing greater leaps in progress.

We would have to have the runners run in similar conditions with similar gear to make this small difference definitely the "progress" of the athlete. Otherwise this "difference" if it is due to the same difference that has caused greater progress in all race events may be suprisingly small....i.e. maybe considering Jesse Owens ran in such inefficient conditions the race time difference is suprisingly minor and owens would in fact do much better in modern circumstances.

We will never know for sure but I suspect that running materials has at least something to do with the different times and if so....indeed a small difference may be just that. But when we compare a difference of a split second depending on how it is caused and what we compare it to, the difference is either huge, or very insignificant.