Mayweather Jr vs Casamayor in 2000 (@130)

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Yeah, Stevie was not his prime by 2003, but I wouldn't call him finished and still he was tough style match-up for Floyd. From all Mayweathers opponents he kind of reminds southpaw version of Augustus. Floyd would win, but I see him still having some problems and not looking spectacular.
It's not that Floyd ducked him, but still before Lazcano - Johnston eliminator happend, Floyd offered a fight to Lazcano but Juan turned it down, somehow he never even think of offering fight to Johnston who was still big name for a challager, known for HBO appearances and undefeated since his close fights with Castillo.

don't get me wrong Stevie was a bad matchup for pretty much anyone (and he was much slicker than Augustus IMO). Just Casa is an even worse style matchup (especially in 2000).

At the end of the day, no one wants to fight a southpaw with good D.

[nachorjj]

Floyd calls out Freitas and Casa some times

[jabsRstiff]

I see it going down the same way I would any fight involving Floyd and a quick, smart southpaw-

3-4 rounds of Floyd trying to figure out his foe. The foe has minor succcess with that quick left hand coming from a southpaw stance, and this will lead some to think MAYBE an upset could happen. But, Floyd gets his timing down and with each passing round he's scoring more and his foe less.

Floyd by 9-3-1 type of decision.

Don't get me wrong, Casamayor was a very difficult foe in his heyday. But. Floyd's always been the master and there would always be a gap between him and anyone he could have faced in his time.

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Yes, that's all true, I just wanted point out that Floyd wasn't that comfortable with facing high skills southpaw and not only Casamayor fight never happend and was never even considered, but another guy that Floyd didn't want to face was also a skillfull southpaw.
Beside those 2 guys Floyd foughts or offered the fight to all other top 130-135 fighters on American ground (Freitas,Spadafora,Dorin,Lazcano).


Yes, he's always looking for that right hand of course, but he's throwing his combinations rather when opponents starts to break down or when he's feeling in control. Casamayor would keep moving and making Floyd uncomfortable all night long and I believe it would be very hard for Mayweather to land more than one punch at the time.

You nailed it right there. And what is Floyd going to do then? With other fighters he turned up the heat, but Casa has all the tools to frustrate pressure (just like Floyd does to most fighters accidentally). No one PBF faced (or could have faced) had the ability to do that. For example after the Hatton fight, I think no one at 47-54 wants to fight floyd on the inside, but back in 2000? against Casa? Different...

That is why "he would find a way to win" (like a couple of people said) can tell me where to bet (because -credit to Floyd- he always finds a way, like all the real greats did), but does not say much about how the actual fight would play out.

Tough tough fight, would have loved to see it, as dominicano said.

[wmute]

I see it going down the same way I would any fight involving Floyd and a quick, smart southpaw-

3-4 rounds of Floyd trying to figure out his foe. The foe has minor succcess with that quick left hand coming from a southpaw stance, and this will lead some to think MAYBE an upset could happen. But, Floyd gets his timing down and with each passing round he's scoring more and his foe less.

Floyd by 9-3-1 type of decision.

Don't get me wrong, Casamayor was a very difficult foe in his heyday. But. Floyd's always been the master and there would always be a gap between him and anyone he could have faced in his time.

DISCLAIMER: my money would still be on Floyd. ****** to bet against him. But...

The thing is Casa's ring generalship and inside game are a different planet than any other southpaw floyd fought. The problem with Judah was speed, the problem with Casa is where he would be and the angles he would be throwing from, and how frustrating and slippery he would be on the inside.

Not just that, Floyd in 2000 was still developing into the complete, perfectly rounded fighter he is now. The shocking thing of the first Castillo fight is not that it was close, is that it is probably the last time Floyd lost a round in the second half of the fight. That tells me that his ability to adapt was not what it would become later.

(and lefties land both hands on Floyd, but that is not my point)

[jabsRstiff]

DISCLAIMER: my money would still be on Floyd. ****** to bet against him. But...

The thing is Casa's ring generalship and inside game are a different planet than any other southpaw floyd fought. The problem with Judah was speed, the problem with Casa is where he would be and the angles he would be throwing from, and how frustrating and slippery he would be on the inside.

Not just that, Floyd in 2000 was still developing into the complete, perfectly rounded fighter he is now. The shocking thing of the first Castillo fight is not that it was close, is that it is probably the last time Floyd lost a round in the second half of the fight. That tells me that his ability to adapt was not what it would become later.

(and lefties land both hands on Floyd, but that is not my point)

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I do not think Floyd is more complete now than he was in 2000. Back then I think he could work his offense and defense better together than he can now. He punched with more combinations and did so while not being easily countered. He actually would step forward more to punch, which made him more potent. Yes, perhaps that would put him more in danger against a guy like Casamayor, but I think he had the gifts and reflexes to get a lot done without having to pay.

Floyd has always been every bit as slick and tricky as Casamayor has been, while having more things to work with besides those traits.

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wmute...

I do not think Floyd is more complete now than he was in 2000. Back then I think he could work his offense and defense better together than he can now. He punched with more combinations and did so while not being easily countered. He actually would step forward more to punch, which made him more potent. Yes, perhaps that would put him more in danger against a guy like Casamayor, but I think he had the gifts and reflexes to get a lot done without having to pay.

Floyd has always been every bit as slick and tricky as Casamayor has been, while having more things to work with besides those traits.

What I mean is that in the last few years we have seen him vary his fight plans to pretty much anything... dance and defense (baldomir) wrestling (hatton), pure boxing (jmm), aggressive (mosley, ortiz). Back then he was very fluid, younger, and relatively stronger (at 130) but he fought more... similar to himself, maybe moving moving a bit more or a bit less, depending on the opponent. The first big style adjustment I remember is against Castillo when he chose to stay away in the 2nd fight (why didn't he do it in the last rounds of the first fight? what did his shoulder have to do with his feet? EDIT: cos it was the left shoulder, disregard question...).

You say Floyd has always been as slick and tricky as Casa. Maybe, but you are basing this on something we saw many years later. The kind of stuff he showed against Hatton in terms of inside fighting, he never showed before.

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I wouldn't say that. The thing about prime Castillo is that he was just the best fighter Floyd has fought in his career + he was actually also getting stronger as the fight went on. You know, it's one thing to completely dominate in second half of the fight guy like Judah, who was always stronger at the beginning, Hatton who was systemetically broken down, or Mosley who was like 58 years old. Floyd never fought guy like Temible again.

Don't get me wrong. JLC is JLC and it is not by chance that it was him to push Floyd more than anyone.

But if Floyd was good at adapting during the fight, like he is today, why didn't he fight him in the late rounds the same way he did in the second fight then? It would have made perfect sense, fight is kind of in the bag because he took the first 5 rounds, just get on the bike and box, but he didn't. Did he tire? Did he just not see the option? In the first case he made a tactical mistake in engaging too much early on, in the second case he made a tactical mistake later in the fight.

[SCtrojansbaby]

Not just that, Floyd in 2000 was still developing into the complete, perfectly rounded fighter he is now.

That is a load of crap Floyd was every bit the fighter in 2000 he is now and FYI he fought Castillo in 2002

[JK1700]

I don't think this would have been a competitive or particularly interesting matchup. I have never really thought much of Casamayor, on his day he was a very good boxer but he struggled with and lost to several opponents who Mayweather either did, or would have wiped the floor with. Casamayor looks pretty damn good against guys who come right at him and have no versatility like Michael Katsidis and Nate Campbell, but whenever he stepped up to the plate against the best competition out there, he usually lost and even in the big fights that he won, he never impressed me that much, and I have always found his style rather boring to watch. He clinches far too much for my liking.

I think a fight between him and Mayweather at 130 would have looked a lot like the Mayweather vs Judah fight from 2006. Just like Judah, a prime Casamayor probably would have been good enough to win one or two rounds but overall I just think Floyd would have adapted to whatever he tried to do and broke him down, mentally and physically, round by round, and ended up dominating the fight after a rocky beginning. I don't see any advantages for Casamayor against Floyd. Except maybe his amatuer background. Overall Mayweather was stronger, faster, better defensively, smarter, had better stamina and had been in against much better competition. I could imagine Casamayor having small spots of effectiveness but I think like Judah he would have just ended up getting outworked and overwhelmed. I don't see why people think Casamayor would be a serious threat. On his day Casamayor was a very good boxer but Mayweather is on another level. Were talking about a guy who lost to almost every elite fighter he fought against by far the greatest boxer of this era. It's a no-brainer.

And I don't think people should be questioning Floyd's resume at Lightweight and his desire to fight guys like Casamayor and Stevie Johnston when he beat two guys that defeated Casamayor and the guy who beat Johnston. Jose Luis Castillo was the best Lightweight out there when Floyd beat him. He was rated #1 in the division and went on to rule again once Floyd moved up. A guy like Joel Casamayor was never a serious threat to Floyd's unbeaten record and the same goes for Acelino Freitas. Floyd beat the best Super Featherweight of his era (Genaro Hernandez) and the best Lightweight of his era (Jose Luis Castillo).