Marciano: alternate legacy

[McGoorty]

Honestly I have never made a llist yet I am certain that he would not be included in it. A young walcott and Louis, Johnson, Holmes, Ali, Frazier, Dempset, Tunney,there are a bunch of guys that I would place infront of Marciano. I would even venture to say that Renaldo Snipes would have given Marciano more than he could handle...........Rockin'

Man, that's a pretty poor observation,.. I'll remember not to ask you for any "knowledge" of yours,.... Snipes ?????????????...... GTF outta here.

[Barn]

Man, that's a pretty poor observation,.. I'll remember not to ask you for any "knowledge" of yours,.... Snipes ?????????????...... GTF outta here.

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[McGoorty]

I like Rocky Marciano. He's not in my all-time top 10 Heavyweights because I feel he had somewhat easy opposition. An old Jersey Joe, an old Ezzard Charles, an old Joe Louis, an old Archie Moore......

I'm also glad to see that Kid McCoy mentioned the LaStarza fight. Even though the Rock won that fight on the score-cards, that decision was in hot dispute for some time. LaStarza was thought to be a golden boy & many thought Marciano was too crude to really go anywhere. When Rocky won, it wasn't popular at the time.

Writing some negatives on such a highly esteemed champion feels almost dirty. But if you take a real close inspection of his opposition, it was over-all not too strong.

None of that is Rocky's fault. His manager Al Weill really moved Rocky in a way that provided the minimum risk while still keeping him somewhat active. To that end, Weill was a very good manager. Albeit not the most scrupulous when it came to the Rock's part of the purse.

Still, his all-out "swing for the fences, kill with every shot" style of fighting, his enormous heart, his humble & gracious attitude, his loyalty to his parents & friends, etc all combine to make Rocky Marciano a bonafide legend. He's hard not to like.

But yes JAB, take away the fights you mentioned and the Rock's all-time legacy greatly diminishes. Not as low a ranked fighter as a Lee Canalito, but he'd be nothing special compared to other great champions.

I don't support all of this, these guy's would beat most anyone at that sort of weight. And La Starza is way underated here, and Matthews to an extent... I don't think that era was weak.... just weak among the giants.... there were some very big dudes then but they were all very average,, ****ell and Valdes for example.... ****ell was massive. I actually think this era is special... the last era of the great small HW's... small HW's that were superior head to head against the bigger HW's.... and in Marciano we had almost the most exciting fighter to ever pull on a glove.... I hope that clears up my position on the "Rock".

[IronDanHamza]

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In fairness, I really don't like Renaldo Snipes chances agasint Marciano.

[Barn]

In fairness, I really don't like Renaldo Snipes chances agasint Marciano.

Neither do I but, saying someone who's boxed pro has no knowledge of boxing is a bit off.

[IronDanHamza]

Neither do I but, saying someone who's boxed pro has no knowledge of boxing is a bit off.

I'm not doubting Rockin's knowledge of the sport he certainly knows the game and has experienced the game.

But I know a few ex-pro's who lack any real knowledge of the sport or it's history.

I mean, knowing how to fight and knowing about the History of the sport are two different things.

[Barn]

I'm not doubting Rockin's knowledge of the sport he certainly knows the game and has experienced the game.

But I know a few ex-pro's who lack any real knowledge of the sport or it's history.

I mean, knowing how to fight and knowing about the History of the sport are two different things.

Although I am inclined to agree you can "learn boxing" or "know boxing" and pro's will obviously "know" the game.

It's another reason why I don't understand anyone who learns about boxing history and hasn't boxed before.

[Rockin']

Renaldo Snipes gave Larry Holmes all that he could handle when he challenged for his title. I remember watching this fight live on the networks back in the day.

Snipes had his jab in Larrys face all night, he is the man who came closest to defeating Holmes back then and did it with an educated jab, if he had more power he may have taken Holmes out.

Now put short statured Rocky Marciano against Snipes and that jab and the Rock would definately have a hard time reaching him and Snipes would catch the Rock coming in with his wide shots.

I know the fight and I know it's history. I'm just not sold on Marciano being all that great when he beat big names that were either on the back side of the hill or fighting out of their weight class. Besides the big names Lastarza is the only quality opponent that Rocky beat.

Just because I don't agree with common opinion does not mean that I don't know what I am talking about. I would rate Ali, Louis, Fraizier, Johnson, Tyson at his peak and others above Rocky as an all-time great.

Head to head I think that Renaldo Snipes would have beaten Rockys face to a swollen pulp if they ever met. Was Rocky a technical fighter, no. Was Rocky a highly skilled fighter, no. Did Rocky take alot of shots to get his shots off, yes. Was Rocky basically a brawler with little defense, a good chin and a big punch, yes he was. That does not sound like the greatest of all time, just my opinion.............Rockin'

[Forza]

You obviously have something against marciano

[Rockin']

You obviously have something against marciano

I don't have anything against him, I never even knew him. I just know that watching his films he was a scrappy slugger with a good chin. If Tex Cobb had a bigger punch we might be here arguing his greatness. He'd take a few to get his shot in just like Rocky. Although Cobb never had his nose nearly torn from his face............Rockin'