Reasons to like and not to like Trinidad

[The Surgeon]

I probably wouldn't favor him, but I believe he would do a whole lot better than Tito did in that fight.

It wouldnt take much.......

I was crushed when Tito got schooled like that!

[JAB5239]

It wouldnt take much.......

I was crushed when Tito got schooled like that!

This was pretty much my whole point to dipsydo. Just because Tito got schooled does not mean others wouldn't fare better. Unfortunately he seems incapable of grasping this.

[Scott9945]

I probably wouldn't favor him, but I believe he would do a whole lot better than Tito did in that fight.

A past prime Griffith was competitive with Monzon, so it is reasonable to assume he would have at least been competitive with Hopkins as well.

[SCtrojansbaby]

What you said was "No welterweight in the history of boxing could of done any better against Hopkins in their 2nd fight ever at middleweight". I believe Griffith would do better than Tito, and that is what I was responding to. What about Robinson? Would he fare just as badly as Trinidad?

Like I said I didn't mean lose the same exact way I just meant dominated.

In their 2nd ever fight at middleweight no Welterweight would be competitive.

[JAB5239]

Like I said I didn't mean lose the same exact way I just meant dominated.

Maybe you should think before you type than. Just sayin...

In their 2nd ever fight at middleweight no Welterweight would be competitive.

This is another load of unprovable BS. I'd take Robinson, Basilio, Leonard, Griffith and Walker all to be competitive that early in their middleweight careers. Just because Trinidad wasn't doesn't mean a thing. He isn't close to these guys in greatness and all were very strong middles from the get go.

You keep saying the same thing. How about making a case for a change?

[SCtrojansbaby]

This is another load of unprovable BS. I'd take Robinson, Basilio, Leonard, Griffith and Walker all to be competitive that early in their middleweight careers. Just because Trinidad wasn't doesn't mean a thing. He isn't close to these guys in greatness and all were very strong middles from the get go.

You keep saying the same thing. How about making a case for a change?

Except for Leonard and Griffin their isn't enough footage to judge the others and Griffin and Leonard beat shorter, come forward fighters who basically gave up their size advantage.

Hopkins is tall and uses every bit of his height to his advantage and even more so uses his physical strength on the inside its a horrible matchup for any small welterweight and its impossible without a few tuneups and time for you to grow in to the weight.

[JAB5239]

Except for Leonard and Griffin their isn't enough footage to judge the others and Griffin and Leonard beat shorter, come forward fighters who basically gave up their size advantage.

Hopkins is tall and uses every bit of his height to his advantage and even more so uses his physical strength on the inside its a horrible matchup for any small welterweight and its impossible without a few tuneups and time for you to grow in to the weight.

There is plenty of footage of ALL these guys. And if fighters like Robert Allen could bother Hopkins than you better believe ALL these guys would cause him major problems. Griffith did it to Monzon. Leonard to Hagler. Robinson to LaMotta. Basilio to Robinson. Walker to Flowers. Hell we could also throw Chatley Burley in there who did it to Holman Williams. EVERY one of those guys was 10x the fighter of Allen. He happened to make it much more competitive than Tito, so why wouldn't they?

[SCtrojansbaby]

There is plenty of footage of ALL these guys. And if fighters like Robert Allen could bother Hopkins than you better believe ALL these guys would cause him major problems. Griffith did it to Monzon. Leonard to Hagler. Robinson to LaMotta. Basilio to Robinson. Walker to Flowers. Hell we could also throw Chatley Burley in there who did it to Holman Williams. EVERY one of those guys was 10x the fighter of Allen. He happened to make it much more competitive than Tito, so why wouldn't they?

1st of all Triangle theories really?
2nd of all when did Robert Allen become a welterweight?
3rd of all Griffith didn't fight Monzon until he already had a handful of middleweight fights
4th the rest of your middleweight examples aren't 6'1 Bernard Hopkins who also happens to be extremely physical on the inside

[JAB5239]

1st of all Triangle theories really?

What exactly is your reasoning that they wouldn't be competitive? Wouldn't that be somilar to a triangle theory....something you cannot prove?

2nd of all when did Robert Allen become a welterweight?

That has nothing to do with anything. The point is a middleweight Allen wasn't half the fighter any of those I named were. Are you trying to say he is?

3rd of all Griffith didn't fight Monzon until he already had a handful of middleweight fights

Lmao!! He weighed in as a junior middleweight by todays standards so again your claim is meaningless. So what, did that make him a full fledged middleweight?

4th the rest of your middleweight examples aren't 6'1 Bernard Hopkins who also happens to be extremely physical on the inside

No, the rest of my examples are just better fighters than anyone Hopkins beat at 160.

[SCtrojansbaby]

The reason no welterweight has a chance against B-Hop is because he simply too big, too long and too strong and maximized all those attributes

Hopkins lost his first fight to a no name bum so sure anybody who isn't a bum can beat him what is your point? Allen was never a welterweight and Hopkins beat him 3x none of the fights were close

It doesn't matter what Griffith's weight was he was fighting middleweights which is what matters. He had time to get used to middleweight power size and physicality and still he got stopped by Monzon(A big, long, strong middle weight like B-Hop) further more proving my point.

And what is the point of giving examples if they aren't applicable to the discussion?