Greater Fighter, Jake LaMotta or Lennox Lewis?

[SplitSecond]

These types of comments are just really tiresome, when old fighters are praised people come with some vague bull**** saying you overrate fighters of the past without saying anything particularly relevant. You talk as if film is conclusive evidence, even when there is film of them. I didn't particularly pick out champions in my list of fighters just the fighters I know are greats or good, you've just come across as lazy and ignorant its clear that you can't be bothered to research the fighters, you just decided to shoot off and criticize fighters you know nothing about. Footage of a fighter can also make them look worse, facts are elemental in assessing a fighter, if you ask someone who was the greater fighter between Michael Spinks and Mike Tyson, I guarantee that most people will say Tyson. I don't see how Joe Frazier is overrated at all, I don't really see a justification for it, then again a lot of people don't know what there watching when it comes to boxing.

oh? have you seen other footage of those opponents? who were they fighting? and did they look like an elite bunch?

im just sayin....if you ever see someone giving you the breakdown of why an old fighter is good they just list all the champions the faced, regardless of good, bad or great

im not saying old fighters suck, and there's alot of proof of why ray robinson, pep, locche etc are considered as they are
but there is usually not alot of depth into their opponents which most will make a very long list of and consider great.

and @the bold, yea, that's my point

also i can understand why some past fighters are maybe so high, people are hesitant in lowering their positions due to the fact that they really haven't seen them fight, they have to just read off what older journalists say etc

[RubenSonny]

oh? have you seen other footage of those opponents? who were they fighting? and did they look like an elite bunch?

im just sayin....if you ever see someone giving you the breakdown of why an old fighter is good they just list all the champions the faced, regardless of good, bad or great

im not saying old fighters suck, and there's alot of proof of why ray robinson, pep, locche etc are considered as they are
but there is usually not alot of depth into their opponents which most will make a very long list of and consider great.

and @the bold, yea, that's my point

also i can understand why some past fighters are maybe so high, people are hesitant in lowering their positions due to the fact that they really haven't seen them fight, they have to just read off what older journalists say etc

Yep, I've seen footage of most of those fighters and done quite a bit of reading and have looked at opponents of opponents. Most of them had better skills than most today and they all fought and beat elite opponents making them elite. Instead of just randomly questioning, do your own research its not hard it doesn't take long, and you should know about things before you vaguely criticize. Stop claiming nostalgic bias, that is apparent in other things, to boxing, if you haven't done your research, it just makes you come off as a buffoon, you haven't provided one shred of evidence or produced any argument to suggest that they weren't all that good or that Frazier is overrated, other than you merely stating it.

[The_Demon]

Lewis had more skills but LaMotta beat better fighters, it depends which oof these you place more importance on.

Thats a fair summary of it

[RubenSonny]

Lennox Lewis is definitely higher on the ATG list than Jake LaMotta.

How so? LaMotta beat better fighters.

[The_Demon]

How so? LaMotta beat better fighters.

Probably because Lewis beat Vitali,who he rates ridiculously highly

[RubenSonny]

LaMotta is overrated because he got lucky one night and had a win over SRR. But we should consider SRR was a welterweight fighting a middleweight, and that SRR absolutely destroyed LaMotta in later fights (Valentine's Day masssacre).

- LaMotta lost to some mediocre fighters but didn't avenge those losses
- Lewis avenged his two losses by stoppage (KO and TKO)
- Lewis fought and defeated everybody (who didn't duck him like Bowe)

Lewis would never throw fights like LaMotta did - that's not something a real ATG fighter would do, in my opinion.

So your gonna completely ignore the other fighters LaMotta beat? I stated them earlier in this thread probably missed a couple as well. LaMotta threw the fight against Fox in order to get a shot at the MW title to my understanding. You haven't highlighted any of Lewis' wins and explained why there better than LaMottas, Also which mediocre fighters are you referring to because if your talking about the ones after the massacre he simply wasn't the same fighter and was fighting at LHW, he also had a few losses when he was green, one which was highly disputed. I'm going to get some sleep but if you respond I will get back at you tomorrow.

[sonnyboyx2]

The worst thing about all these Lennox threads is that it usually pits me against fighters I actually like.

Lamotta is one of my all-time faves, but I believe Lennox has a better shot at beating all the best Heavyweights, than Jake has at beating the best middleweights.

you must be joking.. Lewis got poleaxed by two journeymen and those two journeymen was the "BEST" opponents Lewis ever fought and the only opponents who he fought at world level who was "At The Top of their Game"... his victories over Tyson & Holyfield have huge question marks against them and Lewis refusal to fight the No1 contenders and getting stripped of the belts is also a huge black mark against him... LaMotta's career was vastly superior than Lewis career with Hollywood making a movie about LaMotta,

[JAB5239]

I think most would agree with it,its just that Lamotta was in a better MW era,than lennox was at heavyweight,imo

While Lennox was in a very good heavyweight era I don't think I would argue to feverishly with your opinion and actually agree and support it after little thought. :fing02:

[JAB5239]

you must be joking.. Lewis got poleaxed by two journeymen and those two journeymen was the "BEST" opponents Lewis ever fought and the only opponents who he fought at world level who was "At The Top of their Game"... his victories over Tyson & Holyfield have huge question marks against them and Lewis refusal to fight the No1 contenders and getting stripped of the belts is also a huge black mark against him... LaMotta's career was vastly superior than Lewis career with Hollywood making a movie about LaMotta,

While I agree LaMotta ranks higher your agenda to besmirch Lewis is still laughable my friend. Rahman and McCall were the "BEST" fighters Lewis fought? Really?

[sonnyboyx2]

While I agree LaMotta ranks higher your agenda to besmirch Lewis is still laughable my friend. Rahman and McCall were the "BEST" fighters Lewis fought? Really?

JAB.. you are taking out of context what i said, let me repeat it.. McCall & Rahman was the best two fighters Lewis ever fought "Who was at the top of their game".... what i mean by that is that all Lewis other championship opponents had huge question marks against them and was NOT at the top of their game.... do you agree or disagree?