History today

[The Surgeon]

There is more chance of hell freezing over.

Ortiz, although a legit fight for Mayweather, stands next to no chance.

I wouldnt go that far Dan, Ortiz can crack as good as Shane imo and is around the same speed (im talking about the old shane) and has FAAAAR more ambition. As we know Mosley really hurt Floyd.

I find it hard to go further than that as i feel like Floyds a far better fighter and will take it clearly

Another point, i cant see it being relevant but... Floyds getting on a tad, has been out for a time now and if he isnt razor sharp like normal he could pay for it

[The Surgeon]

Quick p4p Question for u guys

Whats ur top 10, particuarly intrested in ur rankings of Martinez, Donaire and Ward.....

[IronDanHamza]

I wouldnt go that far Dan, Ortiz can crack as good as Shane imo and is around the same speed (im talking about the old shane) and has FAAAAR more ambition. As we know Mosley really hurt Floyd.

I find it hard to go further than that as i feel like Floyds a far better fighter and will take it clearly

Another point, i cant see it being relevant but... Floyds getting on a tad, has been out for a time now and if he isnt razor sharp like normal he could pay for it

I don't think Ortiz punches as hard as Shane Mosley, even that version.

I don't think for a second he possesses the speed Mosley does, even that version.

And I would argue that version of Mosley was just as ambitous as Ortiz is. Shane new it's his very last chance to make a statment on his career and came mentally and physcially prepared.

My only conern for Floyd is his inactivity, will it finally have caught up with him? Possibly, but I doubt it.

But, if it hasn't. Then I would personally go that far.

[IronDanHamza]

Whats ur top 10, particuarly intrested in ur rankings of Martinez, Donaire and Ward.....

1. Pacquaio
2. Martinez
3. Donaire
4. Marquez
5. Bradley
6. Wonjongkam
7. Wlad
8. Froch
9. Hopkins
10. Ward


*Ward is only in there due to the absense of Floyd Mayweather.

[$Bullsfam$]

1. Pac
2. Martinez
3. Marquez
4. Hopkins
5. Donaire
6. Bradley
7. Wlad
8. Ward
9. Froch
10. Khan

[TBear]

Not to interrupt, but I wanted to point out that on this date 30 years ago(1981) Marvin Hagler fought a rematch with Vito Antuofermo at the Boston Garden in Boston, Massachusetts. The rematch for the undisputed middleweight title did not offer the thrills of their first fight as Antuofermo was floored in the 3rd and stopped in the 4th on cuts in an onesided affair.
One thing alot of people might not know is that previous to this fight Antuofermo, who was prone to cuts, had surgery done to shave back his eye brow bones and remove scar tissue to prevent him from suffering cuts. Unfortunitely not fighting a rematch with the sharp and hard punching Hagler should have been in the doctor's orders!

[The Surgeon]

Here are my pound for pound Rankings but note if Floyd was active he'd still top my list

1. Pacquaio
2. Martinez
3. Donaire
4. Ward
5. Hopkins
6. Marquez
7. Froch
8. Segura
9. Mares
10. Khan

P4p lists are harsh but im happy to defend mine

[The Surgeon]

I don't think Ortiz punches as hard as Shane Mosley, even that version.

I don't think for a second he possesses the speed Mosley does, even that version.

And I would argue that version of Mosley was just as ambitous as Ortiz is. Shane new it's his very last chance to make a statment on his career and came mentally and physcially prepared.

My only conern for Floyd is his inactivity, will it finally have caught up with him? Possibly, but I doubt it.

But, if it hasn't. Then I would personally go that far.

Shane is a puncher but Ortiz has dropped EVERYONE who has ever got in th ring with him, he's a ****er. Speed mabey not quite as fast as old Shane but still real quick and more importantly he can pull the trigger, he fires his shots off quickly while Mosley dont know more. Mosleys punches travel at speed but dont release fast enough.

It might sound odd saying Ortiz (a man who quit in stunning fashion vs Maidana) is the guy who'd want it more but looking at his bout with Berto he fought possesed and i think the critisisim for quiting stung ALOT Harder than he expected and he hasnt been allowed to forget it, imho we will not see him quit in a boxing ring again, same with Cotto who gave strict instructions to his corner Not to pull him out however bad it got vs Pacquaio and fought on through the blood vs Clottey, After the ***** he got for taking the knee vs Margarito.This is it for Vic he is on the Brink of becoming a MEGASTAR

Shane had tasted life at the top tho never the Mega stardom that awaits Ortiz should he triumph, even tho he beat The Golden Boy. He wanted the win and trained hard but did he want it bad enough? I dont think so. He quit on himself vs Floyd and vs Manny and both times it was sad to see. Also i dont know how much truth there is to this but i hear he needs the cheddar after his divorce and thats never a good reason to be fighting the big fights at his age

[IronDanHamza]

Shane is a puncher but Ortiz has dropped EVERYONE who has ever got in th ring with him, he's a ****er. Speed mabey not quite as fast as old Shane but still real quick and more importantly he can pull the trigger, he fires his shots off quickly while Mosley dont know more. Mosleys punches travel at speed but dont release fast enough.

Ortiz has dropped everyone he has fought and is a fast starter but look who he has fought.

His resume is solid but I garantee as he gets older and his competition gets tougher that stat will decrease drastically.

I don't think he's that quick to be honest. I wouldn't call Ortiz' hands fast, IMO.

It might sound odd saying Ortiz (a man who quit in stunning fashion vs Maidana) is the guy who'd want it more but looking at his bout with Berto he fought possesed and i think the critisisim for quiting stung ALOT Harder than he expected and he hasnt been allowed to forget it, imho we will not see him quit in a boxing ring again, same with Cotto who gave strict instructions to his corner Not to pull him out however bad it got vs Pacquaio and fought on through the blood vs Clottey, After the ***** he got for taking the knee vs Margarito.This is it for Vic he is on the Brink of becoming a MEGASTAR

I have praised Ortiz alot for the Berto fight and as hopeless as I think Berto is he stepped up to the plate on his biggest stage yet and performed.

Ortiz is a good fighter and I rate him but I don't think he will ever reach that status (unless he pulls of the upset here which I find incredibely doubtful).

Ortiz has shown heart after his bad loss but he hasn't fought anyone on remotely close to calibur of Floyd Mayweather and the one time he fought someone who has good counter punching ability he looked very confused and frustrated and started backing up (which I believe he will Vs Mayweather) because he didn't know how to deal with that adversity or not being able to tee off on his opponent.

Shane had tasted life at the top tho never the Mega stardom that awaits Ortiz should he triumph, even tho he beat The Golden Boy. He wanted the win and trained hard but did he want it bad enough? I dont think so. He quit on himself vs Floyd and vs Manny and both times it was sad to see. Also i dont know how much truth there is to this but i hear he needs the cheddar after his divorce and thats never a good reason to be fighting the big fights at his age

I think he definitely wanted it. Looking at the immdiate history and build up to the fight I think Shane definitely wanted it. I personally feel a that stage of his career, although looking great in his prior fight, he just bit off more than he could chew.

He 'quit' so to speak because he had no answers to a style that is terrible for him. I believe the same thing will happen September 17th.


I'm not knocking Ortiz, I like the guy. I liked his last fight alot and he impressed me.

But as of right now, he just isn't on that level in terms of his chances to win the fight.

It is legit, though.

[The Smash]

Shane was quite logical against Mayweather; everytime he tried something new/different he got punished. So, logically, he stopped trying new things. Unless you're Bart Simpson, if you keep getting burnt everytime you touch the cupcake, you leave that shit alone.