(Poll) Is Joe Fraizer Overrated?

[ji23]

There are only a few on here that downtalk the Great Joe Frazier and they're the least reputable people on this board.

hell no... if he is then everyone else he ever fought are as well

[r.burgundy]

Foreman is one of the most overrated punchers of all time.

what happens when you try to spin people in circles then push them real hard about the head?

They Fall down!!!!!!! Guess what they do then????? They get back up barely phased and slightly confused.

Im sure we can all name multiple people that one of the Hardest punchers of allllllll time had no problem spinning around in circles and pushing down till he won. 40 some TKO's, thats 40 well still gotta have some tkos so ill cut it in half, thats 20 some times that the hardest puncher of all time had multiple oppertunities to knock some one the f**k out, but couldnt.

Foreman, the most overrated puncher of all time.

know how many tko's dempsey had? 5/51. marciano? 1/43. fitzsimmons? 8/60. louis? 20/51. Jim jeffries? 7/15. Foreman? 40/68!!!

these guys on this board want to give foreman the strength of thor to help joe frazier save face or chin.

they say"how does losing to the hardest puncher in the history of boxing = a glass jaw"

or

"foreman is the hardest punching man to ever roam the universe,and joe took everything he had and kept coming back for more"

its pure stand up comedy

[SBleeder]

Without a doubt he was the best swarming heavyweight ever. Definitely not overrated.

[prinzemanspopa]

Well for one, it's a bit different when you were in the top of the division (the heaviest division, of course) and steady making title defenses. Spinks had the luxory of starting at a smaller weight, much different. But it's very common to see LHW's make it as heavyweights considering their body frames are very similar, only difference is body types.

Spinks didn't have the luxury of anything.This wasn't some heavyweight working his way down to light-heavyweight.We're talking about a man who had to bulk up to reach the weight that he felt appropriate to compete against already established heavyweights.


Very rarely do you see light-heavyweights move up to heavyweight and beat the very best in that division.Michael Spinks did,however.

And once again, you're opinion is thrown out there as a fact. "No Heavyweight contender should be knocked down that many times", yet you don't care how big a puncher Foreman is? Foreman, the man who cam back for a second career only off power and won the Heavyweight championship. Most the fighter Foreman fought were down after the first knockdown. Frazier was ABLE to get up. Frazier never tried to prove he could take a punch? Then why did he take the rematch with Foreman?

Because he wanted to retire with a big fight with a nice final payday.Is it that difficult to understand?


No "elite" fighter should be getting knocked down that often,that early in a championship fight.That's not just an opinion.No elite fighter would walk away from such a fight without serious questions posed over his ability to take a punch


Go ask Wladimir Klitschko what wonders the Corrie Sanders fight did for his career and reputation.

He had a glass jaw based on the fights he had with arguably the heaviest puncher of all time? That's a shame to be knocked down by George Foreman? Hahaha, your logic is so flawed. So I suppose everyone that Foreman, Shavers, Galaxxy, both Klitschko's, and Louis knocked out ALL had glass chins? How many times has Frazier been down outside of Foreman fights? Once or twice? Nothing notable.

How many punchers did Frazier fight outside of Foreman? I do know that Bonavena dropped him twice early,as did some journeyman very early in his career.So in total,Frazier was dropped nearly a dozen times in just thirty seven professional bouts.Eight coming against the only puncher he ever faced.

How does not beating top opposition make you not at the top of game? Once again, flawed. Plus you didn't even give an reasoning behind it. Ali was still sharp enough to take on experienced fighters and edge them out as Frazier was taking out lesser opposition. Ali was definitely in the better stage of his career than Frazier by putting on much better performances.

Because most of us are able to take performances into account,compare them to past perormances and realize a great decline when we see one.


Ali's level of opposition was always superior to Fraziers,so such a comparison is irrelevant in this argument.He wasn't "putting on much better performances" at that time,either.Not by a long shot.

Funny that you take when I said that Ali was the only one who fought everyone statement so literal.How big of a name is Quarry? How big of a name is Lyle? How much have they accomplished? Let me restate it because your trying to find small things in my post to boast and attack about. Ali was THE only fighter to fight the majority of top fighters in this era and be successful. No, there weren't very many punchers during Fraziers early career that would gain anything out of beating them. See, this is where your accusations have to put in perspective of how many fighters are out there, how many are contenders, etc. Go back and read my piece on the last post because it's another great reply to your "avoiding punchers" accusation. Have you noticed a trend here at all? Everything you state has been what YOU think.

Ah,right.So what you're saying is,"Frazier was a big name,so he didn't need to fight other top contenders,despite being nothing more than one himself after Foreman disposed of him".


Is that what you're saying? Because it sure seems like it to me.


There was a puncher,also a former sparring partner of Fraziers,in his own hometown.His name was Leotis Martin,and Frazier didn't want to fight him

Giant punchers are hard to come by.

Which is kinda funny considering how many punchers there were during Frazier's era.Punchers who were not only ranked in the ring magazines top ten list of heavyweights,but also secured fights with other well-known heavyweights such as Muhammad Ali and Jerry Quarry.

[sonnyboyx2]

these guys on this board want to give foreman the strength of thor to help joe frazier save face or chin.

they say"how does losing to the hardest puncher in the history of boxing = a glass jaw"

or

"foreman is the hardest punching man to ever roam the universe,and joe took everything he had and kept coming back for more"

its pure stand up comedy

are you saying that those assumptions are not correct?

[sonnyboyx2]

Spinks didn't have the luxury of anything.This wasn't some heavyweight working his way down to light-heavyweight.We're talking about a man who had to bulk up to reach the weight that he felt appropriate to compete against already established heavyweights.


Very rarely do you see light-heavyweights move up to heavyweight and beat the very best in that division.Michael Spinks did,however.











Because he wanted to retire with a big fight with a nice final payday.Is it that difficult to understand?


No "elite" fighter should be getting knocked down that often,that early in a championship fight.That's not just an opinion.No elite fighter would walk away from such a fight without serious questions posed over his ability to take a punch


Go ask Wladimir Klitschko what wonders the Corrie Sanders fight did for his career and reputation.








How many punchers did Frazier fight outside of Foreman? I do know that Bonavena dropped him twice early,as did some journeyman very early in his career.So in total,Frazier was dropped nearly a dozen times in just thirty seven professional bouts.Eight coming against the only puncher he ever faced.








Because most of us are able to take performances into account,compare them to past perormances and realize a great decline when we see one.


Ali's level of opposition was always superior to Fraziers,so such a comparison is irrelevant in this argument.He wasn't "putting on much better performances" at that time,either.Not by a long shot.











Ah,right.So what you're saying is,"Frazier was a big name,so he didn't need to fight other top contenders,despite being nothing more than one himself after Foreman disposed of him".


Is that what you're saying? Because it sure seems like it to me.


There was a puncher,also a former sparring partner of Fraziers,in his own hometown.His name was Leotis Martin,and Frazier didn't want to fight him









Which is kinda funny considering how many punchers there were during Frazier's era.Punchers who were not only ranked in the ring magazines top ten list of heavyweights,but also secured fights with other well-known heavyweights such as Muhammad Ali and Jerry Quarry.

The moral of this thread is " No referee ever counted 10 over Joe Frazier" and Frazier twice fought the hardest puncher in the history of the sport... so the vast majority of members who voted on this topic got the answer correct in that Frazier did not have a Glass jaw

Holmes out for the 10 count vs Tyson
Lewis out for the 10 count vs Rahman
Liston out for the 10 count vs Martin
Holyfield out for the 10 count vs Bowe
Tyson out for the 10 count vs Douglas
Norton out for the 10 count vs Cooney
Louis out for the 10 count vs Marciano
Dempsey out for the 10 count vs Flynn
Johnson out for the 10 count vs Willard
Patterson out for the 10 count vs Liston
Foreman out for the 10 count vs Ali
FRAZIER out for the 10 count NEVER EVER!

[Spartacus Sully]

are you saying that those assumptions are not correct?

foreman could dent a ball of silly putty with his punch.

while a real punchers fist would bounce off.

Sucessfull puncher? yes. Hardest? not even top 10.

[sonnyboyx2]

foreman could dent a ball of silly putty with his punch.

while a real punchers fist would bounce off.

Sucessfull puncher? yes. Hardest? not even top 10.

Norton, Lyle, Holyfield & Ali all claim Foreman was the hardest puncher

[SNVDoublePunch!]

....No. Not at all.

[SNVDoublePunch!]

Norton, Lyle, Holyfield & Ali all claim Foreman was the hardest puncher

Ali claims that Shavers was the hardest puncher, that I've seen him talk about it.