Boxing Historians Do You Think Manny Pacquiao Has Ever Take Steroids Or Performing E.

[Clegg]

The people accusing him of drug use are the same ones who were making excuses for his great wins.

Overnight it changed from 'Pac is avoiding slick fighters and only facing guys who are a good style matchup, that's why he looks so good. Hatton was shot, Cotto was past-prime and weight drained' to 'Pac is obviously juicing because he performs so well'.

At first it was that his wins were overrated, now his wins are so great that they can't possibly be natural? Right.

I think there should be mandatory Olympic-style testing for all top boxers. I think Pac should've accepted the 14 day cut off point. But I think a large amount of this controversy has been created by Mayweather, his team, and his fanbase.

[BattlingNelson]

It's my personal belief that at least 3 out of 4 top fighters is using some kind of PED's. The reason being that the system is so easy to bypass and the benefits from juicing is gigantic both in terms of money and in terms of accomplishments.

So when asked if I THINK pac is taking PED's I say yes I think he is. Add also that he didn't make it easier for himself by turning down olympic-style testing for a Mayweather fight. That move is highly su****ious in my eyes.

[Hannibal Barca]

Pacman is on undoubtedly on roids... because Mayweather Sr. said so.

I guess 50,000 people believing in a foolish thing makes it right, especially when it comes from the elder of a ***********al family.

People don't believe he's on PED's because of what Mayweather Sr. said, in fact, I doubt the casual fans knows anything at all about Mayweather Sr. accusations. The reason most seem to believe he's taken PED's is because the way he and his team acted after the proposal of random blood testing. I'm sorry, but people who have nothing to hide don't turn down $25 million blood test.

With that said, for the good of the sport, this fight needs to happen; and yes, whether he likes it or not, Manny needs to take the test.

[koboy]

I'm sorry, but people who have nothing to hide don't turn down $25 million blood test.

With that said, for the good of the sport, this fight needs to happen; and yes, whether he likes it or not, Manny needs to take the test.

This statement is a bit generalistic because we all know that Manny is not just some people. The guy has all the money he'll ever need and couldn't care less about turning down $ 25 million just to retain some sense of control on his own boxing career. We all have our own standard of morals and principle. Who knows what his motivation was for turning down the fight. On the other hand, you and I, who have never seen this type of cash, will probably bend over for Floyd in a heartbeat.

I think this whole testing thing was about gamesmanship that backfired. I know that neither PBF nor Pacquiao is scared of fighting anyone. They put their lives on the line each and everytime they step on the ring. But I think Floyd is probably more scared of losing the undefeated record than Pacquiao testing positive for PEDs and thus, the gamesmanship. We all know that Floyd is the smartest fighter in and out of the ring and if he can defeat you before the fight is even signed, he'll do it. I think he's scratching his head at this moment thinking where it all went south because he knows he has to fight Pacquiao to be a step above him, legacy wise.

I have a feeling however, that if NSAC adapts random testing, Manny will easily comply. Just not to Floyd's, though.

I think Manny's clean or I am hoping he is. I am also hoping that PBF vs Manny happens.

[Clyde Barrow]

I personally do not.

[Hannibal Barca]

This statement is a bit generalistic because we all know that Manny is not just some people. The guy has all the money he'll ever need and couldn't care less about turning down $ 25 million just to retain some sense of control on his own boxing career. We all have our own standard of morals and principle. Who knows what his motivation was for turning down the fight. On the other hand, you and I, who have never seen this type of cash, will probably bend over for Floyd in a heartbeat.

I think this whole testing thing was about gamesmanship that backfired. I know that neither PBF nor Pacquiao is scared of fighting anyone. They put their lives on the line each and everytime they step on the ring. But I think Floyd is probably more scared of losing the undefeated record than Pacquiao testing positive for PEDs and thus, the gamesmanship. We all know that Floyd is the smartest fighter in and out of the ring and if he can defeat you before the fight is even signed, he'll do it. I think he's scratching his head at this moment thinking where it all went south because he knows he has to fight Pacquiao to be a step above him, legacy wise.

I have a feeling however, that if NSAC adapts random testing, Manny will easily comply. Just not to Floyd's, though.

I think Manny's clean or I am hoping he is. I am also hoping that PBF vs Manny happens.

Great post. It's refreshing to be able to actually have a conversation without all the nonsense.

With that said, I don't think random testing has anything to do with ethics and morales. If it did, than I'd readily side with Manny. It isn't as if Floyd demanded Manny denounce his faith, curse God, or spit on an image of baby Jesus. He simply asked for Manny to be subject to test that he himself, and thousands of athletes world wide, have been and are willing to be subject to.

For example, Usain Bolt is arguably the greatest athlete in the world. He's surely the most amazing track athlete to have ever graced this earth. After completely shattering the record books, he of course was accused of using PED's. In the current era of sports, it's understandable. However, did he moan and complain about feeling disrespected; Did he file a lawsuit against Carl Lewis; Was he suddenly hit with a phobia, or mysteriously become superstitious? No, he took the test and continued on running. He went on to shatter his own WR by nearly a tenth of a second in his next national event. Same with Michael Phelps, LeBron James, He Kexin, etc.

BTW, Manny's "morales and ethics" argument may be believable if it weren't for the fact that his next fight, which was scheduled shortly after the Mayweather fall out, weren't in Texas. Where no testing will be done at all.

I wont argue legacies, because neither has done enough to be considered as great as most think the are. Though I do believe Floyd is one of the most skilled fighters to ever lace up a pair of gloves.

[koboy]

It isn't as if Floyd demanded Manny denounce his faith, curse God, or spit on an image of baby Jesus. He simply asked for Manny to be subject to test that he himself, and thousands of athletes world wide, have been and are willing to be subject to.

I wont argue legacies, because neither has done enough to be considered as great as most think the are.

Though I do believe Floyd is one of the most skilled fighters to ever lace up a pair of gloves

This is where the problem lies in your argument. PBF is the one asking and not the state commission where the fight is being held. The thousand of athletes world wide that you set as examples were not asked by their opponents or peers to have them tested but by the commission or supervising committee which govern their sport where their particular contests or events were being held. Asafa Powell didn't demand testing for Usain Bolt, the IAAF did. And Usain complied. What do you think Bolt would say if Asafa suggested that Bolt take extra test for Asafa's satisfaction. Bolt will say "stick it". You have no right to tell me when and where I get tested because I already comply with the IAAF's demands. Big difference. Why don't you wait to judge Pacquiao until the NSAC requests for random drug and blood testing?

With regards to legacy, I can't agree with your statement with regards to Pacquiao because 100 years from now anyone who'll read this:

Manny Pacquiao, fighter of the decade in 2000 - 09, is the first fighter to have won 7 divisional titles and 4 lineal titles.

cannot deny that this guy has to be considered one of the greats. How far up the rankings, that's up to them to decide but I think Manny's legacy is pretty secured.

But I agree with you that Floyd is one of the most, I'll go even further and say that he could be the MOST skilled fighter ever. He is that good. Watching him at lightweight was unbelievable and you still see glimpses of it in some of his recent fights - 8th round of the Hatton fight was beautiful to watch. I still think he needs a win against Pacquiao to secure that legacy. That's just my opinion.

[bojangles1987]

Really, none of this came up at all until the Mayweathers. Usually with athletes using steroids or HGH there are people close to the situation who talk or some kind of proof even if that athlete never tests positive. None of that exists with Pacquiao.

I certainly wouldn't be surprised if he tested positive for a PED but I wouldn't be surprised if ANY athlete these days tested positive for PEDs, it's just the way it is. However, it's not like Pac has done anything no one else has never done, and I don't think it's right for a fighter to be dragged through the mud by a rival fighter like this if there is nothing to suggest the PED use is there.

As far as turning down the money over the drug tests, it's negotiating. Neither side wants to appear more desperate than the other, and Pac was not going to bend over and take it from Mayweather for this fight. Honestly, who if Floyd to make demands like this? If he was really interested in cleaning up the sport he wouldn't be doing it this way.

[IMDAZED]

This statement is a bit generalistic because we all know that Manny is not just some people. The guy has all the money he'll ever need and couldn't care less about turning down $ 25 million just to retain some sense of control on his own boxing career. We all have our own standard of morals and principle. Who knows what his motivation was for turning down the fight. On the other hand, you and I, who have never seen this type of cash, will probably bend over for Floyd in a heartbeat.

I think this whole testing thing was about gamesmanship that backfired. I know that neither PBF nor Pacquiao is scared of fighting anyone. They put their lives on the line each and everytime they step on the ring. But I think Floyd is probably more scared of losing the undefeated record than Pacquiao testing positive for PEDs and thus, the gamesmanship. We all know that Floyd is the smartest fighter in and out of the ring and if he can defeat you before the fight is even signed, he'll do it. I think he's scratching his head at this moment thinking where it all went south because he knows he has to fight Pacquiao to be a step above him, legacy wise.

I have a feeling however, that if NSAC adapts random testing, Manny will easily comply. Just not to Floyd's, though.

I think Manny's clean or I am hoping he is. I am also hoping that PBF vs Manny happens.

It's nice to read an opposing argument with common sense.

Actions speak louder than words and if Floyd Mayweather was scared of losing his zero, the last person he'd fight is Shane Mosley, someone both he and Manny had shown very little interest in fighting prior. I also think that the idea that Manny Pacquiao doesn't care about money is a little too naive. Let's be honest we all do, rich or poor. Anyone who cuts an 85-15 deal with his new opponent, walks out on negotiations several times over moolah with Hatton and Oscar, obviously cares quite a bit. Not sure it is relevant.

That said, I've heard the "gamesmanship" argument before but I'm just not sure how it stands up in the light of facts. These clauses were in the contracts from day one and were agreed upon by both parties. It's what occurred after (the lying, contradictions, etc) that has drawn greater su****ion to Pacquiao. Indefensible.

[koboy]

It's nice to read an opposing argument with common sense.

Actions speak louder than words and if Floyd Mayweather was scared of losing his zero, the last person he'd fight is Shane Mosley, someone both he and Manny had shown very little interest in fighting prior. I also think that the idea that Manny Pacquiao doesn't care about money is a little too naive. Let's be honest we all do, rich or poor. Anyone who cuts an 85-15 deal with his new opponent, walks out on negotiations several times over moolah with Hatton and Oscar, obviously cares quite a bit. Not sure it is relevant.

That said, I've heard the "gamesmanship" argument before but I'm just not sure how it stands up in the light of facts. These clauses were in the contracts from day one and were agreed upon by both parties. It's what occurred after (the lying, contradictions, etc) that has drawn greater su****ion to Pacquiao. Indefensible.

Again, it's all too generalistic to assume that we all care about money. There are people out there who have given up millions of dollar in inheritance money just to marry someone they're parents or family didn't approve of. I know a doctor who gave up a high paying stint so that she could help sick people in Guatamela. Not all of us care about money.

Manny came from nothing and made himself something. For all we know, $ 5 million dollars and $ 40 million, makes no difference to him anymore. You don't think he knows that Arum takes a good chunk of change from him? Do you think entourage works for free? I think, as long as he makes enough to keep the lifestyle his family is used to now, he's fine. He don't need no more. This is a guy who is a boxing star, movie star, singing star, and could be political star. While most boxers only have money coming from boxing, his is coming from everywhere. He don't need an extra $ 40 million dollars if it means he will give up the right to make his own decisions. I truly believe that if you let Manny pick between money and control over his career, at this stage, he'll pick the latter, no questions asked.

I didn't say Floyd is afraid of losing his "0". I said he is MORE afraid of losing it THAN Pac is afraid of testing positive for PED. That being said, I think Pac is more dangerous than Mosley AT this moment in time and PBF should easily win by UD against a 39 year old, inactive Shane. With Pac, the risk is higher because he is on his prime and improving, actually. So there is a greater risk of losing the "0" to Pac than Shane and thus, the gamesmanship. It's all part of PBF's strategy. If he can beat you before the fight is ever signed, he will. There is nothing wrong with this. Why do you think he trains all year? For PBF, the fight doesn't start in training camp, it already started. In, out, pre-fight, promo, weigh-in. He is always thinking about boxing and winning. PBF is the consummate fighter.

The Pac camp excuses about blood testing were comical, if not pathetic. But again, I think it was about losing control. When they realized that they were giving up to much of it, they backed out and came out with laughable excuses, one after the other. It was hilarious. Didn't do Manny any good.