Who is the greatest of the 2nd tier heavyweights?

[fight_professor]

Where would you place Patterson?

I know he has a huge rep, a 2 time champ, but he got crushed by other greats, and often KO'd but had silky skills. Ali opined that of all the guys he fought, Floyd was the most skillful. He'd not beat many of the top 20 HW (any?), and yet as the first 2 time champ, the (then) youngest champ, a beautiful boxer-he has much to play with.

If he's 2nd tier, he may top it as the greatest of them. And I suppose we are talking overall, not head-2-head.

[fight_professor]

By no means telling you how to run your own thread, but 2nd tier does kinda = non titlist

Maybe in common usage, but I did specify it as "those outside the top 20 or so HW of alltime".

So it has a narrower context in this thread.

[mickey malone]

Maybe in common usage, but I did specify it as "those outside the top 20 or so HW of alltime".

So it has a narrower context in this thread.

Ok.... Ken Norton (Ali's boogie man) would be a good call....

[sonnyboyx2]

Quarry probably defines the term "2nd tier heavyweight" better than anybody.

He didn't beat the best (Ali, Frazier, Norton) but he beat just about everyone else with names like Floyd Patterson, Ron Lyle, Earnie Shavers, Mac Foster, Thad Spencer, Buster Mathis, Lorenzo Zanon, Joey Orbillo, Randy Neuman, Jack Bodell, Larry Middleton, Brian London, George Johnson on his extensive resume.

He was above the European level heavyweights and the journeymen. Truly a world class top 10 heavyweight contender.

The best heavyweight who never got a chance against the best (Dempsey) was Harry Wills. I wouldn't call him second tier though since I'd probably rate him among my top 15 or top 20 ATG heavyweights.

i agree, Quarry was a real class act his 1st fight against Frazier was a forgotten classic and FOTY ... Quarry would have held his own with virtually every heavyweight champion since 1992

[joe strong]

I'd have to say francois Botha or hasim Rahman.

[joe strong]

Botha won ibf title(stripped because of steroids)& never ducked anyone.when he stepped up he lost to moorer,Tyson,wlad,lewis.Rahman is a 2 time champ,made 5 defence,& fought almost everyone of his era.he fought lewis twice,maskaev twice,tua twice,ruiz,toney twice,Barrett,Holyfield,wlad,meehan,obed Sullivan,sanders.some ugly fights but he never ducked anyone.

[mickey malone]

Botha won ibf title(stripped because of steroids)& never ducked anyone.when he stepped up he lost to moorer,Tyson,wlad,lewis.Rahman is a 2 time champ,made 5 defence,& fought almost everyone of his era.he fought lewis twice,maskaev twice,tua twice,ruiz,toney twice,Barrett,Holyfield,wlad,meehan,obed Sullivan,sanders.some ugly fights but he never ducked anyone.

Ken Norton beats both of these guys, just on the hellish nightmares he gave Ali & Holmes..
If Botha lost to Moorer, drew with Briggs & narrowly beat Schultz, he aint gonna live with a prime Norton.. Rahman could almost be the Norton of this era, but I think it's general consensus, the 70's crop were marginally superior.. Don't forget, Norton was the second man to break Ali's jaw in a winning performance.. Pretty sure they fought 3 times, with each fight going to the wire.. I state that Ken Norton had a far better resume... MM

[fight_professor]

Yeah I can see a place for Rahman. Good HW, not great. But very good. Big hitting hw, he'd beat a lot of guys with that power. Big heart too, if not limited skills.

[mickey malone]

Yeah I can see a place for Rahman. Good HW, not great. But very good. Big hitting hw, he'd beat a lot of guys with that power. Big heart too, if not limited skills.

Have you put me on ignore or something??

[fight_professor]

NO. Why would I?