Why do so many consider super champions the champ but not franchise champ?

Thats because some divisions had unified wba champions like pacquiao after he beat thurman. Again thats not the case with the wbc franchise Suliman said you couldnt even lose it in the ring when he first created the paper title "Franchise" was originally a non-transferable honorary award. Now it's a world championship. The WBC's equivalent of the WBA super world championship. Not sure why this is so hard to understand. It's pretty simple.

You're wrong. For years, the WBA super world championship didn't exist in every weight class, but someone who held it could still be undisputed champion. The WBO super world championship doesn't exist in every weight class, but Canelo is still considered undisputed champion. Thats because some divisions had unified wba champions like pacquiao after he beat thurman. Again thats not the case with the wbc franchise Suliman said you couldnt even lose it in the ring when he first created the paper title

Who is the wbc franchise champion at heavyweight? Light heavyweight? Cruiserweight? Welterweight? Junior welterweight? Nobody. If it dont exist in every weight class its not an official title. Its simple You're wrong. For years, the WBA super world championship didn't exist in every weight class, but someone who held it could still be undisputed champion. The WBO super world championship doesn't exist in every weight class, but Canelo is still considered undisputed champion.

This is a lie. Here are the official WBA ratings: https://www.wbaboxing.com/wp-content...1-november.pdf WBC Franchise world champion Juan Estrada is listed as WBC champion. Here are the official IBF ratings: https://www.ibf-usba-boxing.com/inde...?view=rankings WBC Franchise world champion Juan Estrada is listed as WBC champion. Here are the official WBO ratings: https://www.wboboxing.com/wp-content/themes/wbo/pdf.php WBC Franchise world champion Juan Estrada is listed as WBC champion. Also, the IBF only allows their title to be unified with the highest title of another organization. The IBF does allow their title to be unified with the Franchise world title, which means they view it as the WBC's top title. Who is the wbc franchise champion at heavyweight? Light heavyweight? Cruiserweight? Welterweight? Junior welterweight? Nobody. If it dont exist in every weight class its not an official title. So stop comparing the wbc franchise to the wba super because the wba had super and regular champs at every divison. Not just 3 divisions out of 18 Its simple.

Other than drawing a picture showing the hierarchical relationship of the WBA titles compared to the non-hierarchical relationship between the WBC titles I'm not going to change a view that has no basis in fact. No evidence at all. Evidence that "Franchise" is now a world title: 1. The WBC has repeatedly referred to Kambosos as the undisputed champion. 2. Teofimo publicly showed the certifications from his fights, which proved they were sanctioned by the WBC as world title fights for the "WBC Lightweight Franchise world title." 3. The IBF, WBA and WBO all list Juan Estrada as a WBC world champion in their current ratings, even though he's been Franchise champion since March. 4. The IBF doesn't allow their title to be unified with secondary titles. The IBF title is currently unified with the WBC franchise world title, so clearly the IBF doesn't consider it a secondary title. 5. "Franchise champion" is listed above "Champion" in the official WBC ratings. But in the days of the diamond title, it was listed lower with the international title and the IBF/WBA/WBO titles. Only the Franchise world title has ever been listed above the regular WBC title. So stop saying there's no evidence. We have official statements from the WBC. We have the official WBC ratings. We have the ratings of the other orgs. We have the official sanctioning paperwork for Teofimo's fights. We have lots of evidence. Please stop lying.

That's exactly what the super title was supposed to be. A special elevated designation for a select few elite world champions. You yourself just said it's an elevated position, so how could you then claim that Haney's title is higher than Kambosos's title? There absolutely is evidence by the way that the WBC considers it a world title now. Teofimo Lopez publicly showed the official WBC certifications from his fight with Lomachenko and the paperwork clearly stated WBC FRANCHISE LIGHTWEIGHT WORLD TITLE. No, what I said was you can't use the ratings of the other orgs as proof that they don't recognize the Franchise world title as a world title because all of the orgs list Juan Estrada even though he's a franchise world champion and not a regular world champion. As I said, I'm done with you. Other than drawing a picture showing the hierarchical relationship of the WBA titles compared to the non-hierarchical relationship between the WBC titles I'm not going to change a view that has no basis in fact. No evidence at all. Just a strange arrogance that you must be right in the face of every contradictory proof possible. Even when you are proven wrong (see "the other orgs recognise Kambosos as champion"... spoiler, they absolutely evidently don't) you're still adamant that you're right. You're either a troll or a moron. Or possibly both. As much as I enjoy an honest debate with boxing fans, there's no point engaging with you any further. ​​​​​

Belts are meaningless and the Franchise one is literally the most meaningless. Stop giving it airtime, it's a waste of time, nobody cares about the WBCs nonsense. You creating threads like this just supports it. Call it BS the way it is and leave it there. You missed the pt entirely,the pt is you can't say super champion is THE champ even though they fight bums & no mandos for yrs on end, then turn around & say franchise is not a real champ & doesn't count. The super champ is just as meaningless/worthy as Franchise, depending on whether you agree with it. The pt is they are both almost the same thing & its lame to pretend Buds Wbo belt holds more weight than Kambosos franchise belt, or that Muratas belt holds more weight than Canelos franchise belt,they are just placeholders that say those fighters scalp is more valuable for opponents. ​​​​​​

He sees it as an elevated standing for special boxers. Not a 'Super' title. It's exactly what they said it was - a special designation. FFS, it's event written in their rules exactly what it is, and you still seem to think it's changed since then, in the face of absolutely no evidence! That's exactly what the super title was supposed to be. A special elevated designation for a select few elite world champions. You yourself just said it's an elevated position, so how could you then claim that Haney's title is higher than Kambosos's title? There absolutely is evidence by the way that the WBC considers it a world title now. Teofimo Lopez publicly showed the official WBC certifications from his fight with Lomachenko and the paperwork clearly stated WBC FRANCHISE LIGHTWEIGHT WORLD TITLE. And you claim the other orgs recognise Franchise as the true WBC Champ... then posted two orgs' ratings that showed that they don't consider Kambosos the champion No, what I said was you can't use the ratings of the other orgs as proof that they don't recognize the Franchise world title as a world title because all of the orgs list Juan Estrada even though he's a franchise world champion and not a regular world champion.

Calling you lazy doesn't amount to worked up.(it doesn't say no mandatories,it says"the Wbc will decide on a case by case basis",just as Wba/Wbo say the exact same thing (that Super Champs only have to fight Mandos if the Wbo decides to make them,but in practice the Wbc orders their champs to fight more than the other 2. (Anyone who a fighter has to fight is a mandatory, just like mando eliminators are called that) Anyways I don't care about belts at all,all I care about is that certain fighters are elevated to a higher status than the rest,& they become top dog whos scalp becomes more valuable on anyone's mantle. I didn't care about Canelo getting Undisputed v Plant,as I considered him way above the rest for a long time. Belts are all meaningless,the only reason they matter is they tell you whos the highest ranked,& if Canelos franchise champ it just reiterates the obvious that hes a higher champ than Charlo because hes beating way better opponents way more often in way more divisions. Belts are meaningless and the Franchise one is literally the most meaningless. Stop giving it airtime, it's a waste of time, nobody cares about the WBCs nonsense. You creating threads like this just supports it. Call it BS the way it is and leave it there.

Franchise champion is listed higher than regular champion in the official WBC ratings. When asked directly in an interview which championship is higher, he clearly motioned that the franchise champion is above the regular champion. The WBC has repeatedly said that Kambosos is undisputed champion, which could only be true if he held the higher title. The IBF allows their title to be unified with the franchise world title, which could only be true if the franchise world title was higher than the regular world title. But you saw the interview. You heard his words. He sees it as an elevated standing for special boxers. Not a 'Super' title. It's exactly what they said it was - a special designation. FFS, it's event written in their rules exactly what it is, and you still seem to think it's changed since then, in the face of absolutely no evidence! And you claim the other orgs recognise Franchise as the true WBC Champ... then posted two orgs' ratings that showed that they don't consider Kambosos the champion. I'm done with you. I'm sure you're taking the pi55.

The WBA is a joke but they're very clear about the hierarchy of their titles. For them there's WBA (Super) Champion WBA Champion WBA (Regular) Champion (only applies when a Super champion is active) WBA (Interim) Chaampion There's no confusion on their part who the top WBA champion is. If there's a Super champion, they're the top champion. If not, the WBA Champion is. Simple. The WBC are the ones that simultaneously call Haney and Kambosos their top champion. The WBA isn't pretending Trevor Bryan's title is as important as Oleksandr Usyk's. This is my answer as well. As a side note, boxing has way too many titles, most of them worhless trinket belts like the intercontinental titles of the different alphabet organizations. We need a complete overhaul, one champion per division.

Lol, you have no idea what you are getting so worked up about. Calm down. Suilaman has clarified it all. No mandatories, it's not a real title, that's why no one cares... ​​​​​Its just a title to represent the WBC in whatever they would like them to represent them as. Nothing to get so stressed about. Let them enjoy their bedside trinket - it's shiny, that's about all it is. ​​​​​ Calling you lazy doesn't amount to worked up.(it doesn't say no mandatories,it says"the Wbc will decide on a case by case basis",just as Wba/Wbo say the exact same thing (that Super Champs only have to fight Mandos if the Wbo decides to make them,but in practice the Wbc orders their champs to fight more than the other 2. (Anyone who a fighter has to fight is a mandatory, just like mando eliminators are called that) Anyways I don't care about belts at all,all I care about is that certain fighters are elevated to a higher status than the rest,& they become top dog whos scalp becomes more valuable on anyone's mantle. I didn't care about Canelo getting Undisputed v Plant,as I considered him way above the rest for a long time. Belts are all meaningless,the only reason they matter is they tell you whos the highest ranked,& if Canelos franchise champ it just reiterates the obvious that hes a higher champ than Charlo because hes beating way better opponents way more often in way more divisions.

That's what you've got? Sulaiman motioned with his hands? :rofl: Franchise champion is listed higher than regular champion in the official WBC ratings. When asked directly in an interview which championship is higher, he clearly motioned that the franchise champion is above the regular champion. The WBC has repeatedly said that Kambosos is undisputed champion, which could only be true if he held the higher title. The IBF allows their title to be unified with the franchise world title, which could only be true if the franchise world title was higher than the regular world title.

The Wbc lists the franchise champ as higher than the world champ in their rankings, shouldn't that be enough for them to be considered the same thing as a so called"super champ" like Bud or the Wba super champs? So how is Buds belt different from Wbc franchise champ that was started as a way for Wbc to let the best fight the best( possibly in different divisions even) while the #1 contender doesn't cry about it & can't sue because they are then gifted a world champ belt instead. (So iow it has same special privileges Wbo provides Bud,for same reason because he has won multiple titles) The Super champ designation allows Bud to avoid mandatories every 9 mos as required by" world" champs like Andrade. (up to several yrs) the Wba also has World champs & super champs. The franchise belt Canelo was given still shows him being ranked above Charlo at mw to this day,& despite Canelo Undisputed smw he still isn't listed as franchise champ at smw, implying he doesn't take the belt with him to every division he fights in, just like only some divisions have super champs. I could give a fook what a sanctioning body thinks is champ. I KNOW Whats what. If u don’t. Get into luge competitions.

He literally motioned with his hands that the Franchise world title is higher than the regular world title. That's what you've got? Sulaiman motioned with his hands? :rofl: He's saying Franchise is for special boxers. Fighters that are on a certain level. It's like being knighted for services to WBC boxing. That was the original premise before they started transferring it around. But Haney is the lightweight champion of the division. And you blew out your own argument with regards to the other orgs. They very clearly recognise Haney and don't believe that their champion Kambosos is undisputed. Even you shouldn't be able to dispute that any more.

Obviously your reading comprehension sucks,the rules CLEARLY say that the Wbc gets to decide who the franchise champ fights(even the world champ has to get approved for whomever they fight thats not a mandatory) (ffs you even posted the rule that says the Wbc gets to pick who the franchise champ fights (the Wbc has made it clear on numerous occasions that if their champs aren't fighting a mando or champ from different division they have to fight who they tell them to(it even says so under franchise champ rule you just posted,so you're obviously talking out of your ass, especially because they ordered Canelo to fight Yildirim even though he was fighting nothing but champs for like 5 fights in a row) Ps you're obviously too lazy to read the Super champ rules or you'd know they grant the same exact privileges as franchise(that the Wbo/Wba gets to decide whether to force them to fight someone on a case by case basis,& so far the Wbc franchise champs have all been fighting much better comp than Super champs like Bud who went 3 yrs without a mando defense) Lol, you have no idea what you are getting so worked up about. Calm down. Suilaman has clarified it all. No mandatories, it's not a real title, that's why no one cares... ​​​​​Its just a title to represent the WBC in whatever they would like them to represent them as. Nothing to get so stressed about. Let them enjoy their bedside trinket - it's shiny, that's about all it is. ​​​​​

Obviously you don't realise that making things up in your posts doesn't make it true. From the WBC rules: A Franchise Boxer shall enjoy special status with respect to his or her mandatory obligations, holding multiple titles and competing for titles of other organizations, as the WBC Board of Governors, in its sole discretion, rules on a case-by-case basis. Mauricio has cleared this up and has said that as they are elite boxers, they don't need to have mandatories. Also: The WBC will always support Canelo, he is our Franchise Champion, which allows him to seek any kind of challenge and not hindering him is a virtue with that designation. He has an open path to look for alternative ways and we will support him unconditionally On why Canelo/Mukabu Cruiserweight has been sanctioned. No boxing fan should support a belt that has 'special status' for mandatories. This is boxing. And no boxing fan should support an orga nonsense. Just stop it. Lovely belt for the bedside cabinet though Obviously your reading comprehension sucks,the rules CLEARLY say that the Wbc gets to decide who the franchise champ fights(even the world champ has to get approved for whomever they fight thats not a mandatory) (ffs you even posted the rule that says the Wbc gets to pick who the franchise champ fights (the Wbc has made it clear on numerous occasions that if their champs aren't fighting a mando or champ from different division they have to fight who they tell them to(it even says so under franchise champ rule you just posted,so you're obviously talking out of your ass, especially because they ordered Canelo to fight Yildirim even though he was fighting nothing but champs for like 5 fights in a row) Ps you're obviously too lazy to read the Super champ rules or you'd know they grant the same exact privileges as franchise(that the Wbo/Wba gets to decide whether to force them to fight someone on a case by case basis,& so far the Wbc franchise champs have all been fighting much better comp than Super champs like Bud who went 3 yrs without a mando defense)

Obviously you don't realize that thats completely wrong,Wbc franchise champ still has to fight whoever the Wbc says,on a case by case basis no different from the super champ in Wbo/Wba. (If Teo doesn't fight the other champs or next orgs mandatory he would've been ordered by Wbc to fight Haney,when Loma had the belt same applies.(The title does have a single division which is why Wbc still has Canelo as franchise champ at mw not at Smw/Lhw etc. The Wba/Wbo super champ is selectively awarded in certain divisions & not others,the Wbc now has 3 Franchise champs & that's exactly how the super champion started after Lennox Lewis suggested it to the Wba(if you read my 2nd post) Obviously you don't realise that making things up in your posts doesn't make it true. From the WBC rules: A Franchise Boxer shall enjoy special status with respect to his or her mandatory obligations, holding multiple titles and competing for titles of other organizations, as the WBC Board of Governors, in its sole discretion, rules on a case-by-case basis. Mauricio has cleared this up and has said that as they are elite boxers, they don't need to have mandatories. Also: The WBC will always support Canelo, he is our Franchise Champion, which allows him to seek any kind of challenge and not hindering him is a virtue with that designation. He has an open path to look for alternative ways and we will support him unconditionally On why Canelo/Mukabu Cruiserweight has been sanctioned. No boxing fan should support a belt that has 'special status' for mandatories. This is boxing. And no boxing fan should support an orga nonsense. Just stop it. Lovely belt for the bedside cabinet though

WTF? Both orgs list Haney as WBC Champion! Yes, and all three list Juan Estrada, who is Franchise world champion. So you can't claim the Franchise world title is unrecognized as clearly the WBA, IBF and WBO recognize it.

Did you watch it? ​​​​He never referred to Franchise being the real champion. He says Haney is the champion of the division. Lopez and now Kambosos held a designation of high esteem. But he's not the champion. He literally motioned with his hands that the Franchise world title is higher than the regular world title. In the official ratings, the Franchise world title is higher than the regular world title. The WBC has repeatedly said Kambosos is undisputed champion, which means Haney's belt is secondary.