Has fighting “in the pocket” become a lost art?

I think of fighting "in the pocket" as something that Loma does (staying in punching range, excellent footwork, using angles and no clinching) whereas "infighting" (lots of grappling, holding and hitting) is more of an Andre Ward type style. "In the pocket" fighting takes a bit more skill and consequently is not seen alot these days.

Why? Who wants to be in the line of fire? Zipping by punches, zing ing past fists, it is a lost art. Using rolling with the punches instead of blocking them. Who other than somebody with huge hueves would invite that? Big respects to toney and the likes of similar to him!

I agree with this one. Not to mention, amateurish boxers who have alot to prove would usually stay in the pocket. Fighters mature and grow out of it. It's a beautiful thing to see. Two seasoned amateurs in small, local clubs. You watch the novices and can point out which ones have good potential, but then in comes open class and you can tell, okay this is the real deal.

There were more fighters back then and more competition. Amateur tournaments would be packed. You could fight multiple times a night and they'd last a long time. There's some that will still last a month or so (only fighting on weekends). I agree with this one. Not to mention, amateurish boxers who have alot to prove would usually stay in the pocket. Fighters mature and grow out of it.

when did they start regulating inside fighting Seems every elite in the black and white days could CQC There were more fighters back then and more competition. Amateur tournaments would be packed. You could fight multiple times a night and they'd last a long time. There's some that will still last a month or so (only fighting on weekends).

Artur Beterbiev is a bit of a monster on the inside. and Lomachenko can work at any distance..

when did they start regulating inside fighting Seems every elite in the black and white days could CQC Taking out was a poor choice of words.

... of course my boy Ronnie gave him problems, but he was a 31 yo fighter with a long amateur career behind him... David wasn't even 21 yo... Yeah that’s all fine and good. All I said was Gavril gave him big problems whilst you originally suggested he didn’t.

This was probably one of the most impressive things I ever saw Mayweather do (and that's obviously saying something). Yeah Floyd was very good at short range despite generally preferring to fight at mid-long.

Regardless who you thought won, you have to admit Gavril gave him big problems. I had Gavril winning the first fight 115-112. The scorecards were horrendous IMO. ... of course my boy Ronnie gave him problems, but he was a 31 yo fighter with a long amateur career behind him... David wasn't even 21 yo...

I think taking the infighting out of boxing is losing a whole dimension to the sport. Infighting isn't clinching and smothering the other guy it's about manuvering the opponent around using your brain and landing clean hard punches to the body and the head. A short armed fighter is at a disavantage generally on the outside. Fair enough. The shorter fighter may be much more effective in the inside where he can use his ring IQ and strength to dominate the opponent. Except the referees tend to break things up too soon. It would be nice to see both fighters do what they do best.

pros dont go to "WAR" anymore. floyd has changed the game to hit and not get hit. he has imprinted that to all the new boxers minds to maximize their wealth and health.

Guys like James Toney and Roberto Duran were masters at this. Aside from Canelo and Roman Gonzalez, I can’t think of many modern fighters who have mastered this technique. This was probably one of the most impressive things I ever saw Mayweather do (and that's obviously saying something).

Nope. He'll just throw a couple then back away. Watch Roman Gonzalez, JLC. I’ve watched Roman Gonzalez live and in person from ringside. He’s my favourite active fighter. If you don’t think Canelo is a great inside fighter you must have some sort of agenda.

I watched the fight several times -- I told you, Gavril is Romanian (like I am) and I wanted him to win, of course... But Benavidez was better... Ronnie was promoted by Floyd (and maybe that's why he won on one of the score cards)... Regardless who you thought won, you have to admit Gavril gave him big problems. I had Gavril winning the first fight 115-112. The scorecards were horrendous IMO.

Was just watching Duran-Barkley, even that old fat version of Duran was amazing on the inside and out. Nobody fights like that anymore.

:lol1: Canelo is a fantastic inside fighter... Nope. He'll just throw a couple then back away. Watch Roman Gonzalez, JLC.

It's seems like a declining art Definitely agree some of it is the refereeing I remember Atlas often saying look these two guys are making the "silent agreement" that it's time to rest when in those close quarters and wait for the ref. At the very least, I like to see some urgency in trying to stay out of a clinch and/or keep a hand free... So much magic happens in fights where you have two guys who can fight inside and a ref that knows what's up. "Punch to get out" "hand is free" or just a slap on the back instead of a full break. also unhooking the arms in a clinch is something I used to see. Some refs have off nights as well. Seems like some of the old school trainers who taught those skills are aging/gone. I think about this issue quite a bit and I actually think something could be learned from MMA coaches who now teach "dirty boxing" - as it relates to balance and leverage

Unfortunately your absolutely right One big reason for that , imo ,is the refereeing Refs are not taught to let fighters get out of clinch or chest to chest They jump in to soon and recently it’s been happening more and more Especially Floyd latter fights, and he was the best damn clinch fighter, and wanted to bang it out like he did vs Cotto, canelo, and maidana a couple of them other fights us fans was robbed in that regard

Not a lot, clearly. If you excel at phone booth fights, it isn't a more risky approach. The reality is, like other areas of boxing, it is lost because trainers don't have the knowledge and fighters come up with less skills on average than the golden eras. Boxing isn't evolving it's been regressing. Smaller talent pool equals less depth and less development due to low levels of competition. These days anyone can turn pro and guys win titles with flaws left and right. Why? They aren't having to get through guys with complex and intricate defense and offense. Why? Because they are taught minimal crap and pushed to get as far as they can as carefully as they can and in the least fights possible. Does this help you take less damage? Sure. But it also means you get less exposed and challenged. Not a good thing, to me. I know what I know as an amateur largely because I went out of my way to study the greats, and to really study particular fighters and from the past. If I only knew what my two trainers in my life have shown me, I'd be less than half of the fighter I am today. They taught me the fundamentals and a few tips and tricks of the trade, some combinations. What really makes me what I am, is what I've added to my own game, and that was entirely self developed and learned from fighters I chose to emulate. And I don't think even the average pro has that kind of hunger and will to learn when it comes to boxing. True students of the game are hard to find imo even within the sport itself. Truly great fighters of today stand out because of the gap between guys like Fury and Lomachenko who live and breath boxing on a different level than even the next tier of boxing elite, but they are still outliers. The average fighter today is less skilled, less conditioned, and less experienced than the average fighter back when champs defended their titles every other month and were overall more active, fought for more rounds, and had a much deeper pool of peers to contend with. Great points yeah. They help clarify what I was trying to say. I didn't mean it's inherently risky, meant more that it seems riskier if you aren't good at it or weren't properly trained to fight inside. Though it probably depends on your and your opponents style and body dimensions too. Or maybe I'm wrong. Either way thanks for the respectful sonning.