Lets clear something up about Ruiz's nationality ok?

The argument for why it is important to identify a certain way. This thread is like a wishbone that is being stretched at both ends. On one end we have people still parroting the idea that one must be "Either/Or," refusing to understand that being an American is such that it does not contradict claims for distinct nationality. On the other hand have come some really good arguments about why it is a little shady to claim something and not acknowledge citizenship in the process. For example, some have talked about Ruiz's command of English, his education in this country, etc. One of the books that is required reading in the Westpoint Army Academy and I believe the Naval Academy in Annapolis Maryland, is Socrates' "The Apology" which was written by Plato describing the decision Socrates makes, to allow the state to take his life. I think some of Socrates arguments are relevant to this discussion. What do we owe the state? and before one goes off half ****ed... The State is also our institution and do we have a duty to try to fix it? with our votes, our actions of protest? If you own land you probably depend on the notion that someone cannot come along, use your property and tell you if you do not like it, they will shoot you. If you have kids, and are not particularly well educated, you probably want your kids to be able to read and write. And unless you happen to have an assortment of road graders, blades, etc? You probably like the roads that allow you to ride to work and to play... YES we pay for those things... Yes we often want to debate how much they are worth... Taxes are a pain in the rump. But without a central authority, until we evolve considerably, we could not have much of anything without a state, an agency of authority that we have a social contract with, whereby we pursue our self interest and are protected in so doing, allowing others to do the same. So Socrates in the Apology was about how much allegiance, loyalty do we owe the state? Lets rephrase that: John Ruiz, growing up, educated and protected by the State of California, how important is it that he acknowledge that situation? As a success, would his advice be, to other Mexicans who are American Citizens, to ignore the state in which they were raised up? If so, how might that improve the lot for other Mexicans raised in areas like border towns in California? Most immigrants in this country imo are saved because of some basic reflexive behaviors: First off, they want to improve the American experience for other individuals in America who share their culture. Korean business owners have told me that when they started a business they were told what the business would be, where it would be, and set up. Second of all, they love this country and respect it. This is never at the exclusion of their own culture, or nationality. One can hate Castro and still love Cuba, and, all the while, be an American. So the question becomes what does Ruiz owe in his allegiance? Would he have had the chance, the resources to be succesful the same way in Mexico? And what actions and statements could Ruiz make/do to help other kids be a success? being raised in this country Ruiz is Bilingual, has many benefits that made it so he would not starve... etc. Socrates believed that he owed his life to the state....not agreeing with this lol, but he welcomed martyrdome if it would improve the situation and expose the ignorance of individuals. Something to think about.

I gotta think azzhole? you said the Spainiards did not conquer the Aztecs. I watch your bloodline flow every time I take a piss. did you renew your La Raza membership? BOOM. Destroyed *****. That's what I thought. :headbang:

https://media3.giphy.com/media/11eSHfUlB284H6/giphy.gif :lol1: http://www.theparisreview.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/labyrinth-32.jpg

God you're stupid. What's up with all the hillbilly's on this site lately? AMURICA YEA BABY. TRUMP! Yes, the Spaniards put away the Aztecs, and then what happened? Mexico is the result of the Aztec, Mayan and Spaniard hybrid. Aztec, Mayan, Spanish = Mexico Saying one beat the hell out of the other makes no difference to me as our blood lines flow through one or multiple empires from centuries ago. I literally have close to 50% (Spanish/Iberian, indigenous) blood of each after doing a DNA test. It's as if someone told you Italian immigrants and German immigrants and Irish immigrants went to war over America and killed each other until Germany got to set the rules and conquered the others....all while you having German/Irish/Italian DNA. Think caveman...THINK! I gotta think azzhole? you said the Spainiards did not conquer the Aztecs. I watch your bloodline flow every time I take a piss. did you renew your La Raza membership?

So Cortes did not conquer and destroy the human sacrificing Aztec empire and kill Montezuma? that is all fake history and now rewritten by an illegal working in taco bell. Aztecs killed near a million fellow Indians. any American dumb enough to move to that failed narco state deserves to be beaten and robbed by the locals God you're stupid. What's up with all the hillbilly's on this site lately? AMURICA YEA BABY. TRUMP! Yes, the Spaniards put away the Aztecs, and then what happened? Mexico is the result of the Aztec, Mayan and Spaniard hybrid. Aztec, Mayan, Spanish = Mexico Saying one beat the hell out of the other makes no difference to me as our blood lines flow through one or multiple empires from centuries ago. I literally have close to 50% (Spanish/Iberian, indigenous) blood of each after doing a DNA test. It's as if someone told you Italian immigrants and German immigrants and Irish immigrants went to war over America and killed each other until Germany got to set the rules and conquered the others....all while you having German/Irish/Italian DNA. Think caveman...THINK!

Our empire is the mix of all of it. Mexico isn't Aztecs, and Mayans. It's the trifecta. Aztecs + Mayans + Spaniards = Mexico. There is documentation of the first Mexican centuries ago. It was the first child between a Spaniard and native. Before this child Mexicans literally did not exist. That name was thought up yet. Saying Spaniards beat our empire sounds reetarded lol. Our civilization in 2019 is what it is because of the history. Also, for the record, in 2019 Mexicans don't immigrate to the U.S. anymore. This isn't the 90's bruh. You know who is immigrating a lot these days though? American U.S. citizens moving to Mexico. There are now more people from the U.S. moving to Mexico then the other way around. Not bad for a *****hole huh? So Cortes did not conquer and destroy the human sacrificing Aztec empire and kill Montezuma? that is all fake history and now rewritten by an illegal working in taco bell. Aztecs killed near a million fellow Indians. any American dumb enough to move to that failed narco state deserves to be beaten and robbed by the locals

This guy has no clue of what the term dual nationality means

Your last paragraph shows your true colors... Ruiz is the best American Heavyweight atm and has 3 straps. Catch up with boxing news. If Deontay Wilder himself says Alabama is a “Deep South” racist state then I don’t have an opinion to say Tennessee would be one as well? Don’t be offended that not everyone likes Trump. And regarding generational status for Ruiz, you missed the point with your warped theories about illegal immigration. The point to TJ Highway is that he said his skin is “brown.” The color of one’s skin has nothing to do with “illegal immigration” or whatever your intended points were. I have no idea what you mean by my true colors, but Joshua is a glass jawed weak champion imo and Ruiz ain't crap either. We shall find out soon if that is right or wrong. And I am glad that you are using Wilder as your source to stereotype millions of people. Again, you have no problem stereotyping millions of people. That makes you just as bad as the people you "claim" are racist. You said "that building a wall would limit future generations like Ruiz Jr". I don't give a F about someone's color, the wall is about keeping out illegal immigrants. So I asked you, is Ruiz's parents illegally in the US? Please try to keep up.

So you are good with stereotyping a whole state as racist? How nice of you to judge and be exactly like the people you "claim" to be racist. Are you saying that Ruiz's parents are illegal immigrants? And how dare a country want to have only legal immigrants, but this isn't the place for that discussion imo. I think Ruiz isn't that good and won't be around much longer anyways, so I don't care who he wants to represent. I don't mind as long as he moves to Mexico :headbang:

Lol. Everything I said was educational. Why you get offended? Lol You brought “race” I didn’t. I know anthropology bruh. Use your words wisely and don’t get offended when nothing’s was negative in the first place You have seriously got to be the biggest idiot on here

The service is important...but as another poster said, let’s be realistic...or as the LDBC say about Ward “c00ning...” that “if the police stop you, you’re still a black man... doesn’t matter if you identity half White...” Therefore, the simple dynamics of discrimination is that Andy Ruiz Jr. if dropped in Tennessee... is merely a “Mexican.” And many people voted for Trump with these beliefs in “make America great again...” in that Ruiz Jr. generational status doesn’t matter...that building a wall would limit future generations like Ruiz Jr... Regardless that he’s American! And that’s all she wrote! What’s good blood So you are good with stereotyping a whole state as racist? How nice of you to judge and be exactly like the people you "claim" to be racist. Are you saying that Ruiz's parents are illegal immigrants? And how dare a country want to have only legal immigrants, but this isn't the place for that discussion imo. I think Ruiz isn't that good and won't be around much longer anyways, so I don't care who he wants to represent.

Mexican or American isn’t a race! Lol We ain’t talking white nordid vs Mongoloid... Keeping up means the context is about ethnicity aka cultural heritage WITHIN one’s nationality. No, it's not you twit. Maybe that's your issue....You're just a dumb mother@cker

The service is important...but as another poster said, let’s be realistic...or as the LDBC say about Ward “c00ning...” that “if the police stop you, you’re still a black man... doesn’t matter if you identity half White...” Therefore, the simple dynamics of discrimination is that Andy Ruiz Jr. if dropped in Tennessee... is merely a “Mexican.” And many people voted for Trump with these beliefs in “make America great again...” in that Ruiz Jr. generational status doesn’t matter...that building a wall would limit future generations like Ruiz Jr... Regardless that he’s American! And that’s all she wrote! What’s good blood I didn't read anything like that in the post I responded to so you lost me. This isn't a race debate, it's a nationality debate. Keep up

Hi Abby26! Quick Question for you. Please show me the quote you are referring to! I'd love to know it. And secondly, which president are you referring to? The president of the United States of Mexico or the United States of America? I think I know, but I would hate to assume. And correct me if I am wrong, but if you are a Mexican in the US, why would you be American rather than Mexican. Your statement in itself is saying they are Mexican and not American. If I am American and I am visiting England, that doesn't make me English. Please clarify your well thought out statement! Thank you in advance! Great post and I can't wait for the response. :cool2:

I identify as british because my family was owned by a master with english heritage I identify as a Jamaican because I have a huge knob

The president of the united states believes all mexicans in the states are mexicans and not americans thus his attack on the judge of mex descent. Then Mexicans americans have the right to claim to b mexicans. Hi Abby26! Quick Question for you. Please show me the quote you are referring to! I'd love to know it. And secondly, which president are you referring to? The president of the United States of Mexico or the United States of America? I think I know, but I would hate to assume. And correct me if I am wrong, but if you are a Mexican in the US, why would you be American rather than Mexican. Your statement in itself is saying they are Mexican and not American. If I am American and I am visiting England, that doesn't make me English. Please clarify your well thought out statement! Thank you in advance!

Idiot! Dumb ass statement! I was born in "The OC!" St Joe's Hospital! My skin is brown. Even though I severed 10 years in the USMC and am retired LE! I am American! I was born here! One Uncle was a Screaming Eagle and dropped into Normandy the night before the invasion. My pops, his brother and my aunts husband severed in Korea! Yes I speak Fluent Spanish! My skin is brown. I love tacos, Burritos, Tecate and Presitente. But I am an American! Semper FI! TYVM for your service. God Bless America :usa:

Nah, your kind was kicked out from England/Ireland, you took perfectly good land from the Natives, brought slaves from Africa to do your labour... Yeah, some heritage you have! You feel so proud about a country that did not exist a few hundred years ago, founded in blood, slavery. :stupid: Some people, like you, think that our country was built on slaves when they made up less than 1% of the population at the time. Like 1% built this country lol. That's the Mexi-math education system at play. Good thing Andy Ruiz had a US education.

You're ignoring ethnicity though. Ruiz is American by nationality his ethnicity is "Mexican" in the extent he looks to be of mixed euro and indigenous racial heritage which is what the majority of mexicans are. All mexicans even the Canelo types seem to cling to that "Raza" identity. Im not ignoring ethinicity at all. An american citizen of mexican or partial mexican descent is what you would call a "Mexican-American" Ruiz isnt claming mexican american. He is claiming to be a mexican. Im not even nitpicking semantics. I am perfectly fine with a lot of people calling themselves "mexiican" as a shortened term of mexican-american. Its more the complete lack of mentioning his American roots, which in this case he really has American roots and moved to Mexico, rather than the other way around. Waving the Mexican flag, playing the anthemn, calling himself only the first "mexican" heavyweight rather than first "mexican-american" heavyweight. Its a complete denial of his citizenship, his roots and his links to America. I mean this is a guy who speaks perfect english and talks like a bro from California. DLH and Mikey Garcia never went out of their way to pretend to be Mexican citizens. Look at Lewis left the UK but doesnt deny his british roots. The whole broadcast and subsequent media coverage has been odd the way they portray Ruiz as a native Mexican citizen.

The president of the united states believes all mexicans in the states are mexicans and not americans thus his attack on the judge of mex descent. Then Mexicans americans have the right to claim to b mexicans. Atleast Ruiz put money where his mouth is and moved to mexico before he claims mexican. Weird that so many Americans refuse to be associated with America, while LIVING in America, with American passports, claim mexico but damn sure wouldnt move down there.