Why are some dismissive of top cruiser weights having success at heavyweight when:

why are they at CW and not HW already? 1) Because cruiser weight is currently a better weight division with one of the most historical tournament going on there. 2) Because of political reasons (A side and B side nonsense).

why are they at CW and not HW already?

Yeah, because young fighters never improve right? Tyson Fury was a young and undisciplined guy and Peter Fury made him fight to his advantages, utilising his size and reach and movement. Hammer and Chisora aren't the best fighters, but it's the way Fury completely neutralised them with ease. I'm not saying he is in the most entertaining fights, but what other fighter could have neutralised Klitschko like that? He looked bad because he knew every time he overextended he'd be hit square in the face, and he wasn't used to a fighter dancing around him, switching stances and had good head movement compared to other HWs. Not even the biggest Fury fan, but to deny his talent and the difficulty he poses to any HW around today when he was in his prime is silly. We saw what Hughie Fury was able to do with Parker, and while he justly lost that fight, Hughie Fury is a vastly inferior boxer in every aspect to Tyson. Tyson played with him like a little boy in sparring Young fighters do improve, yes. Likewise, old fighters (like a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko) also decline. So who exactly has Tyson Fury beaten, that leads to the conclusion that he couldn't be defeated by the likes of Oleksandr Usyk, Murat Gassiev or Mairis Briedis? Christian Hammer and Derek Chisora are worlds apart from Usyk, Gassiev or Briedis. Yet, Fury did a far worse job on a much smaller Chisora than a prime David Haye did, who is a natural cruiser weight. This natural cruiser weight in David Haye knocked Chisora out, which the much bigger Fury couldn't even come close to doing. And Christian Hammer was already knocked out more brutally in 6 rounds by Mariusz Wach of all people. Fury needed 2 extra rounds to force a corner stoppage. This same Mariusz Wach was beaten from pillar to post by a small heavyweight in Alexander Povetkin who is closer in size to Gassiev, Briedis or Usyk than he is to big heavyweights like Tyson Fury. So how do any of these wins prove those top 3 cruiser weights couldn't defeat Tyson Fury? What do you think would happen to Hammer or Chisora if they faced Usyk, Brieidis or Gassiev. Both Briedis and Gassiev would probably knock Hammer out. Brieidis might even KO Chisora, since he already proved his punching power is on the level of David Haye. And Usyk would win 12 rounds against both. I'm not denying Fury's talent. I'm denying any supposed abilities he MIGHT have that he hasn't shown yet. Fury hasn't done anything to suggest top cruiser weights couldn't defeat him. And Wladimir Klitschko, at age 39, could very well have been a shot fighter. Oleksandr Usyk could very well have done the same thing to a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko that Tyson Fury did. Why could Fury barely land a glove on a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko is the question. If anything, that bout shows how poor Fury is. How about we go through every other past heavyweight champion at age 39 and see how well they were doing? Fury deserves very little credit for defeating a 39 year old heavyweight champion (especially the unconvincing way he did) when pretty much every other past heavyweight champ was losing to inferior boxers compared to Tyson Fury such as bums / journeyman or they were retired by that age.

1. Pedvetkin has 0 wins over top 5 HW's since about 2011 when he had a tough fight against Chagaev and the division was completely different. Stiverne+Wlad=top 5 heavies. Doesn't even have a win as good as Hughie Fury. 2. Takam was up 4-0 to start on Pedvetkin in a competitive fight. Takam was in survival mode from round 1 in an noncompetitive fight. Takam a blown up cruiser? Don't think you realize how jacked this guy is he's a tank. https://www.boxingnewsandviews.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Carlos-Takam-Record.jpg 3. Ruiz is jacked, his quads are shredded. He's fat but carries a ton of muscle under it. The extra fat allows him to absorb punishment. https://www.proboxing-fans.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/andy-ruiz-weigh-in.jpg 4. Styles. Usyk doesn't have the power of a HW, added weight takes away his speed. Gets hit too much as well. Briedis is completely dependent on holding for defense, would not work against jacked world class heavies not a 20th ranked fighter like Charr fresh off a KO loss. Adamek is a better version of Briedis and we all saw how much he struggled at HW. Gassiev is barely 24, he needs time to get better and adapt, he's the only 1 out of those 3 that has the potential for HW. The fact that he's barely 24 with his lack of amateur experience and top 2 in the division shows how weak cruiser currently is. Gassiev is years away from his prime as a fighter.

FWIW I also though Fury lost that first Mcdermott fight. Wasn't he like 19 back then? To use that to deny his accomplishments since then is not very objective to say the least. Unless of course you are suggesting Mcdermott would have beaten Klitschko? You may as well take an early loss in any boxer's career and use that to negate their future successes, even if they beat lineal champions and p4p fighters

Tyson Fury is too good, based on what? I've seen his bouts against the likes of Nevan Pjkic (who Fury got dropped by), John Mcdermott (who Fury argaubly lost to in first bout) and Steven Cinningham (who Fury got dropped by) to know that Fury is not as good as some think he is and that he can lose to top cruiser weights. All of those boxers I mentioned that Fury struggled against, are below 6 foot 4 inches in height. Fury's best performance was against a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko. 39 years is an age when every other past heavyweight champion was either retired, or losing to inferior boxers to Tyson Fury such as bums / journeymen. If anything, those journeymen / bums were beating 35+ year old past heavyweight champions more convincingly than Fury beat Wladiimr Klitschko when Wlad was 39 years of age. Wladimir Klitschko may have looked bad against Fury (as he is historically supposed to at that age). But Fury looked HORRIBLE against a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko (he historically shouldn't against an opponent of that age). Just go look at how much he struggled to land meaningful punches on a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko. Despite his longer reach, he had to settle for 2 or 3 cuffing punches each round to steal rounds. He barely landed anything meaningful on Wladimir Klitschko and in this department, both were even since Wladimir Klitschko responded back with landing even number of meaningful damaging punches, each time Fury landed such a punch. I personally had the bout a draw as a result! Fury's punch accuracy was horrible against Wladimir Klitschko. He missed a career high against a 39 year old boxer who was arguably shot. So if you want to judge Fury's quality as a boxer based on his one win against Wladimir Klitschko, then it is a fallacy since there exists a very small sample size. It's not enough to go by since Wladimir Klitschko at age 39 may very well have been a 'shot' fighter and Fury only managed to win, because of that reason, rather than him having boxing abilities at a level you are claiming he has. There are AT LEAST 3 fighters Fury struggled against, all whom are shorter than 6 foot 4. That's a bigger sample size to judge Fury's quality on, rather than one fight against arguably a shot fighter in Wladimir Klitschko when Wlad was 39 years of age. And Usyk, Briedis and Gassiev are all much better than Steve Cunningham, Nevan Pjakic and John McDermott. I see no reason why either of these 3 couldn't defeat Fury if those other 3 boxers gave Fury hell. And put Steve Cunningham against Gassiev or Brieidis, and Cunningham gets body bagged in less time than it took Fury to KO Cunningham. And Steven Cunningham, nor Derek Chisora are comparable in anyway shape or form to Brieidis or Gassiev, never mind Usyk in terms of boxing skills / abilities. Yeah, because young fighters never improve right? Tyson Fury was a young and undisciplined guy and Peter Fury made him fight to his advantages, utilising his size and reach and movement. Hammer and Chisora aren't the best fighters, but it's the way Fury completely neutralised them with ease. I'm not saying he is in the most entertaining fights, but what other fighter could have neutralised Klitschko like that? He looked bad because he knew every time he overextended he'd be hit square in the face, and he wasn't used to a fighter dancing around him, switching stances and had good head movement compared to other HWs. Not even the biggest Fury fan, but to deny his talent and the difficulty he poses to any HW around today when he was in his prime is silly. We saw what Hughie Fury was able to do with Parker, and while he justly lost that fight, Hughie Fury is a vastly inferior boxer in every aspect to Tyson. Tyson played with him like a little boy in sparring

I like Usyk, but Tyson Fury is just too good / too big. 85 inch reach, good boxing skills / fast hands, decent power when he wants - easily better than Usyk's, can switch between Orthodox / Southpaw, 6 foot 9 and 260+ pounds can drain his opponent in the clinch to the point their legs can barely carry them (Cunningham before he was KO'd?). Tyson Fury is just an all round pain to deal with. One thing's for sure, if you face him you are going to get jabbed in the face repeatedly while trying to hit a target who doesn't stand still, and if you want to close the distance be prepared to have a 6 foot 9 260+ pound man pushing down on you. His game plan vs Chisora II and Christian Hammer was flawless - he evolved his game and knew the tools he had and how to use them. He can just dance around his opponent and pick them off at range until they want to be leaned on in close. No CW can beat him, size matters when the bigger guy has skills and physical attributes that are too big to overcome. Tyson Fury is too good, based on what? I've seen his bouts against the likes of Nevan Pjkic (who Fury got dropped by), John Mcdermott (who Fury argaubly lost to in first bout) and Steven Cinningham (who Fury got dropped by) to know that Fury is not as good as some think he is and that he can lose to top cruiser weights. All of those boxers I mentioned that Fury struggled against, are below 6 foot 4 inches in height. Fury's best performance was against a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko. 39 years is an age when every other past heavyweight champion was either retired, or losing to inferior boxers to Tyson Fury such as bums / journeymen. If anything, those journeymen / bums were beating 35+ year old past heavyweight champions more convincingly than Fury beat Wladiimr Klitschko when Wlad was 39 years of age. Wladimir Klitschko may have looked bad against Fury (as he is historically supposed to at that age). But Fury looked HORRIBLE against a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko (he historically shouldn't against an opponent of that age). Just go look at how much he struggled to land meaningful punches on a 39 year old Wladimir Klitschko. Despite his longer reach, he had to settle for 2 or 3 cuffing punches each round to steal rounds. He barely landed anything meaningful on Wladimir Klitschko and in this department, both were even since Wladimir Klitschko responded back with landing even number of meaningful damaging punches, each time Fury landed such a punch. I personally had the bout a draw as a result! Fury's punch accuracy was horrible against Wladimir Klitschko. He missed a career high against a 39 year old boxer who was arguably shot. So if you want to judge Fury's quality as a boxer based on his one win against Wladimir Klitschko, then it is a fallacy since there exists a very small sample size. It's not enough to go by since Wladimir Klitschko at age 39 may very well have been a 'shot' fighter and Fury only managed to win, because of that reason, rather than him having boxing abilities at a level you are claiming he has. There are AT LEAST 3 fighters Fury struggled against, all whom are shorter than 6 foot 4. That's a bigger sample size to judge Fury's quality on, rather than one fight against arguably a shot fighter in Wladimir Klitschko when Wlad was 39 years of age. And Usyk, Briedis and Gassiev are all much better than Steve Cunningham, Nevan Pjakic and John McDermott. I see no reason why either of these 3 couldn't defeat Fury if those other 3 boxers gave Fury hell. And put Steve Cunningham against Gassiev or Brieidis, and Cunningham gets body bagged in less time than it took Fury to KO Cunningham. And Steven Cunningham, nor Derek Chisora are comparable in anyway shape or form to Brieidis or Gassiev, never mind Usyk in terms of boxing skills / abilities.

And if Tyson Fury, with limited punching power can become one of the best heavyweights in the world, then why couldn't Oleksandr Usyk, who has relatively even power but much more skills be one of the best himself? I like Usyk, but Tyson Fury is just too good / too big. 85 inch reach, good boxing skills / fast hands, decent power when he wants - easily better than Usyk's, can switch between Orthodox / Southpaw, 6 foot 9 and 260+ pounds can drain his opponent in the clinch to the point their legs can barely carry them (Cunningham before he was KO'd?). Tyson Fury is just an all round pain to deal with. One thing's for sure, if you face him you are going to get jabbed in the face repeatedly while trying to hit a target who doesn't stand still, and if you want to close the distance be prepared to have a 6 foot 9 260+ pound man pushing down on you. His game plan vs Chisora II and Christian Hammer was flawless - he evolved his game and knew the tools he had and how to use them. He can just dance around his opponent and pick them off at range until they want to be leaned on in close. No CW can beat him, size matters when the bigger guy has skills and physical attributes that are too big to overcome.

Breidis already one punch K.O'd a current HW titlest. Past prime Huck gave PEDvetkin kittens & arguably beat him. A totally shot U.S aged 40 could no longer compete in a much frailer CW era yet looked great at HW dropping the lineal HW champion and beating multiple contenders. The CWs have proven time and time again they're a force at HW the only real question is how they'd fare when the dust settles and when we find out who the true top HWs are and have them face off. Guys like Manual ****in Charr and that big Aussie doorman are winning world titles ffs why can't Usyk, Gassiev, Breidis, Dorticos? Very good points. I totally agree! And Mairis Brieidis probably punches with just as much power as Alexander Povetkin (who himself could probably make cruiser weight if he tried hard enough). The same applies to Murat Gassiev. And Alexander Povetkin, who really is closer in size to the likes of Briedis and Gassiev and less closer in size to the likes of Joshua and Wilder, was able to KO Carlos Takam more brutally than Anthony Joshua did and also managed to KO Johan Duhapas more brutally and cleanly than Deontay Wilder did. Despite Povetkin being much smaller in size to either Wilder or Joshua. So if Alexander Povetkin, at age 38, as a pressure fighter is a top 5 heavyweight. Then why couldn't prime Mairis Brieidis or Murat Gassiev do just as well, if not better, when they have just as much power with arguably more skills to boot? And if Tyson Fury, with limited punching power can become one of the best heavyweights in the world, then why couldn't Oleksandr Usyk, who has relatively even power but much more skills be one of the best himself? And Mairis Brieidis's KO over Manuel Charr is just as impressive as any KO Deontay Wilder or Anthony Joshua have achieved in the pros. In fact, I don't remember any knockout that Joshua achieved which was quite as impressive as Briedis's over Manuel Charr. That was a beautiful 2 punch combo KO! Right upper cut and left hook combo! It's extremely rare to see a guy, whilst being outweighed by over 20 pounds, knock an opponent out unconscious whilst moving backwards with just 2 punches. You won't find too many examples like this! Good post and green K sent!

We are conditioned to think that way because there are so many weight classes. There are guys in the lower weights who are cautious with opponent selection when moving up 4 pounds so when a Cruiser talks about moving up 25+ pounds it seems extreme, even though it really isn't.

I can see Gassiev winning over Joshua and Usyk having a very good chance against Wilder, but change the matches and no big of a chance. Still, I'm excited for them to get there

Breidis already one punch K.O'd a current HW titlest. Past prime Huck gave PEDvetkin kittens & arguably beat him. A totally shot U.S aged 40 could no longer compete in a much frailer CW era yet looked great at HW dropping the lineal HW champion and beating multiple contenders. The CWs have proven time and time again they're a force at HW the only real question is how they'd fare when the dust settles and when we find out who the true top HWs are and have them face off. Guys like Manual ****in Charr and that big Aussie doorman are winning world titles ffs why can't Usyk, Gassiev, Breidis, Dorticos?