Boxing is Scored by the Round and Judges Have a Thin Margin of Error

You don't think judges remember how they scored the last rounds? Or you saying they shouldn't hear the other judges scorecard? Personally if I was having judges scores out in the open I wouldn't have the judges themselves out in the open anymore. I think MCC or someone else said awhile back that judges should be in some back room watching the fight on some live feeds of the fight & scoring off of those better angles of the fight anyway. I don't disagree with that opinion. Anyone who's had ringside seats or just near ringside seats knows thats hardly the best place to see the fight. So judges actually don't have a great view of whats going on as close as they are. Then you just soundproof the lil backroom room they are in + shut off the feed between rounds so they don't know whats up. You can throw 20 cats in lil rooms by themselves scoring fights from there if you must to get a mean scorecard. My main stance for rbr open scoring is I think its sorta crazy you don't know where you stand in a fight as a boxer. I understand the allure of not knowing the score for fans, but I also see a much higher degree of excitement for fans when they legit know a fight is tight with a round or two left & the fighters know that as well. The tension with all that info in the air would be epic. I also think a byproduct of rbr open scoring would be promoters making more competitive fights, which would also be good for boxing, cuz you don't want people leaving shows early if they know a fight is 6-0 with 4 rounds to go. You want them buying a couple more beers & a hotdog in those last 4 rounds since its tied up 3-3. I just think back to Canelo vs Trout. Canelo took his foot off the gas and didn't try and go for the kill. The fight was competitive but Canelo knew he was up by a ridiculous margin so he coasted. I think if fighters know that have a comfortable lead they will play it safe which will make for boring fights. Fighters are already reluctant to take risks as is

Definitely agree with encouraging more 10-10 rounds, it could get excessive like Leonard-Duran 1 where one judge scored 10 even rounds and 3-2 Duran but at least that card fairly reflected the fight, a close but well deserved win for Duran compared to if he just gave Duran the benefit of the doubt every time and had a crazy margin. The controversy will never be totally fixed but that would at least help avoid outrageous cards in close fights. Some people might say change the 10 point must system and give more points for a more 'dominant' round and that sounds good but there would still be a disagreement on whether certain rounds were dominant enough to deserve extra points, which could turn out to be the difference in a close fight.

That's the thing Whenever there's a close competitive fight, people gon have different scorecards The thing is though. It wasn't a close fight looking at it overall Horn won lil rounds clearly, while pac won his rounds clearly. I think judges need to score even rounds more liberally. Nothing happened? Close round. Score it even. Only score clear rounds.

The problem is judges IMHO I dont know anything about these judges this fight but what are their qualifications? How old are they? Their vision? Sometimes I think these old farts 1. Doesn't understand how to score 2. Can't see 3. Too influenced by the crowd Horn was game but he wasn't landing anything to me A clean shot far and few between a lot of blocked, grazing blows. Maybe fix the scoring. Every close round is scored even. Only clear rounds scored for the opponent.

That's the thing Whenever there's a close competitive fight, people gon have different scorecards

Good points.....

I still like the idea of half points, so you can give a very close round a 10-9.5, a clear winning round a 10-9, and absolute beating an 10-8.5. Right now all those rounds are 10-9 when they should not be equals, it also opens up the possibility for scoring knockdowns a bit differently because not all knockdowns should be worth the same either. The 10 point must system just does not allow for fights to be scored accurately based on what is going on in the ring and too often you have to fit a square peg into sort of square looking hole which adds up over a 12 round fight. It is still based on the judges call though so while allowing for a better depiction it is still not perfect. Which is also why I say judges (at least for big fights) should wear silly go-pro head sets so each judges view is recorded so they can explain why they did what they did if called upon to do so.

change the system have me , who is sitting on my ass at home score the fight by watching it on my tv im a good scorer

I think scoring more 10-10 rounds for close rounds or more 10-8 rounds for clear rounds, like I suggested, are both more or less the same thing although obviously there are some pros & cons to each of those methods from the other method. But yea how you go about it is debatable, but for sure you gotta find a way TO go about it that improves things. Idk that you can have your cake & eat it too. I think often times guys know they have fights in the bag & coast as is. Granted since it isn't shot up on a scoreboard or something there is more risk in doing that & its backfired on more than one guy in the past, but I believe its ultimately the way to go to have open scoring & guys knowing where the stand or whats working or not working. I'd even suggest if the skill disparity between two guys is so far apart there should be a mercy rule that ends the fights without a KO cuz obviously this was a poorly matchmade fight & these guys aren't in the same class so why do we need 10 rounds to figure it out when we all can see the skill difference when one guy is up 5-0 & the other guy is in survival mode already. That changes the sport, but maybe the sport should be changed if its not entertaining or competitive in certain fights. I mean the ultimate goal isn't just to find the better boxer in any given fight but to entertain the ticket buyers & to attract new ticket buyers for future fights & the future in general. I don't like the open scoring idea. Judges shouldn't have running totals cause it could bias their scoring. Maybe add more judges that see different angles could work. Figure skating has 9 judges.

cool fair enough, but if mcgregor goes the distance with mayweather and manages to land half as many punches but gets the nod, i will be saying we cant blame the judges, its a thin margin of error. Well boxing is scored by the round so whether he landed half as many punches would be irrelevant anyways. If Vegas wants McGregor to win then he will win.

Respect for this reasonable opinion. If I ever start a Reasonable NSB Boxing Fan group here you'll be among my first invitees lol. But I do think the bold is incorrect. Is there a 100% perfect solution? No, of course not, there never is. Perfect is an unattainable goal. But is there a less f#cked up solution then the current f#cked up solution we are using right now? Definitely. What that solution is is up for debate, but it certainly exists cuz I by no means don't see improvements to be made to the current scoring system & have went on & on about them in the past. The most notable ways in which the scoring can be improved in my eyes is for commissions to adopt a less subjective means of scoring fights that has harder lines to be applied in ones scoring. And I also believe scoring rounds 10-9 for closer rounds & 10-8 for clear rounds, without a KD, would insure decisions go the right way more often. I also think a means of judging judges needs to be added to those additions to help fix any corrections that need to be made by those outliers who we might deem to be bad or less correct judges. The disconnect is "who scored more points" versus "who won the fight". A fight is won in maybe 4 or 5 key rounds. Those are the rounds the casual observer remembers the most. But points are scored in every round. So you can score more points, but still lose the fight. That's why you always see complaints about corruption when in some cases, it may just be a difference of views in a handful of close rounds. The question is do you change the scoring system to put more emphasis on those 4 or 5 key rounds to award victory to the guy "who won the fight?". I think even rounds is a step in the right direction in getting that result. What I do like about this scoring system is that every round is equally weighted so you have to fight every round to win even if you build a 5-0 lead. So i think you have to tweak the scoring system in a way that will not encourage coasting. The biggest fear in open scoring or more point deductions is the fighter in the lead can score a few knockdowns and run and hug the rest of the fight to build a lead and force even rounds. This scoring system encourages the fighters to fight every round as if they need it to win.

One of the disses we say is, "What fight was that person watching?" in order to suggest that someone is blind not to see the obvious. When you take the viewing angles into account, fights can look pretty different depending on whether you're at home or whether your seat is close/far from the ring. Even-though I agree with your premise, its still frustrating to find those cards that seem to have been filled before the judges got into the arena. That seems to be happening more and more often. It seems like every important fight nowadays has one of those face-palming cards. However, I'm guilty of not scoring rounds when I watch fights. It's also pretty rare when I'm in accordance with the commentator's scorecard. Horn/Pac was competitive, but I don't have a clue as to who definitively won.

I think the biggest issue is judges not looking at TV feeds minus the commentators when available. The up close window to punches we are seeing on TV they are not.

Fantastic thread as always.

These judges went with the aggressor and more active boxer (Horn) rather than the guy who was clearly more effective. Horn was pressing forward because Manny is the smaller man and Horn could walk through them. Pac clearly dominated the 2nd half of the fight. It was clear .. yes, thin margin of error but there were clear Pac rounds from rds 8-12

Yeah, there has to be a middle ground on scoring even rounds. Somewhere between scoring anything close as even and scoring nothing as even.