Why can't Haymon...

Did all the fighters managers step aside (or get bought out) in a short space of time so Haymon would be the sole 'manager'? I don't know the details but it would seem plausible to me that a significant portion of the fighters that Haymon has signed also have other managers (someone else representing their interests). You or someone else can correct me if i'm wrong about that. If I am wrong then you are probably right that he should have made significantly better match-ups than he has and that he is just a terrible promoter. It's not even required for him to be a sole manager, although he is with the large majority of his clients. The thing is, he runs the show, tv dates, tv channels etc etc etc. And like I said, if he can't make ALL the fights happen, fair enough but he should at least make the majority, considering his power in the sport yet he doesn't. Am I correct in saying that? Heck, at least have his guys fight more than once a year smh.

Who are these managers? Haymon himself has managerial contracts with just about everyone he has on his shows, you just have to look at "stable" here: http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Al_Haymon Hyamon holds all the cards and everyone who follows the sport knows it. In fact, that was one of his major selling points on this very forum from all the crazed Haymon/Mayweather fans. Now that we all now PBC has largely been a pile of crap we're hearing this new tune "Haymon ain't all that powerful". I do understand the counter argument that Haymon can't make ALL the fights we want but he should be able to make the majority. Yet he hasn't even done that. Haymon has made a minority of the fights on offer, even though almost all these guys are fighting FOR HIM. That's bad business and bad for business, whichever way you want to cut it. Did all the fighters managers step aside (or get bought out) in a short space of time so Haymon would be the sole 'manager'? I don't know the details but it would seem plausible to me that a significant portion of the fighters that Haymon has signed also have other managers (someone else representing their interests). You or someone else can correct me if i'm wrong about that. If I am wrong then you are probably right that he should have made significantly better match-ups than he has and that he is just a terrible promoter.

what promoters and or managers have been putting on great match ups? In that same time period (around about 2 years of PBC being active), who has had the better fights: Pacquiao, Bradley, Vargas, Frampton , Lomachenko, Hopkins, Canelo, Kovalev or DG, Thurman, Porter, Wilder, Spence, Berto, Guerrero and so on And which managers/promoters/networks are involved with these sets of fighters? I went easy on you by not listing a few more Brits and I spaced it out for you so it is easier for you to read. edit: larryusa anytime now bro

The figher won't have a tv date to fight but Haymon won't have a 'name' to put on a show either, Haymon doesn't hold all the cards. Some of the fighters do have more concrete promotional ties with their promoters than others but anyway it is not about the fighters promoters, sham or otherwise, but their managers. I do think Haymon could have made better fights than he has but i'm not sure he could necessarily have made all the best fights from his stable, I think Hyamon's influence varies depending on the fighter. Who are these managers? Haymon himself has managerial contracts with just about everyone he has on his shows, you just have to look at "stable" here: http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Al_Haymon Hyamon holds all the cards and everyone who follows the sport knows it. In fact, that was one of his major selling points on this very forum from all the crazed Haymon/Mayweather fans. Now that we all now PBC has largely been a pile of crap we're hearing this new tune "Haymon ain't all that powerful". I do understand the counter argument that Haymon can't make ALL the fights we want but he should be able to make the majority. Yet he hasn't even done that. Haymon has made a minority of the fights on offer, even though almost all these guys are fighting FOR HIM. That's bad business and bad for business, whichever way you want to cut it.

I'm not slamming him and this thread isn't just about Garcia, it's about a lot of fighters signed to Haymon who haven't been fighting enough or been fighting sub par opposition or both. Garcias opposition on PBC has been Peterson, Malignaggi and Guerrero. Only one of them may even be considered world class at the time Garcia fought them. And this is not unique to Garcia. what promoters and or managers have been putting on great match ups?

You're forgetting one major point, PBC and all the tv dates available are Hyamon's platform. Yes there are people in partnership with him but it's Haymon's show, that was the whole point of him splitting with the established order. If the a fighter or his promoter (which is non-existent considering most of these guys have exclusive contracts with Haymon with some shill has a promoter) turns a big fight down, they just wont have a TV date to fight on. Haymon can and should make it happen, the fact that he doesn't, in a span of almost 2 years, says he doesn't want to, not that he can't. The figher won't have a tv date to fight but Haymon won't have a 'name' to put on a show either, Haymon doesn't hold all the cards. Some of the fighters do have more concrete promotional ties with their promoters than others but anyway it is not about the fighters promoters, sham or otherwise, but their managers. I do think Haymon could have made better fights than he has but i'm not sure he could necessarily have made all the best fights from his stable, I think Hyamon's influence varies depending on the fighter.

Well said... Can't find the post you replied to so just thought I'd reply here: The revenue aspect just doesn't add up because the best fights always make more money than the crappy fights. Mayweather spent years avoiding certain fighters and claiming he could make the same amount of money fighting scrubs or the guys no one wanted him to fight. When he eventually fought Pac and Cotto, he made more money than just about every other fight in his career. The fact remains and it has always been the case, quality still sells the most. The bigger issue is, pay days for fight bum opponents are now higher for someone fighting on TV than at any other point in boxing history, so fighting less risky opponents 2 or 3 times over 2 years = one big, risky fight, so why take the risky option?

you are trying to slam garcia who has probably the best resume of a fighter under 30... I'm not slamming him and this thread isn't just about Garcia, it's about a lot of fighters signed to Haymon who haven't been fighting enough or been fighting sub par opposition or both. Garcias opposition on PBC has been Peterson, Malignaggi and Guerrero. Only one of them may even be considered world class at the time Garcia fought them. And this is not unique to Garcia.

guerrero was shot by the time garcia got to him and was never really a top level fighter, the mayweather fight just gave him relevancy. I will concede peterson but again, peterson wasn't garcia's best opponent but it's the only really worthwhile fight he has had in almost 2 years of pbc. Matthsyse, khan, judah and harrera (his best opponents) all occurred pre-pbc. Maybe respond after reading my entire first post. you are trying to slam garcia who has probably the best resume of a fighter under 30...

huh???Mattysee,Guerrero,Mallinaggi,Peterson...scrubs? Guerrero was shot by the time Garcia got to him and was never really a top level fighter, the Mayweather fight just gave him relevancy. I will concede Peterson but again, Peterson wasn't Garcia's best opponent but it's the only really worthwhile fight he has had in almost 2 years of PBC. Matthsyse, Khan, Judah and Harrera (his best opponents) all occurred pre-PBC. Maybe respond AFTER reading my entire first post.

unify most of welterweight and light middle? When guys like King and Arum ran the welters and heavies throughout the 80s, 90s and early 00s, with the help of HBO, managed to unify those divisions on multiple occasions. So why can't Haymon, possibly the most well financed boxing manager in history do the same? Considering the majority of the top guys in both divisions are signed to him. It took almost 2 years to make Thurman v Porter, Garcia has fought scrubs, Andrade, the Charlos et al are avoiding each other like the plague. What's going on? huh???Mattysee,Guerrero,Mallinaggi,Peterson...scrubs?

All promoters have these kind of problems, most of the time promoters want good fights, it is the managers and trainers that put the brakes on and so the promoter has to compromise. You'd certainly think that Haymon could make these bigger fights if he tried hard enough, after all he has a strong advisory contract with them so they aren't going to go elsewhere plus he seems to be renowned for his capacity to sweet talk and impress people. However it is easier to convince a fighter to do what you want than it is the typical manager. You're forgetting one major point, PBC and all the tv dates available are Hyamon's platform. Yes there are people in partnership with him but it's Haymon's show, that was the whole point of him splitting with the established order. If the a fighter or his promoter (which is non-existent considering most of these guys have exclusive contracts with Haymon with some shill has a promoter) turns a big fight down, they just wont have a TV date to fight on. Haymon can and should make it happen, the fact that he doesn't, in a span of almost 2 years, says he doesn't want to, not that he can't.

That could explain some things but the overall set up, the TV dates, the whole PBC brand etc etc is run by Haymon, if he didn't want a fight, he wouldn't have it on HIS OWN DAMN SHOW and that's the problem. Haymon thinks his strategy of 2 years of **** fights is going to work...well newsflash, it's already failed. All promoters have these kind of problems, most of the time promoters want good fights, it is the managers and trainers that put the brakes on and so the promoter has to compromise. You'd certainly think that Haymon could make these bigger fights if he tried hard enough, after all he has a strong advisory contract with them so they aren't going to go elsewhere plus he seems to be renowned for his capacity to sweet talk and impress people. However it is easier to convince a fighter to do what you want than it is the typical manager.

I think Haymon's fighters still usually have their own managers who obviously have their own ideas about what fights they want. Perhaps that explains the highly erratic and disappointing match-ups. Yeah, I don't think Haymon himslf has that much power to force his fighters to sign to real fights. PBC, Protecting Boxers from Challenges. If this was the UFC, Garcia and Thurman would've already fought each other.

I think Haymon's fighters still usually have their own managers who obviously have their own ideas about what fights they want. Perhaps that explains the highly erratic and disappointing match-ups. That could explain some things but the overall set up, the TV dates, the whole PBC brand etc etc is run by Haymon, if he didn't want a fight, he wouldn't have it on HIS OWN DAMN SHOW and that's the problem. Haymon thinks his strategy of 2 years of **** fights is going to work...well newsflash, it's already failed. PBC lost $430 million in one year and Haymon has very little to show for it. I don't think he's doing anything differently. Just like when he left HBO and Showtime. Did he really lose that much?

PBC lost $430 million in one year and Haymon has very little to show for it. I don't think he's doing anything differently. Just like when he left HBO and Showtime.

It will happen but it won't be done for free and it won't be for CHEAP! For it to happen those guys will have to be PAID WELL and rightfully so. I'm sure announcements will pop up any day now with some big fights for all of them and yes hopefully it is them fighting each other.

I think Haymon's fighters still usually have their own managers who obviously have their own ideas about what fights they want. Perhaps that explains the highly erratic and disappointing match-ups. Yep. Broner vs Mathhysse is a shining example of that. It was a fight that should have been made right after they lost their respective fights with Maidana and Garcia. It didn't happen unlike in the Arum camp where losers face each other right away. Broner and Matthysse then fought as undercards TWICE in the same cards, but not facing each other. And in the second card Broner started calling out Matthysse only to reject it later by his own trainer. Adrien Broner Calls out Lucas Matthysse Again https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjO-01deRL8 Lucas Matthysse Accepts Adrien Broner Challenge https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E60kCV4PBZw Matthysse Not Concerned With Facing Adrien Broner http://www.boxingscene.com/matthysse-not-concerned-with-facing-adrien-broner--85920 Schaefer: Broner-Matthysse Would Be Unbelievable http://www.boxingscene.com/schaefer-broner-matthysse-unbelievable--77183 Broner's trainer doesn't want him to fight Matthysse next http://www.************.com/2014/09/broners-trainer-doesnt-want-him-to-fight-matthysse-next/ Matthysse moved on and went back to GBP. Fight is gone forever.

Yea thats probably a solid estimation. You do gotta save some fights when you do get that $75M TV deal or whatever. Why do you feel that'd be a mistake? Consumer backlash. I and other boxing fans are going to watch because we like the sport. The casual "star" fan (like we see here on NSB) is only going to watch if the guy is a name. If the names are not fighting regularly he hurts his product.

thats utter bs, seriously man. No fighter is THAT in control unless they cut themselves from everyone else, like mayweather and...well only Mayweather and maybe a latter stage Oscar. If Haymon wanted to make Garcia v Thurman, it'd get made yesterday. Thing is, Haymon lacks the will, the eye for the sport and any understanding on how to build a boxing star (fighters have regressed under him). Then why do his fighters keep pricing themselves out of legit, inhouse fights and taking on no hopers? These are inhouse fights they are turning down, Haymon can't really lose on them. Not significantly anyway. They can afford to turn down these fights because while HBO/Top Rank/GBP is still around they have leverage. Just the same as it is on HBO with fighters leveraging them for more money all the time. All the top fighters and their teams know that the opposite side of the pond is waiting if their bosses dont do what they want. If HBO's boxing program is cut, and Haymon has a pretty much free run at the American market, the big fights in his stable get made. Until then, he can only make fights his fighters are ok with making, and he will be paying a hefty price for it too