Ward > Mayweather jr ATG status if he beats Kovolov?

Castillo was never considered one of the best pound for pound fighters in the world, and neither was genero hernandez. my posts above address all of that. i guess one can make the argument for corales, but would you? he wasn't ranked as highly pound for pound as kovalev, either. kovalev's top 2 p4p right now on a lot of reputable lists. Yes he was. As for Corrales, would I make an argument he's better than Kovalev? Er, yeah..Yeah I would. Plus the logic of him fighting a "bigger, undefeated, higher ranked P4P fighter" is literally exactly the same for Corrales. He was top 5 P4P when Floyd fought him and undefeated and the bigger man.

Man, how is this even a conversation?

he's higher ranked than castillo and chico corrales were p4p. i guess one can make the argument for corrales, but would you? and manny was arguably higher p4p than kovalev, but let's face it, manny pacquiao hasn't been manny pacquiao for a long, long time. that guy was incredible in his prime, and the guy floyd fought was much more tame and had lost a lot physically. personally, i think that if manny and kovalev were the same size that kovalev would knock manny out if they fought in october. that's more of a testament to manny fading than anything else, obviously, but floyd fought him a bit over a year ago, and when he was way, way past it. I take it you were not watching boxing back when Floyd fought Corrales because if you were you wouldn't be arguing your case against Chico and for Kovalev. That fight was anticipated like Leonard-Hearns I. A shame that you trying to belittle it like its irrelevant.

No not at all. But Kovalev would be the best win on either resume.

when did that dominant run at 147 take place? :smashfrea was that the baldomir years where he avoided marg and cotto? or perhaps the time he waited until a 40 year old mosley was considered the best? or maybe when he "beat" pac in a disputed decision(clean punches remember boxing?) after waiting 5 years to fight him? that was a cherry pick hopscotch around run but you call it dominant lmao bless your heart

The simple answer is no, but he'd be on the cusp of the conversation. Beating Kovalev, and beating Stevenson to unify the division gets him into the conversation, but he's got to, at some point, take that chance at cruiserweight/heavyweight (after a longterm run at 175lbs). Floyd fought up from 130lbs, to max out for a dominant run 147lbs, before testing his luck at 154lbs (where he was, physically, out of his depth). when did that dominant run at 147 take place? :smashfrea was that the baldomir years where he avoided marg and cotto? or perhaps the time he waited until a 40 year old mosley was considered the best? or maybe when he "beat" pac in a disputed decision(clean punches remember boxing?) after waiting 5 years to fight him? that was a cherry pick hopscotch around run but you call it dominant lmao

Does Ward become a greater boxer than little floyd on the all time greats list if he defeats Kovolov? I persinally already think Ward is greater than him but you know money makes the world go round and people look past great boxing accomplishments due to admiring the almighty dollar. The simple answer is no, but he'd be on the cusp of the conversation. Beating Kovalev, and beating Stevenson to unify the division gets him into the conversation, but he's got to, at some point, take that chance at cruiserweight/heavyweight (after a longterm run at 175lbs). Floyd fought up from 130lbs, to max out for a dominant run 147lbs, before testing his luck at 154lbs (where he was, physically, out of his depth).

Moving up and beating a prime Castillo? he lost that fight and castillos resume at the time of fighting floy: debatable decision over stevie johnston and debatable draw against johnston, and cezar bezan. how is that on kovalev's level when he has destroyd 4 top 5 guys and beaten 6 top 10 guys?

Corrales was prime, bigger undefeated and p4p corrales resume at the time floyd fought him: manfredy and robert garcia hmmm yea p4p lmao. he was on hbo so they put him on the list. people complain about ggg with his 4 top 5 wins being on the list but say corrales was p4p?

like what? floyd's got a better resume because he went from 130 to 154 and was the best fighter on the planet, and he was undefeated over a 20 year hall of fame career, but who is a better win than moving up to beat a prime kovalev? Moving up and beating a prime Castillo?

no, but he'll have a win over a prime, undefeated, bigger pound for pound fighter, which is better than anything on floyd's resume. floyd's got better "names" but they were not at their peaks by any means, and pacquiao is markedly smaller than floyd. barring kovalev having a bad rest of his career, of course, but i ddon't think that's going to happen. if he was going to be exposed as something less than we thought he was, it would have happened by now. two fights with pascal, fight with hopkins, sillakh, cleverly, we'd know by now. Corrales was prime, bigger undefeated and p4p

No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i don;t think floyd was significanty larger, if even larger at all, than corrales. corrales was about as big a 130 lber as you're gonna see. josh clottey was a big welterweight. showtime unofficially weighed him and he was 170 lbs. not saying those scales are the be all end all, but that's still a solid welterwegith even if the scale is 10 lbs heavy :lol1: My point is/was, is that Chico was not a big fighter. Yes at 130 he was big, he was a good 135lber. But Floyd filled out to be a welterweight. Chico had no business there.

Again this thread is a what if type scenario. All in all it depends how careers pan out and what Ward does IF he wins. It comes down to a lot of factors, but just beating Kov isn't going to surpass Floyd...he needs a lot more but like I said....if he has the drive....he can do it.

Winning the Super 6 was great. But honestly, who is a sure HOFer in that group? Who which HOFer fighter did Ward beat? I am not even a Floyd fan.

i agree that the top of the p4p rankings was better in 2001 than it was now, adn that kovalev wouldn't be top 2 at that point in time. i don't agree that corrales is a better fighter than sergey kovalev, or more specifically that he's a win better win for floyd mayweather than a win over kovalev would be for andre ward. i honestly believe kovalev's a better fighter than chico corrales was in 2001, and that he's going to have a significantly better career. maybe i am wrong. we obviously have hte benefit of seeing corrales entire career, his wins and losses, and i have to guess a bit about how kovalev's career is going to turn out. again, i may be wrong about kovalev. i think he's got the goods. add in the weight, and that ward's fighting a larger fighter while floyd was fighting a fellow long term 130 lber, and i think it's clear that a convincing win would be a more significant accomplishment than beating corrales in 2001. I think your underestimating how good and how tough Chico was, but most of all, how freaking huge he was. His ability and size in at that weight class was scary. If Chico was around today, he would be avoided just like GGG.

Pascal is VERY similar to Manfredy. Yes you can count his win against the nutcase known as Chad Dawson, a fight he squeaked by in. Manfredy couldn't do that I'll give you that, he got beat down every time he stepped up whereas Pascal did pull off the one win. With that said, the two aren't world's apart. Very very very similar. And Corrales was pretty big for a 130 lber. He was no joke when Floyd fought him. I don't think you know or remember the hype surrounding him. But Floyd wasnt the favorite going into that fight. People were comparing it to Leonard vs. Hearns. And Ward has been fighting at 174 for at least a year now. Imo, he's a 174 lber. If he had jumped up and fought Kov immediately then that would he a it different. But it is what it is. It would be a great win for either fighter. But Floyd definitely has very comparable wins. what other wins on floyd's resume do you think would be a better win than a prime, pound for pound kovalev? edit: and trust, if i can talk angel manfredy, i can talk chico freaking corrales :lol1:. i don't think there's a recorded fight of any of the fighters we've discussed that i have not seen.

The name recognition of Floyds resume is extremely hard for anyone to beat, in our lifetime, with the way the business is right now, we may never see a fighters resume with the name recognition that Floyd has on his. The names aren't available, and the ones that are, seem impossible to get in the ring. (on the bright side i do expect this change soon for very specific reasons) But I do agree that Ward belongs in that conversation. He also still has a lot of career left if he decides to keep it going.

Yeah, but like others are arguing I wouldn't just use the p4p rankings here, I'm more looking at caliber of fighter. And while I think highly of Kovalev and where he is heading (win or lose against Ward), I can't say he is a better win than any of the many great wins Mayweather has. Corrales, Castillo, and Pac are were all really good wins over really good fighters. Pac was definitely pretty far past it but he was still good enough to embarrass welterweight contenders before and after the Mayweather loss. But I keep an open mind to Kovalev proving to be a better win in the future. I just can't say it right now. i agree that the top of the p4p rankings was better in 2001 than it was now, adn that kovalev wouldn't be top 2 at that point in time. i don't agree that corrales is a better fighter than sergey kovalev, or more specifically that he's a win better win for floyd mayweather than a win over kovalev would be for andre ward. i honestly believe kovalev's a better fighter than chico corrales was in 2001, and that he's going to have a significantly better career. maybe i am wrong. we obviously have hte benefit of seeing corrales entire career, his wins and losses, and i have to guess a bit about how kovalev's career is going to turn out. again, i may be wrong about kovalev. i think he's got the goods. add in the weight, and that ward's fighting a larger fighter while floyd was fighting a fellow long term 130 lber, and i think it's clear that a convincing win would be a more significant accomplishment than beating corrales in 2001.

and you're talking about angel manfredy, a guy who had honestly seen better days at 25 or 26 or whatever he was when they fought, and who was coming down in weight. pascal's not as good of a boxer as manfredy, but he did more in his career. pascal didnt' have a lot of skill,s but he was awkward, and had a chin and power and he ended up being more than the sum of his parts. LHW isn't HW, but it's certainly not LW. power and a chin get you much further. dude was the lineal LHW champion of the world. pascal's win over dawson, a very good fighter and the guy who calzaghe and hopkins swerved for some time, is better than anything on manfreddy's resume. manfreddy had better moves, but pascal did more. and finally there is the issue of weight that would lead me to think that ward beating kovalev may likely be a better win than any on floyd's resume corrales was a big 130 lber, but so was floyd mayweather. both had been at 130 lbs for a long time. floyd had been world champion at the weight for several years. ward's never fought a 175 lber in the top 10, and is really a 168 lber moving up and tuning up for 175 at this stage. Pascal is VERY similar to Manfredy. Yes you can count his win against the nutcase known as Chad Dawson, a fight he squeaked by in. Manfredy couldn't do that I'll give you that, he got beat down every time he stepped up whereas Pascal did pull off the one win. With that said, the two aren't world's apart. Very very very similar. And Corrales was pretty big for a 130 lber. He was no joke when Floyd fought him. I don't think you know or remember the hype surrounding him. But Floyd wasnt the favorite going into that fight. People were comparing it to Leonard vs. Hearns. And Ward has been fighting at 174 for at least a year now. Imo, he's a 174 lber. If he had jumped up and fought Kov immediately then that would he a it different. But it is what it is. It would be a great win for either fighter. But Floyd definitely has very comparable wins.