How to beat the shoulder roll

The thing is though, the 'shoulder roll' and Floyd's fighting style are two different things. This mix up seems to mean that the shoulder roll style itself is on some sort of pedestal, when it isn't. A jab is good against the shoulder roll style. It isn't the shoulder roll that makes Floyd so great, its his reflexes, timing and ability to pick his shots. He would be as dominant even with high guard or something else. We only have to look at Berto and Broner to realise the shoulder roll is just another style. Berto and shoulder roll should not be mentioned in the same sentence. Broner and shoulder roll should seldomly be used in the same sentence. Not too mention, because one tries a style doesn't mean he excels at it. Floyd is certainly better at it than those two, FFS. For one, he ACTUALLY tucks his CHIN BEHIND his shoulder, something those two idiots, never do. Toney did this.

Not only is Pacquiao not SR (LOL) but Jr. > Sr. Another huge myth I'd like to mention, is that Floyd is always in the shoulder roll stance. Not the case.

Stepping in with the jab especially in the up motion is a needed tool. Double up on the the rights or left. But Floyd is much more that just a shoulder roll and he has the ability to adjust to his foes

Yeah. It's not like there's a massive gulf in class between Sr. and Jr. This... Floyd isn't his dad and Manny isn't Sugar Ray. Also worth remembering about the shoulder roll is that it is more than just Mayweather Jr's chosen style, he is arguably the best at it so to solve the shoulder roll isn't necessarily to say you have solved Floyd, if you know what I mean. I agree with Tenma that some of Cotto's success against Floyd's shoulder roll at times could have been down to his stepping in behind the jab, but for the most part he couldn't come through. The shoulder roll itself as a style can be dealt with (Broner-Maidana), but Floyd's use of it is clearly a little harder. Maybe to flat out smother him, clearly outwork him and don't let him get set...But its obviously not that simple. and this. There is no one specific way to beat "The Shoulder roll". People have different tools, different abilities, different levels of skill and intelligence implemented to their style making it completey different to antoher fighter he uses the same or similar style. Broner uses the shoulder roll, there's plenty of ways to beat "his" shoulder roll. He's shown that combination punching he will struggle with. Pauli, Rees, Maidana have all had success with simple combination punching. That doesn't mean combination punching is the way to "Beat the shoulder roll" because not everyone he uses that style are the same with the same skills and ability. Other fighters who use that style have shown combination punching can be nullified with their use of that style, others can't. It's about ability not the style, that's been made clear numerous times - Berto, Broner etc. Ian Napa used the shoulder roll, plenty ways to beat him. Berto used it in his last 2 fights and he's lost both of those convincingly. Alvarado used it and was stopped twice. Just because Alvarado used it and got tagged and stopped by Rios and Ruslan doesn't mean that Ruslan and Rios would do the same to Mayweather, for example. Just because Leonard had his way with Sr, doesn't automatically mean that's the way to beat that style because Sr isn't anywhere near as good as his son nor does he have the skill, talent or all round ability, or ring IQ. The way to beat Mayweather (Not the Shoulder roll, Mayweather) IMO in his peak (05-07) would be a good, consistent solid jab, speed and unpredictability. That's how IMO you'd beat Mayweather or his "Shoulder roll". Someone like Ray Leonard for example would give Mayweather a load of problems IMO, aswell as Ray Robinson and Tommy Hearns for examples. And THIS its not the style you have to beat its the man. this aint chess. Plans fall through, in the end its about who wants it more, who's quicker, and who's smarter. Floyd to me does whatever he needs to to win. He's the style of no style.

The thing is though, the 'shoulder roll' and Floyd's fighting style are two different things. This mix up seems to mean that the shoulder roll style itself is on some sort of pedestal, when it isn't. A jab is good against the shoulder roll style. It isn't the shoulder roll that makes Floyd so great, its his reflexes, timing and ability to pick his shots. He would be as dominant even with high guard or something else. We only have to look at Berto and Broner to realise the shoulder roll is just another style.

its so convenient how everyone gasses against Floyd. Everyone thinks Zab, Shane, and Cotto wouldve won if they didnt gas. Throw Oscar in there to. Floyd must be the luckiest fighter on earthWho the hell ever says that about oscar? ' zab didn't gas, he just got outboxed, he didn't know how to adapt to a changing style after the 4th. Shane was just too old and too scared to throw. Cotto gasses all the time in all of his fights, its not a "convenient" excuse, its legit what cotto does. he took rounds off alot in that fight, like the 7th round where he didn't throw any punches. He gasses similar to ruslan, for example if ruslan was more active against bradley and didn't gas he would have won(still felt he won personally).

Of course Manny can beat the shoulder roll, but can he beat the reach, the feet, the mind of Mayweather? I don't know. We don't know. Until they fight it's all speculation. Floyd does 10000 things besides the shoulder roll.

Floyd's success is more a result of leveraging his long reach and controlling the distance between himself and his opponent. He didnt go to the store and buy a box of shoulder roll.

The one thing Canelo should have taken from Cotto was stepping in with the jab, Canelo has a solid one but it's stepping in that allowed Cotto to neutralize the pull counter and make Mayweather think he was in comfortable range. As a fan of Canelo that was disappointing but I feel that he'll improve from that. I think Canelo nullified to pull counter pretty well. Extremly well actually. You could see Floyd putting his feet into position to throw the counter and Canelo's feints and timing weren't allowing him to use it. Did he even land it once? I don't think he did. Floyd landed it on Cotto quite a few times.

There is no one specific way to beat "The Shoulder roll". People have different tools, different abilities, different levels of skill and intelligence implemented to their style making it completey different to antoher fighter he uses the same or similar style. Broner uses the shoulder roll, there's plenty of ways to beat "his" shoulder roll. He's shown that combination punching he will struggle with. Pauli, Rees, Maidana have all had success with simple combination punching. That doesn't mean combination punching is the way to "Beat the shoulder roll" because not everyone he uses that style are the same with the same skills and ability. Other fighters who use that style have shown combination punching can be nullified with their use of that style, others can't. It's about ability not the style, that's been made clear numerous times - Berto, Broner etc. Ian Napa used the shoulder roll, plenty ways to beat him. Berto used it in his last 2 fights and he's lost both of those convincingly. Alvarado used it and was stopped twice. Just because Alvarado used it and got tagged and stopped by Rios and Ruslan doesn't mean that Ruslan and Rios would do the same to Mayweather, for example. Just because Leonard had his way with Sr, doesn't automatically mean that's the way to beat that style because Sr isn't anywhere near as good as his son nor does he have the skill, talent or all round ability, or ring IQ. The way to beat Mayweather (Not the Shoulder roll, Mayweather) IMO in his peak (05-07) would be a good, consistent solid jab, speed and unpredictability. That's how IMO you'd beat Mayweather or his "Shoulder roll". Someone like Ray Leonard for example would give Mayweather a load of problems IMO, aswell as Ray Robinson and Tommy Hearns for examples.

Theres a number of defenses americans use that will soon comeback.. Why is it when american fighters other than mayweatheruse the shoulder roll people start complaining. no one complains when mexican fighters fight like each other??? The thing is you get a bunch of Broners. Maybe not as many jerks or dickheads outside of the ring but I mean inside, they try to mimic them exactly. No one conforms the style to fight like themselves. They use it because it was successful for someone else, so they use it trying to be someone else. I'm not saying everyone who shoulder rolls is a Mayweather copy because I know he didn't invent the defense but it feels like I see more people trying to be Mayweather through that shoulder roll instead of just being a smarter fighter altogether. This could be subjective to my local boxing scene and such but it's happened on tv too. Usually people's styles fit or accentuate who they are and if it doesn't then its really a matter of time until they get it. To your Mexican comment, most Mexicans fight like one another. Is it monotonous? A little but that's what they're known for. They don't go around touting some individuality like the american society does. If you talk to any of them, they all say pretty much the same thing (which all boxers say about themselves anyway) about having heart, showing up to fight and being a warrior.

Who gives a fvck about the roll. Solving the roll is far from being able to beat him.

its so convenient how everyone gasses against Floyd. Everyone thinks Zab, Shane, and Cotto wouldve won if they didnt gas. Throw Oscar in there to. Floyd must be the luckiest fighter on earth Well you know Mayweather is one of the luckiest fighters in the world. When he's not ducking, cherry picking, retiring, he also has the ability to ensure all of his opponent gas right around the 7th or 8th round in his fights. Oh yeah, and while everyone is getting older and no longer in their prime, he doesn't get older or lose a step.

cotto floyd round 8 seems to fit more with the thread to be honest. Honestly if cotto was more active like he was in that round he could have won the fight, but he gassed its so convenient how everyone gasses against Floyd. Everyone thinks Zab, Shane, and Cotto wouldve won if they didnt gas. Throw Oscar in there to. Floyd must be the luckiest fighter on earth

People who due the shoulder roll always counter with lead rights or uppercuts Pac who is always stepping to his right would avoid those counters that is why people who lack quick foot work are chosen cause they are always standing in front of Floyd for the counter.You also have to be an arm puncher similar to Rocky Marcino cause if you keep pounding that shoulder it's possible to dislocate it but many fighters don't do this because they don't want to be classified as a dirty fighter

There are acouple of ways that I found. When you hit on them I'll speak up. I'd tell you straight out, but then I'd have to kill you............Rockin':boxing: Something tells me I gotta watch Leo Dorin vs Spaddy again to see what youre talking about..

good jab and timing is what's needed Yea and also vs Mayweather JR, a heavy dose of father time is needed to pull it off. Pacman had the workrate to pull it off maybe back in 2009, but not the ring IQ to deal with Mayweather JR adapting. Also Floyd is not going to use the shoulder roll much anyway vs pacman if it happen. I expect the high guard to be used more often.

It's not this impenetrable defense everyone makes it out to be. I don't get why I'm seeing it more and more. It works for Mayweather because his family used it for years before teaching it to him, letting him figure it out or learn it's mistakes and such. Theres a number of defenses americans use that will soon comeback.. Why is it when american fighters other than mayweatheruse the shoulder roll people start complaining. no one complains when mexican fighters fight like each other???

Go study the tape on youtube of Sugar Ray Leonard vs Floyd Mayweather SR. SR stomped the S### outa Mayweather Sr KNOWS PAC can do to his boy what SR did to him. 3 things floyd is significantly better in every way than his dad srl is significantly better in every way than Manny just because srl says this is what he woul do that doesn't mean it will work or any other fighter could do it.

I'm no Mayweather fan..but he's much, much more talented than his dad or Broner.