Watching that old Pacquiao ko highlight, young Pac-Man didnt seem destined greatness

Pac's 1st title was againts Sasakul at age 19. (Thailand) Sasakul was a hero in Thailand and was the Lineal Flyweight champion. His 2nd was againts Ledwabba. ( Nevada ) Ledwabba was supposed to get rid of him and was considered to be the best 122lbs fighter at the time ( Same period Barrera and Morales went to 126) How is that "out of nowhere"? It was out of nowhere for strictly floyd fans. They want to pretend they are the only knowledgeable boxing fans in the world, besides Roman Moreno already shut this thread down with this post: Yes he was a HOF'er before Ariza came on board. It is ridiculous to say he wasn't. Before Ariza he was already a 4 division champ. Before Ariza he was already 3 division lineal champ. Before Ariza he was the first fighter in the history of the sport. To win a lineal Flyweight title and lineal featherweight title. And, those are 2 of the original 8 weight-classes. That's over 100 years of history. Beat arguably the best fighter in 4 different divisions while skipping 2 whole divisions before Ariza came on the team. Had a win over an ATG in his prime in Barrera. Dominating victory. Had wins over HOF'er JMM. And, wins over top rated Sasakul and Ledwaba. He had already accomplished historic feats before Ariza came on board. "We will never know"? No. We do know. Only some like to hate or be ignorant to the fact.

Pac's 1st title was againts Sasakul at age 19. (Thailand) Sasakul was a hero in Thailand and was the Lineal Flyweight champion. His 2nd was againts Ledwabba. ( Nevada ) Ledwabba was supposed to get rid of him and was considered to be the best 122lbs fighter at the time ( Same period Barrera and Morales went to 126) How is that "out of nowhere"?

pac not hof worthy pre-diaz? news to me.

special shakes can help with that I see you drinking some of that special hate again.

It's interesting how you name mostly American fighters. Maybe therein lies your answer. American fighters get the most exposure and most hype when it comes to this sport. So how can you really expect someone from a third workd developing country compete with the same expectations and public perception that these young Americans get. Maybe therein lies his greatness, to come out of nowhere and achieve what he has as opposed to most of the American fighters who were expected to be great but actually under achieved. Does anybody remember Ed Hopson, Panchito Bojado, Mark Breland, just to name a few. It's not interesting that he named "American" fighters. If you looked closer, you'd see that all of those names were hyped because of terrific amateur careers. They didn't just pop out of nowhere and people said, "hey, he's American, let's hype him." They were all highly respected amateurs before turning pro; fighters expected to do big things as professionals. Kostya Tszyu was also hyped entering the pros. The Klitschko's. And so forth. While I agree that it's much tougher for a person from a third world country, I think Manny's lack of recognition early on is based on his largely mediocre amateur career and early defeats. He sort of learned on the job (as many fighters do) while his natural talents carried him through the ups and downs.

yea i know, but most fighters that eventually become professional greats, you see the signs while their in the amatuers or early on in their pro careers....For example everyone new Sugar Ray Leonard, Pernell Whitaker, Michael Spinks, Roy Jones, their are some that werent the best ams....like Trinidad but we knew he'd be special Manny kinda came out of no where...I guess thats where the phenomenon comes from It's interesting how you name mostly American fighters. Maybe therein lies your answer. American fighters get the most exposure and most hype when it comes to this sport. So how can you really expect someone from a third workd developing country compete with the same expectations and public perception that these young Americans get. Maybe therein lies his greatness, to come out of nowhere and achieve what he has as opposed to most of the American fighters who were expected to be great but actually under achieved. Does anybody remember Ed Hopson, Panchito Bojado, Mark Breland, just to name a few.

"The moon doesnt exist! This is my opinion, why do you dick riders get mad when I state my opinion that it's just not out there. This is a forum of free flowing discussion. If I say it doesnt exist then its my opinion. To each their own" opinions without any evidence or basis. At lest come at us with some facts not some opinion based on floyd's baseless assertions that have been debunked several times already.

"The moon doesnt exist! This is my opinion, why do you dick riders get mad when I state my opinion that it's just not out there. This is a forum of free flowing discussion. If I say it doesnt exist then its my opinion. To each their own"

Like i said many dont agree with me that Cotto is a HOFer (never said first ballot to be clear) and thats fine they dont think he is cause they dont think his wins are that good as you dont. But there are many who do. So why is it hard to accept that there are those who think pre-Diaz Pac is a HOFer and those who dont think his wins are worthy enough. He had good wins and ok ill call MAB a great win but he lost to prime Morales and then fought a shot fighter the next two times and i am one of those who think JMM is 2-0-1 with Pac. So yes i watched boxing back then but i just dont agree with you and vice versa. This is similar to Cris Carter and the hall, in a sense. Some say he is good enough to get in and im one of them but he isnt in..yet. Which means some dont think he was good enough. lol...... Roman, notice how you present him with facts & every single one of his responses are opinon based. :nonono:

gtfo with those facts and logic. Cotto bloodied Floyd's nose. that's automatic induction to IBHOF.He never once mentioned Floyd. And you call me the dicrider. LOL GTFOH

Cotto 3 division title holder.. zero lineal champion. Cotto best win is what? Mosley back in 07? Is that his best win? How is that win better than say Pac win over JMM in 08? What is Cotto 2nd best win? Quintana? How is that better than Sasakul? Or was it Judah? How is that better than the 2nd Morales win? Or was it Clottey? How was that better than the JMM draw?. Or was it the 2nd Margarito fight? How was that better than the third Morales win? Or was it Foreman? How was the better than the Ledwaba win? Didn't even mention Pac best win over a prime ATG in Barrera. Which is the best win of his career. Pac was a 4 division title holder And, a 3 division lineal champion While skipping 2 whole weight-class in the process. Yet Cotto is a HOF'er. But, Pac wasn't a HOF'er pre Diaz. Yet you watched boxing Back then? OK. Lets go win for win and accomplishment with Pac and Cotto.Like i said many dont agree with me that Cotto is a HOFer (never said first ballot to be clear) and thats fine they dont think he is cause they dont think his wins are that good as you dont. But there are many who do. So why is it hard to accept that there are those who think pre-Diaz Pac is a HOFer and those who dont think his wins are worthy enough. He had good wins and ok ill call MAB a great win but he lost to prime Morales and then fought a shot fighter the next two times and i am one of those who think JMM is 2-0-1 with Pac. So yes i watched boxing back then but i just dont agree with you and vice versa. This is similar to Cris Carter and the hall, in a sense. Some say he is good enough to get in and im one of them but he isnt in..yet. Which means some dont think he was good enough.

Cotto 3 division title holder.. zero lineal champion. Cotto best win is what? Mosley back in 07? Is that his best win? How is that win better than say Pac win over JMM in 08? What is Cotto 2nd best win? Quintana? How is that better than Sasakul? Or was it Judah? How is that better than the 2nd Morales win? Or was it Clottey? How was that better than the JMM draw?. Or was it the 2nd Margarito fight? How was that better than the third Morales win? Or was it Foreman? How was the better than the Ledwaba win? Didn't even mention Pac best win over a prime ATG in Barrera. Which is the best win of his career. Pac was a 4 division title holder And, a 3 division lineal champion While skipping 2 whole weight-class in the process. Yet Cotto is a HOF'er. But, Pac wasn't a HOF'er pre Diaz. Yet you watched boxing Back then? OK. Lets go win for win and accomplishment with Pac and Cotto. gtfo with those facts and logic. Cotto bloodied Floyd's nose. that's automatic induction to IBHOF.

This is what i mean. Floyd not even in this thread but most cant escape mentioning him at some point. Or calling those who dont agree fanboys or dicriders By the way I dont care. If he is dirty then he is dirty. Test them all i say. when people ask questions, or make comments about Pacquiao people cant help but bring up Mayweather.....Mayweather was quoted saying this himself and it is true.....when I started the thread I was saying my opinion of him in the early days...it had nothing to do with Mayweather

you aint fooling anybody. I know what your up to. Just stop.Obviously fooling you cause you think im doing something else. You just cant see beyond your bubble and realize not everyone thinks like you. Sad life there buddy

These threads are diversionary tactics by Floyd fanatics. They hate threads about Floyd under this cloud of PED suspicion. They hate it with passion. Clear as day. so if some one states their opinion without discrediting the guy, they are hating....i never said anything about him taking PED....just that when I first saw him fight I didnt think he'd be where he is...some people make mountains out of mole hills

These threads are diversionary tactics by Floyd fanatics. They hate threads about Floyd under this cloud of PED suspicion. They hate it with passion. Clear as day.This is what i mean. Floyd not even in this thread but most cant escape mentioning him at some point. Or calling those who dont agree fanboys or dicriders By the way I dont care. If he is dirty then he is dirty. Test them all i say.

So because i dont agree with you i hate the guy or am not a fan of his? Im a fan of boxing and if you want to know my number one is Ward. I think he is the most gifted boxer out there. Am i a fan of Floyd yes i am but never said i wasnt of Pac. Do i think his suspicion has an effect on me saying he is not a HOFer, atthis point, yes but pre-Diaz, yes i did watch boxing since i was a child which some on here still are, i did think he was good, very good as stated and i have stated that he was on his way to HOF, which i can see that some say boxing circles were talkign about it, talking about it but not saying hes a sure shot HOFer. Im in that boat. Like i said to each his own you aint fooling anybody. I know what your up to. Just stop.

Lets go Spurs!!! Who you rooting for? i havent decided. I think both teams beat either team coming out of the east but i do want okc to fire scotty brooks so ill probably go with the spurs.

But, you're a Floyd fan. So lets not act like you're not. It would be OK to say Pac is not a HOF because he juices. that's totally understandable. To say Pac had a quick rise. It's pretty retarded. To say Cotto is a HOF'er but Pac at career pre Diaz wasn't a HOF worthy is just LOL material. It's obvious that not only you're not a Pac fan which is cool. But, you're very bias against him and might actually hate on Pac. Because, there is no way Cotto resume and accomplishments right now is better than Pac resume and accomplishments pre David Diaz. And, we can go fight for fight and accomplishment for accomplishment. It's one thing to disagree it's another to just say outlandish stuff just because of hate.So because i dont agree with you i hate the guy or am not a fan of his? Im a fan of boxing and if you want to know my number one is Ward. I think he is the most gifted boxer out there. Am i a fan of Floyd yes i am but never said i wasnt of Pac. Do i think his suspicion has an effect on me saying he is not a HOFer, atthis point, yes but pre-Diaz, yes i did watch boxing since i was a child which some on here still are, i did think he was good, very good as stated and i have stated that he was on his way to HOF, which i can see that some say boxing circles were talkign about it, talking about it but not saying hes a sure shot HOFer. Im in that boat. Like i said to each his own

These threads are diversionary tactics by Floyd fanatics. They hate threads about Floyd under this cloud of PED suspicion. They hate it with passion. Clear as day.