Why Does Ali Get Credit For Beating a Shot Frazier?

Very true. But I'd take that version of Frazier over almost any fighter in history. Yeah, you're not going to find many fighters that could handle Frazier that night. So fierce and tough and relentless. Amazing fighter.

The funny thing is Ali in 1975 was a lot further away in terms of everything (bar his chin) from the Ali of 1966-7 than the Frazier of 1975 was from 1971. Ali had lost a considerable amount of stamina and speed, his footwork was poor compared to his prime, he still had solid handspeed but nothing compared to his peak (compare it like RJJ now to RJJ of the 90s). I am sad that Frazier has died, he truly was a boxing icon something many boxers should aspire to be. He was a really hardworker, who albeit wasn't the most naturally gifted he made the best with what he had and with pure determination he beat an Ali while not being prime (this isn't disputed tbh) sure but still a solid Ali who could have beaten anyone else currently around then. His first and last fights with Ali was some of the best fights of all time. One of the few examples where a fight lived upto the hype.

I don't think he took enough punishment against Foreman for it to really effect him. The fight didn't go long enough and Joe went down when he got hit. Its the fighters that can take the punches and continue to get hit over a long fight that are really effected. I think Joe would have been KO'd quick against Foreman in their second fight if he was really that shot. And as for being too short, I think Joe made his height work for him just like Tyson did. If Joe was a pure boxer, it would be a different story. In that case, Hatton can still make a comeback.

they THOUGHT he was shot they were both past their best anyway thread./ Very true. But I'd take that version of Frazier over almost any fighter in history.

Both Ali and Frazier were bums anyway. wouldnt stand a chance in todays division. dont know why peoploe still talk about them. Both are broke and pretty much braindead Both will be remembered 100 years from now for fighting in the heavyweight divisions greatest era while this era is it's weakest. Outside of the Klits hardly anyone today would even get a top 10 ranking in the early to mid 70's.

What's really sad is that so called "shot" version of Frazier was better than ANY heavyweight today. Besides the Klits (and I think he would chop Wlad down) he would decimate any of today's pretenders.

I can't believe I'm going to be the first person in this thread to say that Ali was just as "shot" as Frazier was. So you had two of the greatest heavyweights ever, both in similar physical condition, wage one of the greatest fights of all time, where arguably the only reason Ali won is because Frazier's corner gave in before Ali himself did. Yeah, both Ali and Frazier deserve every word of praise and credit they've ever gotten for that fight.

Because Boxingscene doesn't exist back then. Best answer on this thread. :boxing::boxing:

Ali GOAT...

same reason you give Frazier credit for being the FIRST man to beat Ali even though Ali was on the shelf for a few years because of the draft thing....yea he had a tune up or two(don't remember how many tune ups he had) but Joe was on a different level than those lambs who were sacrificed....Ali's crtiicism usually comes from outside the culture....for whatever reasons I just can't call it....smh

Because Boxingscene doesn't exist back then.

Because it was an epic brutal punishing war. An because both men gave it everything they had. Regardless of where either fighter was in their career, it was a battle of wills. Ali barely survived. He deserves credit. As does Frazier.

anybody who actually watched that fight could see frazier was not shot - past prime sure ... so was ali ... but shot? no way he still had enough fight in him beat all but the very best

Frazier didn't fight like a shot fighter at all that night but Ali is Ali. he tends to get pleasantly remembered. people like to act like he wasn't public enemy #1 during his prime and had racist jokes/punchlines for white boys too Ali was an anti-white racist and anti-Jew racist, as soon as he became a Black Muslim. His low IQ made him easy to "convert". Except for boxing, and a quick tongue, he was as ignorant as hell and got away with it because a mafia run thug like Liston had been Champ and Ali had good management and script writers.. Most people think that Ali went to jail for his principles, the guy never spent a day in jail, he was out on bail all the time whilst his lawyers were creating legal stumbling blocks. Cosell, who was Jewish was too full of his own importance and arrogance, in bucking the then public sentiment about Ali so as to publicly support and back him, never realised at the time that Ali hated Jews and whites. He realised it later in life.

both guys were past prime, but neither was shot the trilogy is epic, defining fights for both guys why wouldn't Ali get credit, and why say Joe was shot?

I don't think he took enough punishment against Foreman for it to really effect him. The fight didn't go long enough and Joe went down when he got hit. Its the fighters that can take the punches and continue to get hit over a long fight that are really effected. I think Joe would have been KO'd quick against Foreman in their second fight if he was really that shot. And as for being too short, I think Joe made his height work for him just like Tyson did. If Joe was a pure boxer, it would be a different story. frazier was on the verge of being KO'd at any moment of the second fight. His legs were gone, and he was sloow.

Don't blaspheme here, idiot.

Ali is so beloved that many people aren't even aware of Joe beating him in their first match WHAT?! Ali retired undefeated 106-0

Ali's own management said watching him vs. Ellis they thought he was beyond shot. He was destroyed by Foreman before the second fight. If Martinez ruined Pwill...imagine what 6 knockdowns in 2 rounds did to Frazier. Psychologically and physically he was ruint. He only won 3 fights after Foreman. He squeeked by Bugner, beat a 197 pound quarry and in the Ellis rematch Ali's own team said he looked completely shot. So why do people act like it was a big accomplishment. If Martinez fought Pwill right now people would complain and if it was a close fight people would call Martinez out. Its 10x less of an accomplishment as Pac beating Marquez because at least Marquez has looked half decent and wasnt knocked down 6 times in 2 rounds and beaten mercilessly. So I dont get it. If Hopkins beat Jones Jr. again does that prove anything? For some reason Ali gets different rules when it comes to legacies than everyone else. Don't lose track of the REAL fact that the name"The greatest" was what he called HIMSELF, and at that time and for a long time after, no one else did. It just became a public habit. Ali had some very bad boxing habits, and all the experts put themselves ON RECORD, many times of saying that when his speed would dimminish, he would really get hurt. And that's exactly what happened.

Joe wasn't shot..........he fought like a true champ that night. Respect his greatness Uhh Ali's own management said they chose Frazier for the 3rd fight because he was shot. And if you dont think getting abused in 2 rounds and suffering your first loss hurts you....Frazier won 3 fights after his first loss. 3. One he squeeked by, the other two he looked bad. So Ali made him look good. Guess what, Ali made part time boxer, full time police officer/vagrant Chuck Wepner look good. He made Young, and Shavers look good. PWill is shot because of one punch according to most on here. But Frazier wasnt? What big win did he have after Foreman destroyed him? When Frazier was prime he beat Ali. Ali beating him the2nd and 3rd fight was like Maidana beating Morales. Sure Morales put on a good show, but it wasnt the same as a prime Morales.