Watching Cotto/Mayorga...and why I'm certain Cotto will beat Margarito...

Margarito got knocked out by the ghost of Shane, took a long layoff, looked horrible against a bum in Mexico, and then was basically almost killed in the ring against Manny. I dont think he has anything close to enough left to beat Cotto. are you kidding? I never saw Mosley looking anywhere near as good before or after that fight...he must have been jacked to the hilt.

U raise some good points my friend and i agree Cotto is coming out on top this time. Cotto is my favourite fighter but Im a realist and not one of these fanboy types who pick him over everyone from K9 to King Kong, i just think he beats Tony. Now i am a firm believer Margarito DID use those loaded wraps in "The Battle" but its been done to death and its never gonna be proven so im pretty much just gonna dismiss it for now and take Margarito as a clean fighter. Cotto will always have trouble with a big, tough, relentless guy with the durability of Margarito. Style wise its a handful for Miguel who likes to operate at his own smooth, controlled pace. But lets remember Miguel was dominating the early rounds of fight one, when both guys are fresh Cotto is clearly the better of the two. Margs really came on when Cotto started to fade. A large part of why Cotto did fade was he wasted alot of energy with unnecessary movement, Steward KNOWS this and will address it be it by utilizing more pivots instead, clinching more, ect, ect. Basically Cotto has options, he needs only to stay fresh for longer. Id love to see him tie Tony up from time to time, Mosley showed that it serves a duel purpose by A. Breaking Margs rhythm and stifling his attack and B. Giving Miguel much needed breathers and a chance to run down the clock. Cotto has never been one for clinching though, part of the reason im such a big fan in the first place. Another point worth remembering is that Cotto had his nose bust last time, it happens and may do so again but if he can avoid that it would help him greatly as the last thing a tiring fighter needs is breathing problems. Cotto is generally credited with winning the first 6 rounds of their first bout, if he can repeat this feat and i believe he will then he only needs to win ONE more round and last another round (fight 1 ending in the 11th) and he wins. He might find it rough down the stretch of another tough bout but i think he hangs in there and bags a points win. The wild Card is Tonys eye, as u mention Miguel has the power and weaponry to really test it. We shall see.... COTTO ON POINTS - TAKING BETS OF ALL SIZES :boxing: I hate pointing out the obvious, but yeah... That's an interesting way of putting it. If it holds up, Margarito stands to have a better chance and will be able to take more punches. If not, we could see a stoppage, not because Margarito is hurt, but because the eye is much too damaged.

I'm sitting here watching Cotto/Mayorga and seeing Cotto with snapping punches, a ramming left jab, and a sharp left hook. Did he take punches from Mayorga? Of course, he doesn't have the best defense in the world AND Mayorga is a fairly awkward fighter that gives a lot of people fits because of how unconventional he is with his attack patterns. Hell, judging from the first FOUR ROUNDS in Mosley/Mayorga, you would've thought that it was going to be a little rough between him and Mosley down the stretch. Mayorga isn't a downright horrible fighter, he's just not elite, but awkward enough to not allow you to go all-out on him. Hell, the only guy in the last ten years to dispatch Mayorga without ANY trouble was Oscar de la Hoya because even Tito took some punches in his TKO victory. So let's cut Cotto some slack... I'm fairly certain you all guys know who I am by now and how I try to be respectful and keep things in perspective. I've been debating about Cotto/Margarito II for the last few days with people over here and casual fans (those that only tune in to watch PPV fights) see as Cotto going into a fight to take an utter beating at the hands of Antonio Margarito. And while I could see Margarito's pressure style giving Cotto fits, I can't bring myself to BELIEVE Margarito will win again. You don't have to agree, but consider the following points: 1-) Ever since Cotto and Margarito fought, Cotto's record has been 4-1 (3KO's) while Margarito's has been 1-2 (0 KO's). 2-) Cotto has an underrated jab and a solid left hook, which will land on Margarito's affected eye. 3-) Their fight was fairly even. You can't look at that first fight and say Margarito was putting a beatdown on him since round 1. This wasn't Jones, Jr./Toney or B-Hop/Pavlik, Cotto was actually in the fight. He simply made mistakes that must be fixed, which are to stay from the ropes and clinch. 4-) Cotto is NOT Ricky Hatton and Margarito is not Pacquiao. In other words, he CAN take punishment and Margarito isn't knocking Cotto out like some people believe. Cotto is susceptible to punches (and he WILL get tagged) but Margarito needs time to knock you out. And to be honest, if you are going in there against the first man to beat you (by TKO) and the fight has a PR-Mexican rivalry background, and you are FIGHTING in your hometown, there is NO way Cotto will allow himself to go down again and give Margarito the TKO victory. If the going gets tough, all Cotto has to do is get on his bike and reach the bell and recover. Cotto's going to reach the final bell even if he is taking a beating, he won't quit again. That's why this is going to be intriguing should he begin to take a lot of punishment, Cotto won't quit even if his body is begging him for air and although this might sound like a downfall, consider the following point... 5-) They are fighting in Madison Square Garden, Cotto's adopted home. This means that Cotto can throw a seven punch combination, land only two punches, and people will be cheering even over that. Like it or not, that will influence judges. If there are ANY close rounds, you KNOW who they're going to give them to. 6-) In the worst case scenario, the politics of boxing will be in play. Even if Margarito does enough to WARRANT a victory in a rousing slugfest, the judges will give it to Cotto in order to set up a trilogy, which in the end, means more money for Bob. The two questions regarding Margarito: a-) After his battles with Cotto, Mosley, and Pacquiao, will Margarito's chin FINALLY show deterioration. Sooner or later, it dissolves, doesn't it? Considering his fighting style and the fact that he's been fighting since he was 15 years old and he's now 33, that's a lot of punishment to take over an 18 year career. b-) After that nasty eye injury against Pacquiao, will Margarito's socket keep itself intact or will a cut open up allowing Cotto to take advantage of it? Guys, agree, disagree, debate! :boxing: Also, I'm taking bets on this fight! 2:1 odds with Cotto...feel free to PM me! U raise some good points my friend and i agree Cotto is coming out on top this time. Cotto is my favourite fighter but Im a realist and not one of these fanboy types who pick him over everyone from K9 to King Kong, i just think he beats Tony. Now i am a firm believer Margarito DID use those loaded wraps in "The Battle" but its been done to death and its never gonna be proven so im pretty much just gonna dismiss it for now and take Margarito as a clean fighter. Cotto will always have trouble with a big, tough, relentless guy with the durability of Margarito. Style wise its a handful for Miguel who likes to operate at his own smooth, controlled pace. But lets remember Miguel was dominating the early rounds of fight one, when both guys are fresh Cotto is clearly the better of the two. Margs really came on when Cotto started to fade. A large part of why Cotto did fade was he wasted alot of energy with unnecessary movement, Steward KNOWS this and will address it be it by utilizing more pivots instead, clinching more, ect, ect. Basically Cotto has options, he needs only to stay fresh for longer. Id love to see him tie Tony up from time to time, Mosley showed that it serves a duel purpose by A. Breaking Margs rhythm and stifling his attack and B. Giving Miguel much needed breathers and a chance to run down the clock. Cotto has never been one for clinching though, part of the reason im such a big fan in the first place. Another point worth remembering is that Cotto had his nose bust last time, it happens and may do so again but if he can avoid that it would help him greatly as the last thing a tiring fighter needs is breathing problems. Cotto is generally credited with winning the first 6 rounds of their first bout, if he can repeat this feat and i believe he will then he only needs to win ONE more round and last another round (fight 1 ending in the 11th) and he wins. He might find it rough down the stretch of another tough bout but i think he hangs in there and bags a points win. The wild Card is Tonys eye, as u mention Miguel has the power and weaponry to really test it. We shall see.... COTTO ON POINTS - TAKING BETS OF ALL SIZES :boxing:

Margarito got knocked out by the ghost of Shane, took a long layoff, looked horrible against a bum in Mexico, and then was basically almost killed in the ring against Manny. I dont think he has anything close to enough left to beat Cotto.

Really? After watching that fight it made me feel that if Margarito had anything left he would son Cotto once again. that sums it up.. cotto can outbox margo but margo is too tough and don't fold under pressure.

Really? After watching that fight it made me feel that if Margarito had anything left he would son Cotto once again.

He beat Mayorga...but I didn't think he looked good at all in doing so...and Mayorga is a guy who is used to make the other guy look good. Mayorga actually looked pretty good considering how bad he has been looking in recent years. I say Margarito by KO in the late rounds.

You only say this cause Cotto is a Rican. Who...me? Nah, man. I give credit where credit is due. I give Margarito credit for beating Cotto in the first fight just as I gave credit to Segura for beating Calderón, Arce for beating Vásquez, and Salido beating Juanma. In fact, I even beared an embarrassing avatar with a naked Ricky Martin after Arce beat Vasquez because of a bet I lost (for all those that remember). Don't group me up with troll posters and alternate accounts, 'cause that's not the case here. I'm a big Cotto fan who's emphasizing Cotto's advantages going into this fight. I also understand that Margarito has his strengths, but in my opinion...he has more going for him than Margarito. Of course, this is a forum so...feel free to disagree. I've already stated my case. :)

if this were a movie, the good guy(cotto) gets revenge and beats the bad guy(margarito) in a dramatic fashion & retires in front of his hometown crowd with his wife and children beside him.... this ain't a movie. :boxing:

I've asked this before. Has a fighter ever taken a sustained beating (like Margo did vs Pac) and comeback without a tune-up to beat a top fighter? Toss a year layoff in there. I can't find a past example. Can you TS? Hmm cant think of anyone myself. Not only does he have that going against him but also excluding his fight with Roberto Garcia, he has had a string of very physically brutal fights, Lets start with the Clottey fight, he took a lot of punishment until Clottey broke his hands In the Paul Williams fight Tony ate punches like sandwiches, over 240 sandwiches Against Cotto he took an unbelievable amount of punishment 280 total punches. He even referenced not having enough time to recoup as a reason Mosley stopped him Shane Mosley finished the job Cotto started cracking him for 178 total punches Manny Pac oh my he blasted Antonio for 474 punches, power punches accounted for 411 of that So i would venture to say Margarito's trainers should be very careful how much punishment they allow him to take in this fight, once an egg is scrambled there aint no unscrambling it.

Why do you think I laughed? Foreman is a joke with no power (Reason why Cotto fought him besides the belt). He still won after getting into a war. Specially the way he got knocked out, those are the ones that threaten your life. Marco Antonio Rubio? You can see that as a yes or no type of thing. Foreman after getting beat down by Ali and beating Lyle in one of my all time greatest fights. Now what else are you fools going to come up with? Are you retarded? I remember when before the Foreman fight with Cotto everybody was saying how Foreman was going to pound Cotto's head in and send him off into retirement. Sure now you can say Foreman sucks after he lost his last 2 fights but people weren't saying that before the fight. They were pushing for a Foreman/Miss pacman fight and Manny said Foreman was to tall but then goes and fights a tall Margicheato, so Cotto stepped up and fought him. Saying Cotto only fought him because he's a joke with no power is nonsense, Power isn't shlt in boxing.

Cotto already tried to outbox and out speed Tony. He got his **** pushed in. I expect more of the same simply because Margarito just has his number. Nothing scientific about it. It happens in boxing.

Actually I have to say that Marga took 3 pretty good beatings... often it gets lost how Cotto beat him up as well... just look at the beginning of the fight around Marga's eyes... and then look in the end... was very swollen... Cotto hit him with some good stuff... Mosley must have hit him with about 30 straight right hands with full power and about the Pacquiao beating we don't even have to talk... his defense is his chin and IDK what is left from it... it wasn't just one punch KO it were beatings/hard shots over at least 8 rounds... And like I said without broken nose after two rounds and loaded wraps I don't see him pushing Cotto as hard as he did before... but Cotto also has left a lot in the ring... so we will see

Jose Luis Castillo? Kelly Pavlik? Cotto vs Yuri Foreman? :rofl: Okay, I'll give you Cotto vs. Foreman...but don't downgrade that win in the future then. As for Pavlik and Castillo? Castillo in the rematch with Corrales? He didn't even make weight. Off by 3.5 pounds and Corrales decided to go on with the show. You can't give Castillo full credit for that, can you? Pavlik? In what fight did he come back after a "sustained beating" (without a tune-up) to beat a top fighter? Alfonso López?...Was he really that high in the rankings at the time? I'm seriously asking, not instigating by the way... :boxing:

I agree with every single one of your points. BTW I don't know the details of the contract but I expect the ring to be the biggest possible giving Cotto the advantage in the later rounds. I expect Cotto to fight mostly in the center of the ring behind his jab who is IMO his best punch and the second best Jab behind Wladimir. I agree. His jab is really stiff and powerful. People overlook his jab a lot. Who the hell knocks down Clottey...with a JAB? And about the ring...I'm not sure. But if it's a big ring...Margarito's chances take a hit. Margarito has NO POWER without plasters we seen that against Mosley Garcia and Pacquiao this is going to be a UD for Cotto As I said before, I'm not touching the plaster subject because it would make me look like I'm saying that Margarito won ONLY because of that. The fact is, we can speculate, but NOT without a shred of doubt. The writing's on the wall, but it hasn't been proven 100%. And in any case, I wouldn't say Margarito has absolutely no power. He was able to rock Pacquiao's head back a few times and even stunned him severely with a crippling body shot in round 6. Margarito also had a good rally where he connected three or four uppercuts to Manny's body in round 8. If Margarito didn't have power, he wouldn't have done that...and Cotto would be saying, "He has no power, I'm going to bumrush him..." Naaaaaaaaaaaaaah. I wouldn't go so far as to say Margarito's featherfisted. His power is there, it's just that it's overlooked because a-) Mosley's punches were MUCH, MUCH more impressive and b-) Whenever Margarito connected, Pacquiao would come back with flashy combinations of his own I've asked this before. Has a fighter ever taken a sustained beating (like Margo did vs Pac) and comeback without a tune-up to beat a top fighter? Toss a year layoff in there. I can't find a past example. Can you TS? No, I really can't. Good observation and interesting way of looking at this situation. I personally lean towards Cotto because minus broken nose and loaded wraps (IMO) Cotto would have had a good chance of beating Maragarito in the first fight... On the other note Cotto wasn't the same fighter anymore and Margarito isn't skilled but he will forces you to bring the fighter... I think Cotto has a pretty good time for the first 4 rounds... but starting at the latest with the 6th round Cotto will have to be a fighter and IDK if Cotto has 7 rounds of fighter in him left - he can survive the rounds no doubt and will... but is he competive enough in the last 7 rounds is the question... And this time Cotto has to get to the body of Margarito... in the first fight it was only head punches... and with that you won't hurt Margarito or stop him from coming... body punches hurt him Yes, body punches DO hurt him. Margarito was stunned in the 1st round from a Mosley right hand to the body and in the fourth round from a left hook to the body by Manny Pacquiao. It's not easy to catch Margarito downstairs but somebody should hack away there. Because if his chin is still at 100%, he's not moving even if you hit him with a missile.

I'm sitting here watching Cotto/Mayorga and seeing Cotto with snapping punches, a ramming left jab, and a sharp left hook. Did he take punches from Mayorga? Of course, he doesn't have the best defense in the world AND Mayorga is a fairly awkward fighter that gives a lot of people fits because of how unconventional he is with his attack patterns. Hell, judging from the first FOUR ROUNDS in Mosley/Mayorga, you would've thought that it was going to be a little rough between him and Mosley down the stretch. Mayorga isn't a downright horrible fighter, he's just not elite, but awkward enough to not allow you to go all-out on him. Hell, the only guy in the last ten years to dispatch Mayorga without ANY trouble was Oscar de la Hoya because even Tito took some punches in his TKO victory. So let's cut Cotto some slack... I'm fairly certain you all guys know who I am by now and how I try to be respectful and keep things in perspective. I've been debating about Cotto/Margarito II for the last few days with people over here and casual fans (those that only tune in to watch PPV fights) see as Cotto going into a fight to take an utter beating at the hands of Antonio Margarito. And while I could see Margarito's pressure style giving Cotto fits, I can't bring myself to BELIEVE Margarito will win again. You don't have to agree, but consider the following points: 1-) Ever since Cotto and Margarito fought, Cotto's record has been 4-1 (3KO's) while Margarito's has been 1-2 (0 KO's). 2-) Cotto has an underrated jab and a solid left hook, which will land on Margarito's affected eye. 3-) Their fight was fairly even. You can't look at that first fight and say Margarito was putting a beatdown on him since round 1. This wasn't Jones, Jr./Toney or B-Hop/Pavlik, Cotto was actually in the fight. He simply made mistakes that must be fixed, which are to stay from the ropes and clinch. 4-) Cotto is NOT Ricky Hatton and Margarito is not Pacquiao. In other words, he CAN take punishment and Margarito isn't knocking Cotto out like some people believe. Cotto is susceptible to punches (and he WILL get tagged) but Margarito needs time to knock you out. And to be honest, if you are going in there against the first man to beat you (by TKO) and the fight has a PR-Mexican rivalry background, and you are FIGHTING in your hometown, there is NO way Cotto will allow himself to go down again and give Margarito the TKO victory. If the going gets tough, all Cotto has to do is get on his bike and reach the bell and recover. Cotto's going to reach the final bell even if he is taking a beating, he won't quit again. That's why this is going to be intriguing should he begin to take a lot of punishment, Cotto won't quit even if his body is begging him for air and although this might sound like a downfall, consider the following point... 5-) They are fighting in Madison Square Garden, Cotto's adopted home. This means that Cotto can throw a seven punch combination, land only two punches, and people will be cheering even over that. Like it or not, that will influence judges. If there are ANY close rounds, you KNOW who they're going to give them to. 6-) In the worst case scenario, the politics of boxing will be in play. Even if Margarito does enough to WARRANT a victory in a rousing slugfest, the judges will give it to Cotto in order to set up a trilogy, which in the end, means more money for Bob. The two questions regarding Margarito: a-) After his battles with Cotto, Mosley, and Pacquiao, will Margarito's chin FINALLY show deterioration. Sooner or later, it dissolves, doesn't it? Considering his fighting style and the fact that he's been fighting since he was 15 years old and he's now 33, that's a lot of punishment to take over an 18 year career. b-) After that nasty eye injury against Pacquiao, will Margarito's socket keep itself intact or will a cut open up allowing Cotto to take advantage of it? Guys, agree, disagree, debate! :boxing: Also, I'm taking bets on this fight! 2:1 odds with Cotto...feel free to PM me! I personally lean towards Cotto because minus broken nose and loaded wraps (IMO) Cotto would have had a good chance of beating Maragarito in the first fight... On the other note Cotto wasn't the same fighter anymore and Margarito isn't skilled but he will forces you to bring the fighter... I think Cotto has a pretty good time for the first 4 rounds... but starting at the latest with the 6th round Cotto will have to be a fighter and IDK if Cotto has 7 rounds of fighter in him left - he can survive the rounds no doubt and will... but is he competive enough in the last 7 rounds is the question... And this time Cotto has to get to the body of Margarito... in the first fight it was only head punches... and with that you won't hurt Margarito or stop him from coming... body punches hurt him

Margicheato is a pressure fighter and not a boxer. Steward will prepare Cotto for this as we know because Steward knows that is cheato's game, to put pressure. Cotto will work the body and throw more left hooks. In the end Cotto will be the winner.

I've asked this before. Has a fighter ever taken a sustained beating (like Margo did vs Pac) and comeback without a tune-up to beat a top fighter? Toss a year layoff in there. I can't find a past example. Can you TS?

I agree with every single one of your points. BTW I don't know the details of the contract but I expect the ring to be the biggest possible giving Cotto the advantage in the later rounds. I expect Cotto to fight mostly in the center of the ring behind his jab who is IMO his best punch and the second best Jab behind Wladimir. If Cotto would use less leg movement, learn to clinch, and as you stated stick behind the jab I think his chances of pulling it off are great. The problem is (and always has been) his stamina in the championship rounds. I am just interested to see what BOTH fighters have left after the beatings they took from one another as well as from Pac (Margarito getting it worse).

Margarito has NO POWER without plasters we seen that against Mosley Garcia and Pacquiao this is going to be a UD for Cotto